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Started By
Message
re: Russia massing forces close to Ukraine
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:56 am to Jim Rockford
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:56 am to Jim Rockford
Trucks or military equipment/soldiers?
1
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:57 am to Spaceman Spiff
An army can't move without trucks.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:58 am to Jim Rockford
quote:
It's questionable whether Russia could pull it off. During last summer's Siberian forest fires, Russia had to let them burn out of control because all its trucks were tied up in its very limited Ukraine operation.
The documentary I mentioned previously was interesting because it highlighted how fricked the Russian command was. Seems like most of the officers mentioned were drunks with no real goals or motivation other than plundering everything they could.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:59 am to Darth_Vader
I just read a book in which the Russian government aligns with the Russian mob to inundate Ukraine with 1000's of fake citizens that are pro-russia.
They use the mob goons to cause turmoil blaming the current Ukraine govt for atrocities that were actually carried out by the mob. This ultimately leads to Russian military intervention "To bring peace and stability back to Ukraine"
I found it to be a very plausible situation
They use the mob goons to cause turmoil blaming the current Ukraine govt for atrocities that were actually carried out by the mob. This ultimately leads to Russian military intervention "To bring peace and stability back to Ukraine"
I found it to be a very plausible situation
Posted on 8/17/16 at 11:59 am to Spaceman Spiff
quote:
Maybe he feels that since Trump wants to rebuild the military that the apple is ripe for picking now, given how much this administration screwed it up.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:00 pm to Darth_Vader
What would stop them? Obama? LOL
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:00 pm to Steadyhands
quote:
Why should we try and stop this?
Well, it's a bit complicated. And I'm not so sure we should try to stop them, even if we could. (which we can't).
On the one hand there's the matter of Ukraine being historically part of Russia. Imagine if back in the 90's the US had lost the Cold War instead of the USSR. Following the collapse of the US, imagine Texas leaves the union and forms it's own country. Fast forward to today and imagine the US has rebuilt and rearmed and is massing forces getting ready to invade and reclaim Texas. That's kinda what's going on between Russia and Ukraine right now.
But on the other hand, if Russia did once again get their hands on Ukraine, this would give them massive amounts of a laundry list of natural resources and farmlands, which to Russia is a paramount concern. In addition to this, if Russia is allowed to retake Ukraine, this will mean once again Russia will be knocking on the door of the Balkans which would in and of itself lead to further complications.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:02 pm to Darth_Vader
Russia always advances during the Olympics.
I remember when the "Georgia" advance happened during China Olympics.
I remember when the "Georgia" advance happened during China Olympics.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:04 pm to rantfan
quote:
What is his love with the Ukraine, is it a monetary deal or they have natural resources he wants?
Yes. Ukraine was Imperial Russia and the USSR's breadbasket. It is where the fertile farmland is. It was also home to a great deal of the USSR's industrial capacity.
That AND it (along with the Baltic countries and Belarus) is a land buffer that protects Moscow & St. Pete's, Volograd, Rostov etc. from land invasion along with protecting the Crimean Peninsula and the naval base there.
If I were Putin, I'd take it back. It would be like the US allowing an independent Texas to exist that has an alliance with a communist, nuclear-armed Mexico. The US would want Texas back because it traditionally belongs to the US, it has huge economic importance, and in that scenario, like Ukraine, it's f'd up that it is signing military alliances with a geopolitical foe.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:13 pm to Darth_Vader
quote:
imagine Texas leaves the union and forms it's own country.
HELL YEAH!!!!!! YEEHAW!!!!!!
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:18 pm to Darth_Vader
quote:
But on the other hand, if Russia did once again get their hands on Ukraine, this would give them massive amounts of a laundry list of natural resources and farmlands, which to Russia is a paramount concern. In addition to this, if Russia is allowed to retake Ukraine, this will mean once again Russia will be knocking on the door of the Balkans which would in and of itself lead to further complications.
Realistically, no one could stop them. The resources in the Ukraine would most certainly help to strengthen Russia. How bold do they get?
Question, Darth. What do think happens is they move and take the Balkans?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:29 pm to Darth_Vader
Personally, Im surprised they havent already.. Whos going to stop them. Who is going to back the Ukraine against a full Russian force? Doesnt mean it would be easy, the west is not pro Russian and would put up a fight.
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 12:31 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:30 pm to Spaceman Spiff
quote:
Question, Darth. What do think happens is they move and take the Balkans?
Well, look at this map...
... This map means if Russia invades the Balkans, we, as in the United States of America, will be treaty bound to go to war against Russia to defend our NATO allies.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:31 pm to Spaceman Spiff
Shouldn't leave out the point that the coup in Ukraine from Russian eyes was viewed as an aggression and bringing nato to Russia's doorstep. McCain and nuland were protesting in the streets of Kiev. Imagine Chinese politicians with a military alliance with Central America against the USA protesting in Mexico City to overthrow an elected, albeit corrupt, government.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:47 pm to Spaceman Spiff
quote:
I also wonder if he is doing this before the up-coming elections. Maybe he feels that since Trump wants to rebuild the military that the apple is ripe for picking now,
Trump is already slobbering all over Putin's knob and he's not even president yet. If the U.S. election has any impact on Putin's timing for an attack (and I doubt that it will), it will probably be to postpone the attack until after the election to see who wins. If it's Hillary, he'll be in pretty much the same position as now; it's risky but he can probably get away with it. If it's Trump, he's in even better shape. He can invade and have Trump cheering him on.
If he even cares who wins the election, which he very well may not, he may figure that if he invades now, he risks having his puppy dog look silly before the election for being so googly-eyed over him. On the other hand, it may be that if he has a preference, he prefers an America he can frame as an enemy but doesn't have to worry too much about (i.e. Hillary wins) rather than an America that falls all over itself to suck his dick (i.e. Trump wins), in which case it wouldn't be as easy to frame us as a sinister enemy. Either way, he can pretty much do whatever he wants.
But, more likely, as I said, the U.S. election probably isn't much of a factor in his decision whether and when to invade.
This post was edited on 8/17/16 at 12:48 pm
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:50 pm to upgrayedd
You definitely don't want to call a Ukranian a Russian. Even though they look a like, sound a like, and act like assholes it's basically calling them the "N" word.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:51 pm to Nuts4LSU
quote:
If it's Hillary, he'll be in pretty much the same position as now; it's risky but he can probably get away with it. If it's Trump, he's in even better shape. He can invade and have Trump cheering him on.
Who wins the elections will have little to no impact on Putin regarding Ukraine. He is fully aware there is absolutely nothing we can do to stop him from gobbling up the entirety of Ukraine if he so chooses. Who sits behind the Resolute Desk in January 2017 will do nothing to change this fact.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:51 pm to Darth_Vader
On your map, Finland and Sweden look sorta pornographic.
Posted on 8/17/16 at 12:53 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
On your map, Finland and Sweden look sorta pornographic.
Be honest. You've already fapped to it haven't you?
Posted on 8/17/16 at 1:06 pm to Darth_Vader
So basically Barrack is going to have to back off on his comments about Trump saying we no longer need NATO? Trump got his balls kicked pretty hard for that..and then we don't answer the call when a NATO ally actually needs our help? Bold strategy Cotton...
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