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re: Outside Counsel (lawyers) billing for service is so ridiculous

Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:21 am to
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:21 am to
quote:

That sounds like a startlingly ignorant CEO with no grasp of his field


It was in early growth of the company. CEO was the founder.
Posted by Dixie Normus
Earth
Member since Sep 2013
2844 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:21 am to
This is standard biglaw practice. Try someone local or move your files to someone else.
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:25 am to
quote:

Where did you read this made up story? Or was it in a movie?


It’s embellished a little. But it’s basically true.

I also had a buddy go to work for a DA as a baby lawyer. This was in a rural parish

His first case involved a warrantless search that was an obvious 4th amendment violation

He pointed that out to the DA. The response?

“Son, let me tell you how we look at that 4th amendment here. If they hadn’t been doing them drugs, they wouldn’t need them rights.”
Posted by JohnnyKilroy
Cajun Navy Vice Admiral
Member since Oct 2012
40212 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:28 am to
quote:

A buddy of mine went in-house with a service company years ago.

First day on the job, the CEO walks in with this incredibly complex regulatory question.

My boy says, “I’ll look at it and get back to you.”

His response was met with a startled stare. The CEO then said:

“Mike, we hired the caterer and they brought the food. We hired transport and they brought the truck. When we hired you, we thought you were bringing the law. Where is it?”


Damn that CEO sounds retarded.
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:29 am to
quote:

Yeah it sounds like something from a movie


This one does sound like it’s from a movie, but absolutely true:

Buddy of mine goes to work for a boutique in a major city.

The firm represented some very high net worth people.

His first assignment was a pre-nup. He was instructed to appear at the church on the day of the wedding with the document and to present it to the bride.

If she signed, he was to call the groom at his hotel, and he would come to the wedding. If she didn’t sign, he wasn’t coming.

The bride didn’t say a word when he explained it. She just signed.
This post was edited on 8/22/25 at 9:32 am
Posted by JohnnyKilroy
Cajun Navy Vice Admiral
Member since Oct 2012
40212 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:30 am to
quote:

Anybody else manage their companies outside counsel?

The scam (law firm they call it) they run is ludicrous. I can't tell you how many times I see a relatively "simple" question that they for sure already know the answer to turning into a 3+ hour billed topic and turn into a $1,800 answer. Because you know...the staff attorney has to review the email...then send it to the junior attorney to "research" and then his answer has to be sent back up the the staff attorney and then reviewed by the partner before sending it back and VOILA just like that all three guys got billable hours on the engagement. Crooks



What stopped you from doing the work yourself? Too lazy?
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:30 am to
quote:

Damn that CEO sounds retarded.


Brilliant at what he did. He was the founder. I think he sold out after a couple of more years.

Some of these baws can’t handle management after a certain growth point.
Posted by JohnnyKilroy
Cajun Navy Vice Admiral
Member since Oct 2012
40212 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:37 am to
quote:

His first assignment was a pre-nup. He was instructed to appear at the church on the day of the wedding with the document and to present it to the bride.

If she signed, he was to call the groom at his hotel, and he would come to the wedding. If she didn’t sign, he wasn’t coming.

The bride didn’t say a word when he explained it. She just signed.



That makes zero sense and no competent attorney would ever do such a thing.


What's the judge gonna say when the wife contests the pre-nup and she explains to the judge her shitbag husband presented her with a multipage legal document that presumably altered or waived her rights, remedies and benefits with virtually zero time to review or comment?


If the client requested that, it's the lawyers job to convince him otherwise. If they lawyers came up with that plan, they have no clue what they are doing.
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:39 am to
quote:

That makes zero sense and no competent attorney would ever do such a thing.


Maybe.

I am saying it happened. I’m not recommending it.
Posted by DownshiftAndFloorIt
Here
Member since Jan 2011
70952 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:42 am to
quote:

Some of these baws can’t handle management after a certain growth point.


There are lots of those kinds of CEOs in Louisiana. It might not be the best approach but that general attitude is lacking in management culture these days, IMO. It's good to have someone like that with some authority to keep the rest of the company grounded in what got them there in the first place.
Posted by NIH
Member since Aug 2008
119689 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 9:51 am to
Not sure about your specific scenario but I’ve run across a few general counsel that have a chip on their shoulder because they never stepped foot in a courtroom.
Posted by Mingo Was His NameO
Brooklyn
Member since Mar 2016
36598 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:54 am to
quote:

I am saying it happened.


And people with actual knowledge of the law are saying you’re making all this bullshite up
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:55 am to
quote:

And people with actual knowledge of the law are saying you’re making all this bullshite up


Brother, I am so old I helped Moses construe the Ten Commandments.

But you think what you want.
Posted by wesfau
Member since Mar 2023
1813 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:58 am to
quote:

I’ve run across a few general counsel that have a chip on their shoulder because they never stepped foot in a courtroom.


Must be outliers. Every in-house lawyer I know/knew (myself included) couldn't give a shite about ever setting foot in court. Happy to avoid all that bullshite for the most part.
Posted by Mingo Was His NameO
Brooklyn
Member since Mar 2016
36598 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 10:58 am to
quote:

Brother, I am so old I helped Moses construe the Ten Commandments.


No idea what this has to do with you being a liar
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:00 am to
quote:

No idea what this has to do with you being a liar


You seem angry.
Posted by RanchoLaPuerto
Jena
Member since Aug 2023
1799 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:02 am to
quote:

Every in-house lawyer I know/knew (myself included) couldn't give a shite about ever setting foot in court.


Some like it.

I always have someone in-house at trials. And there is always someone there when we do corporate reps. But you are largely right.
Posted by sidewalkside
rent free in yo head
Member since Sep 2021
4306 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:03 am to
I didn't pay for shite. As one of the other posters said we make billions I'm not fighting it. Approved. But i see the game they play buried into the 15 million of annual spend on outside counsel.
Posted by OceanMan
Member since Mar 2010
22670 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:04 am to
quote:

Consulting is the same way. I used to see if I could bill 4 hours to a client for 10 minutes worth of work all the time. Most of the time, they paid without questioning anything. Now I'm on the other side of the table, I can see through their invoices pretty easily, but I know the game, and my company makes billions, so who cares. Invoice approved.


Damn what a career you have had
Posted by wesfau
Member since Mar 2023
1813 posts
Posted on 8/22/25 at 11:07 am to
quote:

I always have someone in-house at trials. And there is always someone there when we do corporate reps


Yeah, in-house has its place in those settings...but generally they don't want to be lead or do any of the actual litigation shite.
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