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Message
Elderly Guardianship Assets Questions/Experience
Posted on 1/30/23 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 1/30/23 at 2:49 pm
Long post so skip it if you don't want to help.
So here goes - My mom (no pics) had a hemorrhagic stroke late Dec. She's still at UK Hospital. Within the first week I got Emergency Guardianship and a Permanent Guardianship court date in March. I'm her only child, parents divorced years ago and he's now dead, so I'm it. I'm her beneficiary on everything. The courthouse gave me an Asset Inventory sheet to fill out for her property, bank accounts, etc. Mom put me on her bank accounts 20 years ago as a Joint Owner, not listed as "and/or", just her name my name. A lawyer in KY said I should pull the money out of her accounts and put those funds into a separate account in my name since I'm joint owner. The accounts would remain open so her SS and KY retirement checks would continue to be deposited there. The point is to keep a nursing home/Medicaid from taking the funds. Her car, which I have with me in AL, is paid for. She still owes on a house she bought four years ago. The lawyer suggested I only put her house and car on the inventory sheet because I'm not listed on those. This inventory sheet bothers me because I'm afraid they'll use this as an index to see what she has and take it. I suppose I can still list the accounts but with the lowered dollar amounts after I've transferred most of the funds. We're not talking big money, all together she didn't have 100K put away.
Does anyone have experience with keeping your parents assets from being taken? She didn't have a will or anything like that. She must've felt that having me listed on her accounts as joint owner and beneficiary on her policies would suffice. The last month has been surreal, driving back and forth between B'ham and Lexington and Harlan is wearing me out. My customers are suffering but are understanding. UK Hospital called me last week stating that Humana Medicare says she's not improving enough for an LTACH and they want to send her to a nursing home. I've heard nothing but horror stories about them is why I'm asking. Thanks.
So here goes - My mom (no pics) had a hemorrhagic stroke late Dec. She's still at UK Hospital. Within the first week I got Emergency Guardianship and a Permanent Guardianship court date in March. I'm her only child, parents divorced years ago and he's now dead, so I'm it. I'm her beneficiary on everything. The courthouse gave me an Asset Inventory sheet to fill out for her property, bank accounts, etc. Mom put me on her bank accounts 20 years ago as a Joint Owner, not listed as "and/or", just her name my name. A lawyer in KY said I should pull the money out of her accounts and put those funds into a separate account in my name since I'm joint owner. The accounts would remain open so her SS and KY retirement checks would continue to be deposited there. The point is to keep a nursing home/Medicaid from taking the funds. Her car, which I have with me in AL, is paid for. She still owes on a house she bought four years ago. The lawyer suggested I only put her house and car on the inventory sheet because I'm not listed on those. This inventory sheet bothers me because I'm afraid they'll use this as an index to see what she has and take it. I suppose I can still list the accounts but with the lowered dollar amounts after I've transferred most of the funds. We're not talking big money, all together she didn't have 100K put away.
Does anyone have experience with keeping your parents assets from being taken? She didn't have a will or anything like that. She must've felt that having me listed on her accounts as joint owner and beneficiary on her policies would suffice. The last month has been surreal, driving back and forth between B'ham and Lexington and Harlan is wearing me out. My customers are suffering but are understanding. UK Hospital called me last week stating that Humana Medicare says she's not improving enough for an LTACH and they want to send her to a nursing home. I've heard nothing but horror stories about them is why I'm asking. Thanks.
12
Posted on 1/30/23 at 2:55 pm to Harlan County USA
As someone who has been through this, "pulling out the funds" won't fly. You have to be essentially destitute for 3 years (at least in TX) before your explanation of why you removed those funds will be recognized.
Between us, you should use that money to put your mom in a safe place and she'll thank you for it in the after life. Good luck baw
Between us, you should use that money to put your mom in a safe place and she'll thank you for it in the after life. Good luck baw
Posted on 1/30/23 at 2:57 pm to Harlan County USA
quote:
The point is to keep a nursing home/Medicaid from taking the funds. H
they go back 5 years so pulling the money out now will not immediately help
It’s more technical than that but I don’t know enough about it to explain
We had majority of accounts out into trusts & made sure checking account was below 2000.00 on the 1st (when they check it)
ETA
Could be 3 years as post above said, I’d meet with an estate atty
Our paperwork cost 11k
This post was edited on 1/30/23 at 3:00 pm
Posted on 1/30/23 at 2:57 pm to Harlan County USA
Everyone, especially you, should know you'll never leave Harlan alive
Posted on 1/30/23 at 3:09 pm to Harlan County USA
It looks like Kentucky has a 5 year lookback. You also need to get another Attorney. The one advising you appears like he doesn't know what he is talking about.
OP. Does she have life insurance?
OP. Does she have life insurance?
This post was edited on 1/30/23 at 3:14 pm
Posted on 1/30/23 at 3:26 pm to La Place Mike
quote:
OP. Does she have life insurance?
I'm not sure as I haven't went through all her documents that she had scattered all through her house and car. I'll be back up there later this week. So far I've found a Washington National insurance she's had since 98 but the coverage was for cancer and intensive care. Original policy was through Conseco.
She receives KY Retirement through the Harlan County Board of Ed. I sent the guardianship paperwork to them but haven't gotten to talk with them yet. She may have one through them.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 3:59 pm to Harlan County USA
I’m sorry you are going through this. Tough to deal with this kind of stuff on your own.
This post was edited on 1/30/23 at 4:01 pm
Posted on 1/30/23 at 4:06 pm to Harlan County USA
I would fire the attorney and get a new one for not understanding the "look back period"
Posted on 1/30/23 at 4:42 pm to Broke
Help me to understand the Look Back Period.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 4:44 pm to Broke
Very sorry to hear about this OP. Just went through this a little over 2 years ago with my Grandpa. My Mom and I had to do everything. Was even more difficult with him living in assisted living in The Villages and covid going wild. We weren't allowed in his place for the longest time. Most of the trouble was after his death (that's the most difficult part), but there was still a ton of decisions to be made medically and stuff like that while he was alive.
As others suggested, get a different attorney. That guy doesn't sound like he knows what he is talking about. This is complex and frustrating stuff. You don't want to make a mistake because of him and screw you (or mom).
Best of luck.
As others suggested, get a different attorney. That guy doesn't sound like he knows what he is talking about. This is complex and frustrating stuff. You don't want to make a mistake because of him and screw you (or mom).
Best of luck.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 4:52 pm to Harlan County USA
Medicaid Long Term Care will look back 5 years from the date of application to see if there are assets that have been transferred. If so, this assets are counted as the beneficiaries assets.
If they are currently in a joint account, they are assumed to be the beneficiary/applicant’s 100%. Generally the home and one vehicle are excluded from the Medicaid eligibility calculation.
Find an attorney that specializes in elder care law. It is definitely a specialty and a general family attorney isn’t going to know the nuances.
There are a couple things you can do with trusts to mitigate some of the assets. For example, you can prepay funeral expenses with your chosen funeral home. Say $20K worth. That’s not out of the range of funeral expenses. That money is put into a trust by the funeral home for your loved one and when they pass away, the cost of the funeral is already taken care of. If your loved one happened to decide that they wanted cremation, then a large portion of that money would be refunded to you.
But definitely get an elder care attorney.
If they are currently in a joint account, they are assumed to be the beneficiary/applicant’s 100%. Generally the home and one vehicle are excluded from the Medicaid eligibility calculation.
Find an attorney that specializes in elder care law. It is definitely a specialty and a general family attorney isn’t going to know the nuances.
There are a couple things you can do with trusts to mitigate some of the assets. For example, you can prepay funeral expenses with your chosen funeral home. Say $20K worth. That’s not out of the range of funeral expenses. That money is put into a trust by the funeral home for your loved one and when they pass away, the cost of the funeral is already taken care of. If your loved one happened to decide that they wanted cremation, then a large portion of that money would be refunded to you.
But definitely get an elder care attorney.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 4:55 pm to Wiseguy
quote:
Find an attorney that specializes in elder care law. It is definitely a specialty and a general family attorney isn’t going to know the nuances.
Thank you.
There aren't Elder Care lawyers in Harlan, I'll have to find one elsewhere, maybe in Lexington.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 5:48 pm to Harlan County USA
quote:
Does anyone have experience with keeping your parents assets from being taken?
In Kentucky, not sure about other places, there is a "5 year look back", so they see the bank account go to $0, that won't matter because they look at a 5 year window.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 6:11 pm to Harlan County USA
Your attorney is advising you to commit fraud by hiding assets.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 6:20 pm to Harlan County USA
Kentucky Bar association lawyer referral service
Here is link to the Kentucky Bar Association lawyer referral service you need someone who specializes in elder law.
Here is link to the Kentucky Bar Association lawyer referral service you need someone who specializes in elder law.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 7:04 pm to Harlan County USA
I’m sorry for your issue OP. Please understand it’s not ‘taking your money’, it’s using her own money to pay for the care. You are basically asking online how to hide money so the government doesn’t take it to pay for your mother’s care.
This is a bad idea and as said it’s basically too late.
Do what you need for your mother using her money.
I would also be careful moving anything as you don’t want the government to think your money was her money and take your money. That’s not going to happen unless you really frick around here. So don’t.
This is a bad idea and as said it’s basically too late.
Do what you need for your mother using her money.
I would also be careful moving anything as you don’t want the government to think your money was her money and take your money. That’s not going to happen unless you really frick around here. So don’t.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 7:07 pm to Harlan County USA
Contact a reputable attorney who specializes in elderly law. It’s specialized and they’ve probably seen this a million times.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 7:08 pm to MikeBRLA
I probably shouldn't have mentioned Medicaid in my OP. She's not on Medicaid, she's on Medicare now that she's 70. Not sure she'll be on state Medicaid in the future. I'm not sure what nursing home costs will run above what Medicare will pay and she has KY Retirement and SS to at least cover some of those costs. I was just afraid of a nursing home taking her assets. I think that may have been what the lawyer was suggesting. I def have to speak with someone who specializes in Elder Care though.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 7:11 pm to Harlan County USA
You need a new lawyer because that one gave terrible advice. It’s a five year look back.
Posted on 1/30/23 at 7:55 pm to Harlan County USA
quote:
So far I've found a Washington National insurance she's had since 98 but the coverage was for cancer and intensive care
You could be describing a critical illness policy. Strokes would be included and often pay directly to the holder and not to hospitals, etc. Definitely dive in more.
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