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re: Estate Tax Insurance

Posted on 10/16/18 at 9:33 pm to
Posted by boosiebadazz
Member since Feb 2008
84558 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 9:33 pm to
Yeah, I refer folks out all the time because I don’t frick with trusts and any estate planning more complex than a basic will leaving house/cars/ bank accounts. In Louisiana, lawyers can advertise that that specialize in estate planning and I believe there is even a test they have to take. Find one of those guys/gals. Don’t just go to any old lawyer.
Posted by cable
Member since Oct 2018
9735 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 9:35 pm to
what company is offering this insurance plan?
Posted by Jim Rockford
Member since May 2011
104390 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 9:42 pm to
quote:

Yeah, I refer folks out all the time because I don’t frick with trusts and any estate planning more complex than a basic will leaving house/cars/ bank accounts. In Louisiana, lawyers can advertise that that specialize in estate planning and I believe there is even a test they have to take. Find one of those guys/gals. Don’t just go to any old lawyer.





I had a trust come across my desk that was drafted by one of those specialists. It came in a fancy binder but it was a total shite sandwich. It took a regular ole country lawyer to straighten it out.
Posted by LSUFanHouston
NOLA
Member since Jul 2009
40251 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 9:56 pm to
Using life insurance proceeds to pay an estate tax bill is a perfectly fine estate planning tool, especially if the assets are not very liquid.

There's a lot of old ILITs hanging around from when the estate tax exemption was less than a million dollars.

With the higher exemption and spousal portability, the odds of actually having an estate tax bill are lower than ever before.

So the question I would have are...

1) Is there any chance of a taxable estate?

2) If there is, what planning techniques can we employ to reduce, or eliminate that taxable estate?

I'm assuming your inlaws met with a life insurance salesman (estate planner my arse). A life insurance salesman is not going to be able to answer those two questions.

If after legitimate estate planning has been conducted, there still exists a potential estate tax bill, then looking at life insurance as a funding mechanism is a valid strategy.
This post was edited on 10/16/18 at 9:57 pm
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
23425 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 10:10 pm to
If OP’s in laws have $5 mil or more than they should have a good cpa. If they don’t they need to get one. Then they need to ask that good cpa for a good estate attorney. Any good cpa will know a good estate attorney as they often work hand in hand.

Go see an attorney first, then if both your cpa and attorney recommend some life insurance go from there.
Posted by TigerGM
Member since Nov 2014
1126 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 11:12 pm to
You do what trump did. Set up two shell companies one I. Your name and one in your parents. Then have your shell company sell things to your parents shell company for exorbant prices to avoid that 50% estate tax. That way you just get hit with the tax of owning a business. Winning.
Posted by BBONDS25
Member since Mar 2008
57137 posts
Posted on 10/16/18 at 11:23 pm to
quote:

You do what trump did. Set up two shell companies one I. Your name and one in your parents. Then have your shell company sell things to your parents shell company for exorbant prices to avoid that 50% estate tax. That way you just get hit with the tax of owning a business. Winning.


I don’t know if you are MAGA. But that is not what trump did. At all.
Posted by FelicianaTigerfan
Comanche County
Member since Aug 2009
26059 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 12:05 am to
(no message)
This post was edited on 10/17/18 at 7:04 am
Posted by BoomBoomBoom
Member since Oct 2013
940 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 12:11 am to
quote:

I have never in my life heard of estate tax insurance.
He's trying to sell them a life insurance policy where the death benefit will cover the estate tax liability. Pretty standard for large estates. The classic example is Joe Robbie, original owner of the Miami Dolphins. Upon his death, his heirs/family were forced to sell the Dolphins because they couldn't afford the estate taxes. Had they purchased a life policy, the death benefit would have paid the taxes, and the heirs/family would have retained ownership of the Dolphins.
Posted by Ford Frenzy
337 posts
Member since Aug 2010
6878 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 12:25 am to
Precisely, the size of the estate can be worth millions but that doesn’t mean the cash for the tax is readily available
Posted by Ambassador
West Monroe, LA
Member since Jan 2004
1399 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 12:30 am to
quote:

what company is offering this insurance plan?



I will ask her in the morning.
Posted by fishfighter
RIP
Member since Apr 2008
40026 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 4:09 am to
quote:

My family usually takes their assets and put them in the intended recipient names to avoid the taxes.


This is what I had did.

On somewhat a bad side. MIL passed. She had everything that FIL got from his folks. The kids told her to keep everything. MIL had a shite load of CD's. Some with her name and the kids, others without the kids names. Unreal what the family has to go thru. Banks don't want to give up the monies.
This post was edited on 10/17/18 at 4:14 am
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
34807 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 4:18 am to


Hire a lawyer, Costanza. You need to protect Prickly Pete.
Posted by McLemore
Member since Dec 2003
34807 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 4:22 am to
quote:

Don’t just go to any old lawyer.


this is good advice. I've developed my trusts and estates practice slowly over almost 20 years, but I still have tax experts and other nerds on call to help. It's fraught with peril.

You've got everyone from the IRS to Joe and Susi Schmoe distant relative fighting over that precious cash. Not to mention judges who like to harp over pet technicalities of the day.
Posted by jscrims
Lost
Member since May 2008
3752 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 5:34 am to
This guy has some knowledge. Also, it depends on what kind of trust is set up as well as the timeframe on when that estate is set up. For example, if an irreovcavle trust is set up and the person dies within 3 years, it goes against the estate.

I’m a big fan of the life insurance policy to pay the estate tax, especially if it is a sizable tax.
Posted by Tigertown in ATL
Georgia foothills
Member since Sep 2009
30215 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 5:55 am to
If she has that much and hasn’t done anything, good luck. Sometimes people are too stubborn.

My GUESS is that we will at least have a 5mm+ exemption for a long time. Translates to 10+ per couple.

BUT, she is right about the 15K sort of. A gift to any one person above that is sublet to a gift tax return and a filing of a 709 but you are correct. The exemption covers the gifts so no tax due. But it reduces what you can pass at death.

There are some very good strategies for handling this but she needs a good attorney. One that ONLY does estate planning. Not a litigator, real estate guy or something that adds “wills” to their list of services.
Posted by TheOcean
#honeyfriedchicken
Member since Aug 2004
45161 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 6:53 am to
This is what I do for a living. If their assets are well under $6 million there is really no need to purchase insurance and put it in an ILIT. When the exemption sunsets it'll be back down to 5.49 million per person -- 11 million per couple.

I would recommend a good trust for beneficiaries so that assets can be protected from beneficiaries' creditors (if drafted properly).
Posted by Curdoglsu
Member since Sep 2009
387 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 6:55 am to
If in Louisiana, goggle Louisiana Board of Legal Specialization to find a Board Certified Estate Planning Specialist in the area.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
23425 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 7:10 am to
quote:

The classic example is Joe Robbie, original owner of the Miami Dolphins. Upon his death, his heirs/family were forced to sell the Dolphins because they couldn't afford the estate taxes. Had they purchased a life policy, the death benefit would have paid the taxes, and the heirs/family would have retained ownership of the Dolphins.


They would have had multiple options outside of just life insurance. I don’t know the details here at all, but it’s rarely that simple.
Posted by BBONDS25
Member since Mar 2008
57137 posts
Posted on 10/17/18 at 7:38 am to
Wonder why they didn’t use 6166.
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