re: Southern Baptist Convention: IVF is a sin

You sound like you’re in need of serious mental help.

Pride87 must’ve gone to sleep early tonight.

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Who created this doctrine? And who voted in the Southern Baptist Convention? And who is responsible for all of the 3000 different denominational sects of Christian theology today. Flawed humans. That think they know better or are close to God. Well intentioned, but do more harm than good.

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I’m with you baw. I think it’s funny as hell the True Catholics will go on and on and on about natural law and God’s will and shite as if all of this stuff wasn’t fricking made up by man within the last 100 or so years.

frick nature nature a ho

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2) you’re ignorant to what goes on during IVF and the number of babies destroyed to get one to birth.

Sounds like you are the ignorant one Let the people who have actually been through the process tell you otherwise

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I’ll go. Tried multiple routes for years to conceive but nothing worked, due to my wife’s endometriosis. By the time we got to our last shot, IVF, she only had half of one ovary. They harvested 12 eggs. 6 were worthless, so they fertilized the other 6. We planned on putting two in at a time and saving any left for later chances if we needed them, or hopefully for siblings. 3 of the 6 never developed, which is about the same percentage as happens in nature to fertilized eggs. They were not destroyed, they just never grew. 2 of the remaining 3 were great, one was lagging in its development and wouldn’t survive freezing, so we risked triplets and put it in too. Of the 12 originally harvested eggs, one is sitting besides me now watching stranger things. None were treated as you SBCers assume. At all. We were lucky enough to be able to use science to work around a health issue. And I feel the chemo/cancer analogy particularly apt.

And as an epilogue, the cruel thing about endo is that it prevents pregnancy, but having one can cure it. If God sought to punish us for any sin, the fact that the first being born allowed us to be blessed with a second naturally, by complete surprise, sure seems like an odd way to do it

On the one hand, your religion can believe whatever you want, and for the most part, I’ll respect it, even if I disagree. The main problem with this shite is that you don’t have to look around hard and long to see that’s not the way the most religious tend to work these days, and they sure seem hell bent on making everyone bend to their ideas. If they kept their beliefs out of national politics, no one would care. But they can’t stop themselves.

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Where in our Father God's creation (Mother Nature) do you see IVF?

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Without taking a position on the issue, this reasoning can be used selectively to allow or condemn a whole multitude of things. Technology has introduced many things we don’t see “in God’s creation.”

What if a couple suffered an illness (cancer for instance) or other medical issue that rendered them infertile? Is there a bright line prohibition against using technology to procreate? What about any other medical procedure we don’t see in nature? What about a life flight helicopter?

We have to move to a conception analysis, assuming the basic pro-life stance. Is fertilization without implantation or even insertion into the female body actually “conception”?

This is all in the context of a married couple attempting IVF for their own procreative endeavors. Not selling to the gheys.

Also there are some orgs that do IVF only one egg at a time. So you’d pretermit the conception issue.

I have two beautiful smart boys from IVF (all my wife’s and my genes) so I guess I’m biased. Cancer destroyed any hope I had “naturally” to be fruitful and multiply.

Edit: just for some more context, we had been trying for a long time to have kids and then I was diagnosed with stage iv cancer. The treatment was to render me infertile or with high risk of genetic disorders with offspring.

So before treatment we froze sperm. Prayed, reflected, analyzed, did some serious ethical rumination. And paid an assload of money to make more civilized white kids. (:

Some people lack the ability and imagination to try to understand another’s struggles. And can’t put themselves in another’s shoes, which I have always found ironic coming from purportedly devout Christians. Especially when most of them would quickly change their opinions if they found themselves in the same place as those they condemn. Glad to hear it worked for you.

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Where in our Father God's creation (Mother Nature) do you see IVF?

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In the doctors and scientists who got the process to become viable. In the creation of the eggs. In the viability of the sperm. In the fact that the egg was able to be fertilized. In the fact that the fertilized egg grew normally. In the fact that the egg was then viably implanted. In the fact that the implanted egg grew into a fetus. In the fact that the fetus grew into a baby. In my son every day when I look at him.

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This is as unnnatural as all the other stuff we all admonish in this, the month of Jun

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I say this with no respect at all, you are a bumbling retard who can get fricked.

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I say this with no respect at all, you are a bumbling retard who can get fricked.

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You are 100% correct which is why the Young and Restless North Dallas Tiger is about to log out, but not before I give a friendly shout out to the mother fricking bitch arse Boston fricking Celtics for beating some Mavericks arse and totally embarassing Luka and Kyrie and that whole bitch arse squad - frick em all.

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The power of creation is sacred.

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Cooking my mother’s gumbo is sacred. A dr doing science shite ain’t sacred.