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re: Texas people: ERCOT warning

Posted on 5/15/22 at 6:14 am to
Posted by Palmetto98
Where the stars are big and bright
Member since Nov 2021
2145 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 6:14 am to
quote:

You do you, hoss, but if everybody has your attitude the grid will overload and you'll all be sweating in the dark.


Sounds like you belong on Reddit
Posted by billjamin
Houston
Member since Jun 2019
13577 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 8:29 am to
quote:

If you did a root cause analysis on grid (lack of) reliability, it comes down poor choices made in generation sources. You can spin shite however you want, but that's the truth.

I don’t need to do one. Because I have a copy of the RCA commissioned by ERCOT after the ice storms last year. The single issue is a lack of winterization. You have no fricking clue what you’re talking about.
This post was edited on 5/15/22 at 9:59 am
Posted by billjamin
Houston
Member since Jun 2019
13577 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 8:41 am to
quote:

Crypto mines aren't just coming in and drawing power off the grid wily nily. They are contracting with power producers to increase their long-term capacity and investing money to help these producers ramp up.

And in many cases, in Texas at least, JVs with renewable company’s to take significance portions of wind and solar to supply. I just closed one for nextrerra that’s taking most of one of their wind farms. They placed the units right next to their substation so they can tie in upstream of their interconnection.
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
36652 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 8:45 am to
quote:

I thought brown outs from heat was just a communist state problem… hmmm


It used to be. Sadly, California is sending their communists to other states en masse.
Posted by Thecoz
Member since Dec 2018
2874 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 8:51 am to
“It's the unpredicted demand increases, like this heat or a big freeze, where power suppliers can't keep up”

I am happy to help if possible then..

The problem in texas is our plants experience outages .. and imo they are due to poor maintenance and contingency planning by the operators and regulations from our state government..

During the big freeze the power outages across the state were due to power sources being inoperable… most did.. gas ..wind…. they all failed because non of them had contingency plans to operate in the extreme temperatures… that is poor management..

we have studied this for years and years and there are/were definitive recommendations proposed to our government for years… they did not follow through on them..
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
36652 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 9:16 am to
quote:

It's the unpredicted demand increases, like this heat or a big freeze, where power suppliers can't keep up. And they can't keep excess capacity online for these unpredicted events since that would cut into their bottom line.


With the heat this makes sense.

However, with the big freeze, there were regulatory issues iirc.

In short, the energy companies weren’t able to prepare for the freeze without incurring MASSIVE fines from Biden’s EPA (permission was needed and slow played).

I said at the time Abbot should have stepped in directly and told the EPA to frick off. He royally screwed up if I am remembering the details correctly. Lastly, Ted Cruz showed his true colors in that event as well. Cruz = RINO.
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
36652 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 9:19 am to
quote:

During the big freeze the power outages across the state were due to power sources being inoperable… most did.. gas ..wind…. they all failed because non of them had contingency plans to operate in the extreme temperatures… that is poor management..


This was true to a large extent, however, weren’t there issues with a request to ramp up energy production that was EVENTUALLY approved by the EPA, but only AFTER it was too late to actually implement those measures?
This post was edited on 5/15/22 at 9:20 am
Posted by jbgleason
Bailed out of BTR to God's Country
Member since Mar 2012
19182 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 9:20 am to
quote:

Biden's America.* *Remember when shite like hurricanes and solar flares were Trumps fault? Well now it's Sleepy Joe's turn.


Texas has a completely independent power
grid that isn’t connected to any other state or federal system.

Not surprising, but you have no idea what you're talking about. ERCOT has been shitting the bed for years as the population of TX increases.


You are so dumb you don't get my comment at all. It's NOT Biden's fault but if Trump were in office he would get blamed. Just like hurricanes and solar flares aren't anyone's fault. Look past your Progressive overlords and read the post again loser.

quote:

Kindly shut the frick up.


Kindly frick off.
Posted by CrappyPants
Member since Apr 2021
770 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 9:24 am to
Hey ErcoT. Kiss my big fat white pimply arse
Posted by Tempratt
Member since Oct 2013
13978 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 9:30 am to
I have a novel idea. INVEST IN INFRASTRUCTURE UPGRADES!!

This is the 21st century.
Posted by billjamin
Houston
Member since Jun 2019
13577 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:03 am to
quote:

This was true to a large extent, however, weren’t there issues with a request to ramp up energy production that was EVENTUALLY approved by the EPA, but only AFTER it was too late to actually implement those measures?

It didn’t have any impact. There are several ways to get around that including an order from the governor. Also, I think it was approved within hours of request. The issue was units freezing up. Well heads, transfer pumps, cooling pumps, turbines, modules, etc. Every gen type lost some production due to freezing..
Posted by AllDayEveryDay
Nawf Tejas
Member since Jun 2015
7703 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:19 am to
Just came to say; I've already done several RRC audits on field winterization plans. Our TCEQ rep took on the director role for the RRC and is hiring something like 170 employees for his region specifically for winterization tracking from producer to plant to cogen.

The failure was that producers couldn't keep gas supply up, or shut in wells that needed to stay flowing. That caused field compression to go down on low flow, and once the lube oil cools down; in negative temperatures, it's not warming back up enough to restart the compressor. That prevents transfer to fractionators, interrupting supply to energy generation facilities.
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
36652 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:29 am to
quote:

It didn’t have any impact. There are several ways to get around that including an order from the governor.


I stated as much. Abbot totally shite the bed.

However, you didn’t address the MASSIVE fines that the energy companies were afraid of 10’s of million and then some). Money, like as not, was a factor.

quote:

Also, I think it was approved within hours of request.


Like 24 of them? This was at a time when minutes mattered. It was either intentionally slow played, or incompetence on a horrific scale (or both). You are minimizing the circumstances.

quote:

The issue was units freezing up. Well heads, transfer pumps, cooling pumps, turbines, modules, etc. Every gen type lost some production due to freezing..


Which is why time was of the essence.

A lot of people suffered as a result of poor decisions...starting with Biden’s EPA, Abbots lack of intestinal fortitude, ERCOT’s fear of fines, and Cruz’s disappearing act (or rather...that of his vacationing family).
Posted by jimmy the leg
Member since Aug 2007
36652 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:36 am to
quote:

The failure was that producers couldn't keep gas supply up


Iirc, they requested to increase the supply because they knew that there were going to be issues (especially with a sizable portion of the grid pulling power from “green energy sources”) but needed permission to do so (permission that was given after it was too late).

quote:

That caused field compression to go down on low flow, and once the lube oil cools down; in negative temperatures, it's not warming back up enough to restart the compressor. That prevents transfer to fractionators, interrupting supply to energy generation facilities.


The technical description of the issues that occurred (beyond my capacity to relay).

Posted by billjamin
Houston
Member since Jun 2019
13577 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:37 am to
if you say so. It was addressed in the AAR and was a nothing burger.
quote:

Like 24 of them?

This is wrong. The request wasn’t time stamped but the notification to market participants of request and to begin ramp up prep was sent a 2/14 17:58. The DOE approval came in at 2/14 19:41.
This post was edited on 5/15/22 at 10:43 am
Posted by Chucktown_Badger
The banks of the Ashley River
Member since May 2013
32173 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:55 am to
quote:

wind turned have de-thawed


So, frozen?
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
266204 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:56 am to
quote:

Now if Texas was part of the national grid,


Where did this myth come from?
Posted by LongueCarabine
Pointe Aux Pins, LA
Member since Jan 2011
8205 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 10:58 am to
I thought all the wind turbines were going to solve this problem?
Posted by lostinbr
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2017
10503 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 12:13 pm to
quote:

In short, the energy companies weren’t able to prepare for the freeze without incurring MASSIVE fines from Biden’s EPA (permission was needed and slow played).

I would like to know where you’re getting this. The freeze occurred less than a month after Biden’s inauguration. Are you saying generators were starting to winterize their facilities in late January?

Winterization of power plants really isn’t all that complicated. The vast majority of cold weather trips occur due to instrumentation problems. Example: impulse tube on a boiler pressure transmitter freezes, causing an incorrect pressure reading and the boiler trips on a pressure safety high.

Preventing this is relatively simple. You identify critical instruments, and you heat trace/insulate them. You can install pre-traced/pre-insulated tubing bundles or you can add heat tracing and insulation to the existing instrument tubing. For manifolds/transmitters you install either insulation blankets or hard-shell enclosures.

These are not difficult fixes, nor are they particularly costly. Instrument winterization is standard practice in most US climates. The problem is that the power industry is notoriously cheap and plants tend to not prepare for contingencies unless there is a clear regulatory requirement. When you look at refineries, chemical plants, and power plants, power plants are almost always at the bottom in terms of developing robust systems.

I used to chalk this up as a consequence of the way power plants are regulated - since public utilities commissions often have to approve spend/rate increases, my theory was that restriction in the market led to this “cheapness.” However, the situation in Texas kind of indicates otherwise. The fact that the same problems occur in a “deregulated” market points to this being more of a systemic problem in the industry. Plants simply don’t think the cost of improving reliability outweighs the risk of downtime.

The natural gas production shortages during the freeze are a bit of a different topic. But as I understand it, many of the wells and gathering facilities didn’t have major problems until they started losing power.

In any case, I’m not sure what the EPA has to do with it. Maybe there’s something I’m missing.
Posted by White Bear
Yonnygo
Member since Jul 2014
15009 posts
Posted on 5/15/22 at 12:18 pm to
Turns out wind farm tax credits dont generate much power. Who new?
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