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Message
re: Law school enrollments are falling off a cliff
Posted on 4/23/15 at 1:18 am to CorporateTiger
Posted on 4/23/15 at 1:18 am to CorporateTiger
It's all true. No need to lie. I agree it's a shitty life for most, but I'm just sharing what I've seen.
I don't know the whole story about his boss. All I know is he said that he was worried about performance review, but he might be switching firms soon so that could play into it. I honestly don't know.
I don't know the whole story about his boss. All I know is he said that he was worried about performance review, but he might be switching firms soon so that could play into it. I honestly don't know.
1
Posted on 4/23/15 at 4:51 am to Jim Rockford
This is like hearing about a new insecticide for roaches!
Posted on 4/23/15 at 5:49 am to McLemore
quote:This. Good lawyers are contract engineers. They prevent problems before they happen and create the mechanisms to handle the unintended consequences that develop.
I've become much more of a specialized business facilitator, obviously focusing on the legal implications of every aspect of every deal. And it's not just for prevention of litigation. It's to make shite work right generally.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 8:15 am to Jim Rockford
I had business partners that were lawyers ended up leaving to be in the small hardware/ nursery/ outdoor power equipment business.
One guy loved horticulture and only became a lawyer due to family pressure to become one. I knew when we started our first store he would do it fulltime. This was his calling he is good at it. He just seems happy all the time.
My other partner was a female attorney and when I first met her I was skeptical of why we made her a partner. She just didn't seem like a people person more like an introvert. She left the firm she worked at and is very good at working with customers. She even went back to school to study landscape design and horticulture. It's like night and day from when I first met her. She seems happier and is very outgoing when talking about plants.
Money wise now we do very well, but first few years I never understood why they left the legal field. Now I do see that they enjoy what they do.
One guy loved horticulture and only became a lawyer due to family pressure to become one. I knew when we started our first store he would do it fulltime. This was his calling he is good at it. He just seems happy all the time.
My other partner was a female attorney and when I first met her I was skeptical of why we made her a partner. She just didn't seem like a people person more like an introvert. She left the firm she worked at and is very good at working with customers. She even went back to school to study landscape design and horticulture. It's like night and day from when I first met her. She seems happier and is very outgoing when talking about plants.
Money wise now we do very well, but first few years I never understood why they left the legal field. Now I do see that they enjoy what they do.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:09 am to McLemore
quote:
i was thinking today how valuable a civil engineer with a law degree would be for one of my clients
Checking in, still finishing up the law degree though. Trying to find the niche for engineering background and law degree.
There are good law jobs out there, just do well in school and build a skill set. If you perform at the average level of an average law school you should not expect to get a great job. People have the perception that simply going to law school entitles you to $100k jobs upon graduation.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:14 am to Slippy
quote:
es, oversaturation of the market is one factor. But it's also because the business world is deliberately steering away from needing lawyers by proactively avoiding litigation. I have some of the same clients I had 10 years ago, but the number of files they are sending is now about 30% of what it was. And the lawyers they have, they don't pay.
Don't forget in-house and captured firms, flat fees and billing programs designed to cut fees by 15% or more.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:39 am to Jim Rockford
Frankly, if this gets rid of those unaccredited or borderline schools that have been hoodwinking the naive and ignorant fools that pay to go to school there, I'm all for it.
If it causes good universities that are already in financial straits thanks to their piss poor state governance to go under (read: LSU), then I will be saddened.
If it causes good universities that are already in financial straits thanks to their piss poor state governance to go under (read: LSU), then I will be saddened.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:47 am to Jim Rockford
good
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:50 am to Mung
In-house departments are going to grow substantially over the coming years. It makes much more sense to pay a salary rather than billable hours in most scenarios. Soon the bigger firms and companies are going to be farming low level legal work out to India and China too.
The Legal profession in the U.S. has really complicated couple of decades coming up.
The Legal profession in the U.S. has really complicated couple of decades coming up.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 9:51 am to Jim Rockford
Yep and many law schools will be raising tuition on those who do attend. For example, UW-Madison is hiking tuition for professional programs like J.D. and M.B.A. to help offset the budget gouging they are about to take.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:01 am to athenslife101
quote:
I agree it's a shitty life for most
Not really. Like anything else, it is primarily what YOU make of it.
The graduates of the future in the legal profession will be able to do quite well, if they make good choices and are willing to work.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:09 am to CorporateTiger
No doubt, but you lose all that trial lawyer training. Who's going to try all those cases once the plaintiff's Bar figures out the defense is clueless?
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:15 am to Bullfrog
quote:
This. Good lawyers are contract engineers. They prevent problems before they happen and create the mechanisms to handle the unintended consequences that develop.
And honestly, this is what I enjoy the most. I like solving problems before I get into a gigantic shite storm and have to do ridiculous feats of strength as part of a game everyone knows is a charade.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:16 am to Tornado Alley
quote:
Posted by Tornado Alley
Anyone here go solo or start a firm with a friend and care to share a summarization of your first couple of years of practice?
If I can't find anything after graduation (decent chance of finding gainful employment, but not great - I'd probably say around 33%), a buddy of mine and I are planning on starting a general practice firm in our hometown.
you have to be willing to do criminal and/or family law to generate cash flow while you hope to land some good personal injury cases. Don't spend money on fancy business cards, letterhead, books, westlaw. Get a laptop, a reliable printer, use fastcase. Don't spend money on ABA or other national organizations. Get involved with local bar associations. When you have nothing else to do, loiter around the courthouse and chat with people.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:16 am to biglego
quote:
When you have nothing else to do, loiter around the courthouse and chat with people.
This. Never be a stranger 
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:52 am to SabiDojo
Thanks for all the input 
I worked in bankruptcy last summer so I have a working knowledge of the substantive and procedural issues of 7s and 13s. He has been a personal injury/family law attorney for two years. Additionally, I took a class which focused on estate planning, will drafting, etc. so I have somewhat of a working knowledge on that front too.
I figured I'd have to do a lot of DUIs and divorces before we could really turn a profit. Good thing is that we're from a small town and we know everyone.
Do any of y'all use a flat fee for criminal defense? I don't know about the ethical rules right off the top of my head, but it seems pretty straightforward
I worked in bankruptcy last summer so I have a working knowledge of the substantive and procedural issues of 7s and 13s. He has been a personal injury/family law attorney for two years. Additionally, I took a class which focused on estate planning, will drafting, etc. so I have somewhat of a working knowledge on that front too.
I figured I'd have to do a lot of DUIs and divorces before we could really turn a profit. Good thing is that we're from a small town and we know everyone.
Do any of y'all use a flat fee for criminal defense? I don't know about the ethical rules right off the top of my head, but it seems pretty straightforward
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:54 am to Tornado Alley
quote:
I figured I'd have to do a lot of DUIs and divorces before we could really turn a profit.
Divorces, sure. DUI's, believe it or not, can be hard to come by. DUI lawyers do an incredible job of keeping a pretty good monopoly on it.
Make sure the bail bondsmen, the guards at courthouses, and the clerks/receptionists know who you are.
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:57 am to SabiDojo
Anyone who gets a DUI in our town (Bay St. Louis/Pass Christian) calls one lawyer and he handles it, so I know what you mean.
What area do you work in?
What area do you work in?
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:58 am to Tornado Alley
Jackson Metro
Posted on 4/23/15 at 10:59 am to SabiDojo
I tinkered with a "business plan" last fall, of sorts. The overhead for starting a law firm is not high. Anyone ever advertised through Google AdWords? I've heard that's an awesome way to get your name to potential clients.
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