re: EBR teachers receive $8500/year raise. 6th highest in state…

I see your point. It makes sense. I think we just disagree.

I've also lived in a city with a functioning government that invested in education, parks, police, and beautification. It's a very nice thing.

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My guess is most end up in the private schools or a charter and the remaining go their neighborhood public and end up with a decent education by participating in the Gifted and Talented program, Scholars curriculum, AP or Dual Enrollment classes that are currently offered at schools such as Woodlawn HS.

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That includes elementary?

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In my opinion, if St George wants good schools then the first thing they need to do is takeover "their" schools through participation. The ISD should be the final step not the first step. If everyone remains on the sidelines taking a wait and see approach then they will end up with the status quo.

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And there's the rub. By participation do you mean send their kids there? Other than that, how much participation are you talking about and in what forms? Parents that are doing their part at home are already stretched; they can't make up for poor parental involvement for other kids.

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There is no waiting list for MANY if not most of what EBR calls magnets now.

The top of the magnet chain yes - but many others are nowhere near full

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That's not encouraging. That just sounds like magnet in name only save the real ones.

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If you can enforce the standard and hold them accountable for results, you may have something. The wild card is student home life. Good teachers can only do so much with that.

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For the sake of my example, I think you're right and I also think that is one of the downwind effects that would occur.

50k teacher is stressed. Kid with shitty home life is acting an arse. 50k teacher is dealing with financial stressors. Needs to work a gig job to make sure they don't pay extra interest on their debt. They are tired, they don't have the capacity to deal with bad kids. The shitty home life kid gets ignored and turns to the streets because lord knows the teachers didn't give a shite.

120k is not stressed. Got 2 more hours of sleep than the 50k teacher after watching a movie. They wake up with a normal stress level. Not on top of the world, but not fed up. Same scenario happens, kid is acting an arse. Attitude goes from "frick this kid" to "Hey man, what is going on". Does it fix everything? No. Down the line when the kid is faced with an opportunity to make a bad decision, he remembers that teacher. He showed grace, he would not like what he is going to do. He hesitates, doesn't act on impulse.

Same kid who would be in the system is instead working a job, trying to do right. He has a child, who he raises right. The system perpetuates from there.

I know that's a made up scenario, but I have lived it. Whenever I think of doing something stupid I remember my social studies teach from 7th grade. We all loved him. He was a great man. He was underpaid, but he did his best to show up for us every day. All of us hold him in high regard. A lot of us were from incredibly poor families and we are all doing anywhere from okay to successful, and we all attribute that to him.

I'm as guilty as everyone else of loving individuality. But so many of these things that go in that are direct results of your local government have an effect on you whether you like it or not.

Raising the pay means higher taxes. Who funds that? Primarily business owners who…..wish to keep as much money as they can because…..THEY EARN IT. It’s not their duty to fund tax paying jobs. They already “make the world go round”.

Business 101.

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And there's the rub. By participation do you mean send their kids there?

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By participation I mean send their kids there. I believe it will be extremely hard to have good community schools without full participation from the community.

Since you brought it up. I firmly believe that parental involvement (for those that have time) is a significant part of what makes a community school better. I have no idea if this is allowed or part of the public schools system but firmly believe that it is an intangible that elevates the private schools.

Are you sure? I firmly believe that you only need to have a bachelor's degree and librarians certification

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ear 4. But teachers make choices to teach, and where to teach.

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teachers go in knowing the money isn't great, but as inflation and the cost of living increases and salaries don't it becomes an issue. There are many teachers working second and third jobs just to be able to afford every day life.

Now we could argue what are they buying?

A 60k salary means 3800 a month after insurance and retirement are taken out. If they have a $300 car note, $800 house note, $175 insurance $100 cell phone, then add in utilities, gas etc.... that 3800 is gone quickly. Also talking a $300 car note and a $800 house note is relatively cheap and in budget for a teacher considering a 1 bedroom apartment runs $600+ depending on the area.

If teachers received a cost of living adjustment people wouldn't bat an eye, but a raise causes concern for many.

Civilians start at 64k at West Point and earn more based on experience and degrees.

64k they would give up 40-50% of their salary a year renting an apartment near West Point.