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Started By
Message
re: Saints trading CGJ to eagles for 5th and 6th round picks.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:09 pm to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:09 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Why?
Because its there regardless of what decisions are made at safety this offseason. Its a sunk cost. You dont get to go back in time and undo the Hill deal to make your Marcus Williams fantasies pencil out.
quote:
I'm primarily focusing on the gap, not guarantees.
You dont get to ignore real contract dollars, terms, and commitment out of one side of your mouth - and bitch about bad cap moves out of the other.
1
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:09 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:
Maye and mathieu got a combined 33 mil guaranteed over the 3 years.
That says little as to cap hit.
Especially since we will likely have to redo their deals next year to clear space, lowering their cap (and, technically, increasing "guaranteed" money via signing bonuses replacing salary that doesn't count as guaranteed)
quote:
That is the money guaranteed at signing.
Explain to me the direct correlation with this and cap hit
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:10 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
Again, my primary argument in this thread (and what should logically be the focal discussion point after this terrible trade today) is our mismanagement of the cap by giving out some really shitty deals (which required shitty extensions, etc.).
Then you should have stuck to that rather than claim the 2 quality safeties that signed are actually garbage.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:11 pm to SlowFlowPro
Pff grading has been shite ever since the dude had other people start doing it. The grades usually say one thing, then you look at their advanced stats and it tells a completely different story. Look at the stats Gyno posted. Those are top numbers.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 1:22 pm
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:11 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:
Because its there regardless of what decisions are made at safety this offseason. Its a sunk cost.
I'm not arguing that we had to sign MW with the fricked up cap that Loomis/SP created. THAT discussion would involve sunk cost analysis.
quote:
You dont get to go back in time and undo the Hill deal to make your Marcus Williams fantasies pencil out.
No but I get to cite the Hill deal as a terrible decision/contract that we will be dealing with for years to come, still.
Just like I'm citing the Jenkins' deal for similar impacts on our cap.
quote:
You dont get to ignore real contract dollars, terms, and commitment out of one side of your mouth - and bitch about bad cap moves out of the other.
Guaranteed money has some relationship to cap hits but it's nowhere near direct. Apples and oranges, especially if we have to restructure deals down the road and add more to the "guaranteed" pile.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:12 pm to RB10
quote:
are actually garbage.
I only said Taysom Hill was garbage and that Jenkins was mediocre-bad.
I called MM "bargain bin"
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:12 pm to SlowFlowPro
Why does it matter what the cap hit is?
You can play with that anyway you want.
The guaranteed money is what matters. The saints have a set price they are willing to pay players. Cap can be manipulated if need be.
You can play with that anyway you want.
The guaranteed money is what matters. The saints have a set price they are willing to pay players. Cap can be manipulated if need be.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:13 pm to RB10
the reality is, we werent giving 70MM and 34 guaranteed for MW, and I cant say I blame them. Jenkins leaving was a kick in the nuts, but considering we emerged from that with MM and TM7, arguably a more productive and versatile pair, for a fraction of the cost is a very good outcome.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:13 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
No but I get to cite the Hill deal as a terrible decision/contract that we will be dealing with for years to come, still.
Just like I'm citing the Jenkins' deal for similar impacts on our cap.
Imagine how your head would spin if they signed Williams and he didn’t pan out like expected.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:13 pm to bonethug0180
quote:
Look at the stats Gyno posted. Those are top numbers.
If everyone's argument is that we'd have a gap at safety if we paid MW, then playing TM in the slot leaves that same gap
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:14 pm to RB10
quote:
and he didn’t pan out like expected.
He's already a proven thing, though.
And he's not coming off the worst injury a football player can suffer
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:14 pm to DBG
He wanted $12M per year.
Our best offer was $8M.
With Davenport and McCoy needing extensions in addition to cap hell… this was not possible to pay CJGJ.
Our best offer was $8M.
With Davenport and McCoy needing extensions in addition to cap hell… this was not possible to pay CJGJ.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:14 pm to Vacherie Saint
quote:
MM and TM7, arguably a more productive and versatile pair, for a fraction of the cost i
A fraction that converts to a percentage large than 100
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:15 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
I only said Taysom Hill was garbage and that Jenkins was mediocre-bad.
I called MM "bargain bin"
You’re steadily trying to argue that a player who was an All-Pro 2 of the last 3 years is a clear downgrade to CGJ, and that he “hasn’t been good in a while”.
Get the frick out of here.
This post was edited on 8/30/22 at 1:16 pm
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:15 pm to Vacherie Saint
That's my point.
You got 2 safeties for the price of one.
I was high on marcus williams from day 1. I said he would be a pro bowler during his first camp with the saints.
They came out of it looking good with what they paid maye and mathieu.
Maye might not give you the exact range of williams but he will give you abt 85% and is better than williams in other areas like tackling.
You got 2 safeties for the price of one.
I was high on marcus williams from day 1. I said he would be a pro bowler during his first camp with the saints.
They came out of it looking good with what they paid maye and mathieu.
Maye might not give you the exact range of williams but he will give you abt 85% and is better than williams in other areas like tackling.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:15 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:
You got 2 safeties for the price of one.
Compare their cap hits
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
Have you even bothered looked at the cap in its totality? It’s like you’re making things up. Both of those deals are worked in our favor
Mathieu’s deal is very team friendly. We can get out after ‘24 and if it’s not, it’s built to allow a favorable restructure. As it stands now the cap hit the next two years isn’t even in the top 10 on the team.
Maye’s deal is even better. We could get out or restructure with minimal impact sooner than later.
Mathieu’s deal is very team friendly. We can get out after ‘24 and if it’s not, it’s built to allow a favorable restructure. As it stands now the cap hit the next two years isn’t even in the top 10 on the team.
Maye’s deal is even better. We could get out or restructure with minimal impact sooner than later.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:17 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
He's already a proven thing, though.
Not as proven as Mathieu, who you keep calling mediocre.
Weird.
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:18 pm to SlowFlowPro
if you sign MW and Jenkins still retires, you end up having to either overpay for CJGJ and move him to SS or sign TM anyway - then you have eleventy billion dollars tied up in the position and you are STILL saddled with the Hill and Jenkins contracts. Unless you'd rather they burn a first rounder on a safety to start next to MW and pray for the best? So who dont you draft in that scenario? Penning? Then we have to overpay TA too? Or we could pass on Olave and go another season with almost nothing at receiver.
You are drunk on that MW
You are drunk on that MW
Posted on 8/30/22 at 1:20 pm to SlowFlowPro
here you go again pretending like Jenkins contract hit is something that just disappears if we resign MW. How does that work exactly?
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