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re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict
Posted on 7/26/23 at 11:07 am to doubleb
Posted on 7/26/23 at 11:07 am to doubleb
quote:
If things remain equal and neither side is able to dominate the other and gain territory, will Ukraine’s will to survive as a nation outlast Russia’s will to secure Ukraine?
Russia has a MIC and Ukraine does not, Ukraine can have all the will in the world but if this does not wrap up prior to the next US election cycle the gravy train will be derailed.
It is just the nature of our binary political system.
3
Posted on 7/26/23 at 11:13 am to WhereisAtlanta
quote:
Russia has a MIC and Ukraine does not, Ukraine can have all the will in the world but if this does not wrap up prior to the next US election cycle the gravy train will be derailed.
It is just the nature of our binary political system.
There isn't a presidential contender or congressional majority that will ever end that gravy train.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 11:16 am to WhereisAtlanta
Eh yes and no. The US will fund insurgencies and militants just so a budget doesn’t get cut at the end of the fiscal year.
The gumption to send tanks and shite might dwindle but the US can send javelins and M16s forever.
The gumption to send tanks and shite might dwindle but the US can send javelins and M16s forever.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 11:57 am to ColtRange
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:19 pm to Hateradedrink
quote:
Eh yes and no. The US will fund insurgencies and militants just so a budget doesn’t get cut at the end of the fiscal year.
The gumption to send tanks and shite might dwindle but the US can send javelins and M16s forever.
The reason Ukraine still exist is the money we have poured into their air defense, whenever we tire of shooting million dollar missiles at $200 drones is when they are fricked and Putin will bomb them into the stone age.
Nothing good for Ukraine comes from allowing this to go deeply into 2024.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:21 pm to WhereisAtlanta
Yeah that’s why this offensive is kind of all or nothing for Ukraine in my opinion.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:21 pm to WhereisAtlanta
quote:
Russia has a MIC and Ukraine does not, Ukraine can have all the will in the world but if this does not wrap up prior to the next US election cycle the gravy train will be derailed. It is just the nature of our binary political system.
It’s not that simple. Before the West sent major aid to Ukraine, they fought like hell and stopped Russia from taking Kiev.
Also the US is providing slightly half the aid to Ukraine. Europe could continue to help.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:23 pm to doubleb
quote:
Also the US is providing slightly half the aid to Ukraine. Europe could continue to help.
Western Europe will probably stop aid to Ukraine before the U.S. does.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:27 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Western Europe will probably stop aid to Ukraine before the U.S. does.
If that’s the case the aid will continue past our election.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:36 pm to Darth_Vader
quote:
Does the average Russian think they’re fighting for their freedom
Honestly the average Russian thinks they are fighting for ethnic Russians that Ukrainians were repressing. It'd be like Mexico invading the US because the US was marginalizing ethnic Mexicans in "historical" Mexican land (military might aside)
Posted on 7/26/23 at 12:58 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Western Europe will probably stop aid to Ukraine before the U.S. does.
Absolutely false. That's just a Russian wet dream.
There are several tiers to European support. In the top tier, you have the "Tallinn Group," who signed the Tallinn declaration before the February Ramstein meeting. These nations are all-in and view the conflict as existential for their own security.
The UK, the Netherlands, Denmark, Poland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Czechia, and Slovakia.
To that list should be added Finland and Sweden, who didn't sign when they weren't in NATO.
France, Germany, and Italy started the war in a much lower tier. Germany gave helmets to Ukraine. Macron talked with Putin every week. Etc.
That situation is radically different now. Macron openly tells other leaders that the complete defeat of Russia is now essential. Scholz has come around, and the replacement of Christine Lambrecht with Boris Pistorius has dramatically changed Germany's posture -- they are now giving as much as anyone. Finally, the election of Georgia Meloni as the Italian PM has turned Italy into a fierce advocate for Ukraine inside the EU.
There are certainly some nations such as Spain and Belgium who have contributed relatively small amounts, but the European trend is very much in the other direction -- just witness Bulgaria finally publicly donating armored vehicles to Ukraine last week for the first time.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 1:10 pm to GOP_Tiger
You are so naive. Western Europeans aren’t going to sacrifice their cushy entitlement structure to give tanks and bombs to Ukraine, they’re too selfish and spoiled for that, and Eastern Europe is going to eventually decide that they need to keep some of the bullets for themselves.
If Ukraine wins this war it will be on the back of the American taxpayer.
If Ukraine wins this war it will be on the back of the American taxpayer.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 1:23 pm to doubleb
quote:
If things remain equal and neither side is able to dominate the other and gain territory, will Ukraine’s will to survive as a nation outlast Russia’s will to secure Ukraine?
Ukrainians have the will to fight for reasons both immediate and deeply historical. I don't think that that well will ever run dry.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 1:30 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Western Europeans aren’t going to sacrifice their cushy entitlement structure to give tanks and bombs to Ukraine, they’re too selfish and spoiled for that, and Eastern Europe is going to eventually decide that they need to keep some of the bullets for themselves.
If Ukraine wins this war it will be on the back of the American taxpayer.
Ukraine has already fired about 125 Storm Shadow/SCALP missiles. And you should compare how many tanks they have currently sent to Ukraine compared to how many we have sent (hint: the ratio is currently infinite).
Posted on 7/26/23 at 1:33 pm to GOP_Tiger
That’s a well and good. When the citizens start feeling the crunch the aid will dry up. Hell, the French riot over not have 3 months of paid vacation. I doubt the UK has the capacity to build more than a dozen tanks a year. Italy is africa warlord level corrupt. I have zero faith in the them whatsoever.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 2:23 pm to WhereisAtlanta
Russia does not have the capability to bomb anyone into the Stone Age, conventionally.
Posted on 7/26/23 at 2:44 pm to Hateradedrink
Posted on 7/26/23 at 3:03 pm to GeauxxxTigers23
quote:
Italy is africa warlord level corrupt.
Woah, Woah, lets not get crazy, They got Giorgia !!! I think I love her!!
Posted on 7/26/23 at 3:06 pm to Pfft
Looks like todays score is Russia 3, UKR 0
Not good
Not good
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