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Started By
Message
re: Electricians of OT - options for installing a dedicated 60A 220V circuit...
Posted on 11/11/25 at 1:47 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
Posted on 11/11/25 at 1:47 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
You are going to need a bigger box.
200 amp box minimum. Be sure to check with your local utility company to see if there is a surcharge for boxes larger than 200 amps.
I just received a letter from the utility company that I will be charged an extra $28 a month because my box is larger than 200 amps.
200 amp box minimum. Be sure to check with your local utility company to see if there is a surcharge for boxes larger than 200 amps.
I just received a letter from the utility company that I will be charged an extra $28 a month because my box is larger than 200 amps.
0
Posted on 11/11/25 at 5:06 am to Clames
quote:
He actually might as EV chargers pull power for longer periods than typical appliance on a NEMA 14-50 receptical and if he wants to charge at the max rate.
Well that’s my point, he likely doesn’t need the max rate. The lowest Level 2 is about half as fast, but will basically still charge practically anything overnight. 6-20 and 14-30 plugs could get the job done with less overall power demand on the panel. A wall connector can typically be wired with a 40a breaker as well (just needs to be clearly labeled).
Now I do agree to not skimp on the breaker or receptacle. I just know lots of ppl spend crazy money on 60a wiring without considering if they actually need to draw that much, because it’s the default wiring for the wall chargers.
You can even do a 6-15 plug by just moving to 2 tandem breakers to free up space, and possibly use existing wiring, which would be a bit more than double level 1 charging. 5-20 is simpler yet, which is still level 1 but about 50% faster than 5-15.
The main point is starting with your actual demand to see how much you need to draw. To me, the max rate is still going to basically be overnight charge to 100%, so drawing 24-32a instead of 48a (60a breaker) won’t make a huge difference in terms of convenience, but can certainly simplify installation.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 5:56 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
Unsure if anyone has answered you OP, but it's not to bad. Get a sub panel and feed it off of this panel. So one 2 pole breaker feeds a smaller panel with say 6-8 spots for the smaller single pole breakers. This will free up some room in your panel for more breakers.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 8:16 am to Obtuse1
quote:
Then again they might eyeball that 100A protected panel and toss in some tandem breakers on the 120V circuits and throw the 60A circuit in. That might work or it might be crazy I can't do the math without more info most of which the OP can't provide. I would stress getting more than one quote though and with a good understanding of what each one's scope of the job is.
Ok, so I called the shop that we always get to do our work thinking I would get someone that is familiar with what I have going on. He told me he will free up a couple of spots, put a tandem breaker in and hard wire the charger to the wall a couple of feet from that box, which is where I wanted it to be. He did confirm it will be a 60A circuit. Basically told me with what runs on that panel it will not be a problem.
This post was edited on 11/11/25 at 8:21 am
Posted on 11/11/25 at 8:45 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
quote:
Ok, so I called the shop that we always get to do our work thinking I would get someone that is familiar with what I have going on. He told me he will free up a couple of spots, put a tandem breaker in and hard wire the charger to the wall a couple of feet from that box, which is where I wanted it to be. He did confirm it will be a 60A circuit. Basically told me with what runs on that panel it will not be a problem.
I live much of my life squarely in do as I say not as I do land but honestly that is exactly what I would have done in my own house with my own hands. I think absolute worst case you would be pulling just over 100A maybe 105 and that would be both A/C units running, the charger on full tilt, the on demand water heater running, a few lights and what I assume is a bathroom vent/heater combo on the 20A circuit at the top. I assume that is what is on it because they require a 20A branch circuit by code. Despite the code almost all I have seen are between 1200 and 1500w of heat so under 13A draw.
You have a good sparky because I guarantee some would want to damn near rewire your house to do what you want, instead, this is the quickest, easiest, and cheapest option. The bonus is very little drywall repair plus it is in your garage and unless you are anal about it most garages only have a level 2 finish aka cheap but hardy.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 8:45 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
quote:
Ok, so I called the shop that we always get to do our work thinking I would get someone that is familiar with what I have going on. He told me he will free up a couple of spots, put a tandem breaker in and hard wire the charger to the wall a couple of feet from that box, which is where I wanted it to be. He did confirm it will be a 60A circuit. Basically told me with what runs on that panel it will not be a problem.
Whoever you talked to over the phone has zero idea what your demand factor is with the general loads and fixed appliance loads on that sub.
Hope homie depot Darren is bonded and insured before you allow him to start doubling up branch circuits on tandems.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 9:10 am to SuperSaint
I didn't wake up this morning itching for an argument but I have to ask a couple of questions:
As long as the panel is CTL compliant what is your concern about replacing 4 single 120V breakers with 2 appropriately sized tandem breakers?
The easiest thing to do is figure a demand factor of 1 against the max connected load you would possibly expect to run at one time. Even with a demand factor of 1 you are barely at 100A with all the heavy draws running. Using .9 you have room for lights and various other low draws. Both are higher than the common .75 to .8 demand factor for home panels.
quote:
Hope homie depot Darren is bonded and insured before you allow him to start doubling up branch circuits on tandems.
As long as the panel is CTL compliant what is your concern about replacing 4 single 120V breakers with 2 appropriately sized tandem breakers?
quote:
Whoever you talked to over the phone has zero idea what your demand factor is with the general loads and fixed appliance loads on that sub.
The easiest thing to do is figure a demand factor of 1 against the max connected load you would possibly expect to run at one time. Even with a demand factor of 1 you are barely at 100A with all the heavy draws running. Using .9 you have room for lights and various other low draws. Both are higher than the common .75 to .8 demand factor for home panels.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 9:20 am to Btrtigerfan
quote:
Igniter circuit for gas water heater?
Possible
Posted on 11/11/25 at 10:17 am to SuperSaint
quote:
Whoever you talked to over the phone has zero idea what your demand factor is with the general loads and fixed appliance loads on that sub.
I getcha,Yeah, its a good shop (which I have no problem paying for quality work) and we know several of the guys including the owner (patients of either my wife or mine or their family members are). And I'll be there when they come and we'll talk about it and he'll let me look over his shoulder and ask questions so I can learn just enough to be dangerous lol.
He did the lighting upgrade in the media room (which runs off of that box) for me a couple of years ago and put in a dedicated circuit for my Kranzle pressure washer for my psycho car washing habits.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 11:33 am to BigPapiDoesItAgain
Posted on 11/11/25 at 11:39 am to Btrtigerfan
quote:
You aren't getting 60A out of that one. You're going to need to grab another feed from the box at the meter.
This appears to be correct. You have a 100 amp main breaker. That’s not going to supply your existing loads plus another 45 amps that the 60 amp breaker is probably supplying.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 11:52 am to Penrod
quote:
This appears to be correct. You have a 100 amp main breaker. That’s not going to supply your existing loads plus another 45 amps that the 60 amp breaker is probably supplying.
He might. The 30A A/C breakers are generally sized FLA x 1.5 to account for motor inrush current. Those units are unlikely to be drawing over 20A each. He could get a picture of the nameplates to verify. I don't know what's going on with the heater. That could be as high as 16A, or it could be a gas heater that needs less than 1A for controls/pilot light/etc. The receptacles/lighting loads are chickenshit aside from his pressure washer.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 12:05 pm to THRILLHO
quote:
He might. The 30A A/C breakers are generally sized FLA x 1.5 to account for motor inrush current. Those units are unlikely to be drawing over 20A each. He could get a picture of the nameplates to verify. I don't know what's going on with the heater. That could be as high as 16A, or it could be a gas heater that needs less than 1A for controls/pilot light/etc. The receptacles/lighting loads are chickenshit aside from his pressure washer.
The problem is that if you run a toaster and a hair dryer at the same time…
Posted on 11/11/25 at 12:36 pm to Obtuse1
quote:sight unseen what makes you believe the over current protection cam be reduced from 15a to 20a to make room to add a two pole 60a?
As long as the panel is CTL compliant what is your concern about replacing 4 single 120V breakers with 2 appropriately sized tandem breakers?
And honestly that probably still wouldn’t be below the CTL although close
Posted on 11/11/25 at 12:39 pm to SuperSaint
quote:when you can instantly determine someone knows nothing about what they are saying
Hope homie depot Darren is bonded and insured
Posted on 11/11/25 at 12:44 pm to cgrand
quote:que?
when you can instantly determine someone knows nothing about what they are saying
Posted on 11/11/25 at 12:49 pm to SuperSaint
what is your understanding of what "bonded" means?
Posted on 11/11/25 at 1:32 pm to SuperSaint
quote:
sight unseen what makes you believe the over current protection cam be reduced from 15a to 20a to make room to add a two pole 60a?
Technically, you could reduce the breaker from 20A to 15A on a 12 AWG wired branch circuit as long as it is wired with typical duplex 15A receptacles and not a dedicated circuit or actual 20A receptacles. There is no reason to do that though, because 20A 120V tandem breakers are made for every CTL-compliant panel I am aware of.
quote:
And honestly that probably still wouldn’t be below the CTL although close
I assume CTL means total connected load, I usually think of CTL as circuit total limitation which prevents the use of tandem breakers in some older panals. If so I have never seen a full-house home panel where the total connected load was not significantly greater than the ampacity of the panel. I have right around 700A of protected circuits in my 400A load center however the actual connected load is less. There is no way I would ever trip the main unless it actually set out to do it. In any case, the wiring is still protected by the individual breakers and the main breaker protecting the panel busses. OP will still have proper over-protection for all the wiring and the buss, the only risk is the main tripping, but I think that is highly unlikely.
The only time I see the OP's main breaker tripping in anything like normal use is if all the dedicated circuits except the two AC units are running and both AC units kick on at the EXACT same time and the voltage drop drags the compressor inrush current out long enough to step outside the main breaker's TCC. Even that is a massive stretch. Now if he tries to trip it he could having all the dedicated circuits running and he plugs in a couple of vacuums and 3-4 1800w hair dryers but every bit of cable would still have proper overprotection.
Posted on 11/11/25 at 1:34 pm to cgrand
quote:having an active surety bond the state license board requires me to hold to renew my license every two years.
what is your understanding of what "bonded" means?
Also a lot of municipalities verify it’s current before issuing business license and allowing me to pull a permit.
That’s my understanding?
I’m open to be educated if you have a different understanding?
Posted on 11/11/25 at 1:36 pm to Sun God
My god that is one of my favorite movies of all time.
Pull the old Aunt Emily.
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