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Message
re: Attorney for Smith family / Attorney for Hayes l Press Conference Recap
Posted on 4/14/16 at 9:56 am to lsufan31
Posted on 4/14/16 at 9:56 am to lsufan31
quote:
And neither one of those were claiming self defense, so.....try again. Stand your ground is different than self defense.
im not even sure what you are talking about. stand your ground just means that if you are in an situation with someone you dont have to make an attempt to retreat before using deadly force. stand your ground is very much a part of a self defense claim.
0
Posted on 4/14/16 at 9:56 am to diat150
quote:
there was a huge distance between the perps in both of those cases where as in this case these guys were prob 5 feet or even less away from each other in very tight quarters in a heated exchange.
No the difference is one shot vs eight shots. One shot allows for an attempt to wound defense while being in fear. 8 rounds is overkill & shows anger which eliminates the self defense argument. This was another aspect of the case I brought up earlier that you just so happened to ignore because it doesn't fit your agenda.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 9:57 am to WhoDat37
quote:
He was shot in front of his ear.
Idk why but this made me laugh haha
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:00 am to BigBrod81
quote:Nope. Plenty of cases where people have fired their entire gun and had self defense. Stop making definitive statements that are incorrect
8 rounds is overkill & shows anger which eliminates the self defense argument
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:00 am to BigBrod81
quote:
It everything to do with this situation when posters are implying that Hayes had the right to shoot Smith if he thought Smith was going for gun. The case I posted involved someone getting shot where the shooter could not see the victims hands or did the victim have a fire arm. Sorry you can't handle having a previous situation that debunks some of your points brought to your attention.
and? I just posted a case where someone was fleeing in a vehicle and didnt have a weapon at all and the shooter never even went to trial. the difference is in your case, as I have pointed out, the shooter lied about so many things like not having someone else in the car with him during the shooting, that his story wasnt believable and the facts did not match his story. if the shooter in your case was justified, why would he go about covering up the fact that he had a witness in the car? cmon man. just admit you picked the wrong case.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:02 am to BigBrod81
quote:
8 rounds is overkill & shows anger which eliminates the self defense argument
self defense classes teach you to unload fwiw
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:10 am to Lester Earl
ahhh...not all. If Smith had a weapon out in the car, why didn't the guy in the rear seat pick it up and start using it to defend himself and the woman in the back seat when Hayes ran out of bullets?
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:11 am to Rocky4LSU
not at all what? were you replying to me?
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:14 am to diat150
I didn't pick the wrong case. The article clearly stated that the guy was convicted first & foremost because he shot his victim without seeing his hands & the victim not having a weapon. The other aspects you mentioned effected his credibility. You can't seem to be able to separate the two.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:16 am to CocoLoco
I agree with you, but I do have a final question for which I do not know the answer. Has the shooter or his counsel on his behalf expressed any remorse, regret, condolences to the family for the incident? After all, a husband and wife were gunned down at his hand over an alleged bump and run accident and three children are now fatherless. If I was the shooter's attorney, that would be the first thing out of my mouth before I attempted to defend his actions. I don't live in New Orleans so hard to follow the news. Maybe the attorney already offered condolences.
This post was edited on 4/14/16 at 10:18 am
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:18 am to lsupride87
quote:
Nope. Plenty of cases where people have fired their entire gun and had self defense. Stop making definitive statements that are incorrect
Yeah, if the person they shot had a clear weapon of choice or they were close enough to inflict bodily harm. I have already stated each situation depends on the specifics. Nothing about my statement was incorrect idiot.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:20 am to Lester Earl
yes, Lester, not all classes advise to unload a weapon.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:20 am to BigBrod81
quote:
Nothing about my statement was incorrect idiot.
This is what you said
quote:That is a definitive statement that is factually incorrect, idiot
8 rounds is overkill & shows anger which eliminates the self defense argument
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:21 am to Rocky4LSU
unload a weapons until the threat is neutralized(aka shoot to kill).
what self defense class doesnt teach that?
what self defense class doesnt teach that?
This post was edited on 4/14/16 at 10:21 am
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:21 am to Rocky4LSU
quote:My cc instructor said shoot to kill, and dont stop until you know that is done. Didnt specifically say unload your gun. But he sure hinted at it
yes, Lester, not all classes advise to unload a weapon
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:29 am to Rocky4LSU
quote:
yes, Lester, not all classes advise to unload a weapon.
Not saying this is the case for hayes, but if I'm threatened enough to act in self defense against a upper 200 lbs ex football player looking guy....I'm probably gonna inject him with more than 7-8 rounds.
Once you make the decision to fire the first shot, you have to make sure you kill whatever you are shooting at. You can't halfway make that decision.
Most classes WILL teach that, if they are worth a damn.
If you walk into a class that is instructing amateur shooters who will be firing their first live rounds outside the range in an extremely high stress situation to shoot for legs, or fire once and see if it worked....you should probably leave and go to another class bc you're going to get yourself killed.
Of course, just retreating is a much better option to anything else, especially when the provocation is a $0 in damages vehicular love tap. I have been hit in a similar fashion multiple times in my life, most of the time, I don't even feel like taking the time to pull over and grab my magnifying glass and see if my car was dented at all, I have waved off people that pulled over that hit me; chasing down someone that drives off after a tap like that, shows some mental instability imo.
Also, the first "collision" is on video, and we cant even tell if the cars actually touched, that is how minor it was, so it is reasonable to believe that both parties should have expected no damage or virtually no damage.
This post was edited on 4/14/16 at 10:34 am
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:32 am to Lester Earl
Lester, are you telling me if he had a mag that held 19 rounds he would have been right to put all 17 in his back? The threat was neutralized after 2 45s in the body. And you don't empty your weapon with another possible aggressor in the back seat.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:32 am to teampick
quote:
agree with you, but I do have a final question for which I do not know the answer. Has the shooter or his counsel on his behalf expressed any remorse, regret, condolences to the family for the incident? After all, a husband and wife were gunned down at his hand over an alleged bump and run accident and three children are now fatherless. If I was the shooter's attorney, that would be the first thing out of my mouth before I attempted to defend his actions. I don't live in New Orleans so hard to follow the news. Maybe the attorney already offered condolences.
This is stupid
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:36 am to lsupride87
quote:
That is a definitive statement that is factually incorrect, idiot
Shooting Mrs. Smith twice + Mr. Smith eight times = overkill in terms of self defense. Mrs. Smith never was a threat to Hayes yet she was shot too. That alone is going to make Hayes claim of self defense null & void. Not to mention slamming into back of Smith's SUV shows anger & not fear which is key factor in self defense idiot.
Posted on 4/14/16 at 10:36 am to WhoDat37
quote:
Has the shooter or his counsel on his behalf expressed any remorse,
His lawyer has said he is holding back details in respect of will smith's family; in one of his pressers, and in the short wwl radio interview he did last night. Whether he is bluffing or not is up in the air, but I would categorize that as condolences.
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