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re: Zach Lowe/Bill Simmons Top Concerns for the Season.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 11:19 am to Ryan3232
Posted on 9/19/24 at 11:19 am to Ryan3232
quote:Not sure why it's silly to think OKC/DEN/MIN/LAC/DAL/PHO/MEM may be better than us.
but to think we arent in the top half of the western conference is kind of silly.
That's not a hot take at all. It can be disagreed with, one can think we are in that top 7...but it's not a crazy or silly take to think 7 teams are ahead of us.
3
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:25 pm to Epic Cajun
quote:
That was a common take, at least the Falcons portion. Literally no one saw the Saints being as good as they are.
Falcons yes, not a chance with Carolina
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:30 pm to Townedrunkard
quote:
Colin cowherd says hi, he just said a few weeks ago the panthers and falcons were significantly better than the saints.
Falcons I could eventually see if things gel/the league gets some film on
Panthers…..woof
This post was edited on 9/19/24 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:37 pm to shel311
quote:
MEM
This is one i have to see to believe. They've been perpetually injured even more so than us the past two seasons, and I'm not sure they have enough shooting to keep up with most teams.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:38 pm to shel311
quote:
It can be disagreed with, one can think we are in that top 7...but it's not a crazy or silly take to think 7 teams are ahead of us.
It's also not crazy to think we're an late season injury from ingram away from being a top 6 team last year. It came down to the last two games.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:45 pm to WB504
I know Simmons has bad takes but I don’t think he said anything outlandish here at all. Tons of question marks for this team while other teams are still good, improving, or coming back from season riddled injuries.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:46 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
It's also not crazy to think we're an late season injury from ingram away from being a top 6 team last year. It came down to the last two games.
We lost a lot. We basically traded Val, Nance, Daniels and Marshall for Murray, Theis and some rookies/journeyman. We are so much smaller now. It's not the same team..
Posted on 9/19/24 at 12:47 pm to brmark70816
quote:
We lost a lot. We basically traded Val, Nance, Daniels and Marshall for Murray, Theis and some rookies/journeyman. We are so much smaller now. It's not the same team..
It's all on this new version of Zion. If he's in better than end of season shape he'll be a monster mvp level player and it won't matter.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 1:42 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
It's all on this new version of Zion. If he's in better than end of season shape he'll be a monster mvp level player and it won't matter.
You guys are killing me with this. He has to be at 30+/10+/6+ to sniff "MVP level". Is that the expectation?
Posted on 9/19/24 at 1:44 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
It's all on this new version of Zion.
If this is true, we gave him less shooting in the starting lineup, less protection on defense, and another player that needs the ball to be successful. Don't forget we also gave him the worst starting center situation in the league.
I don't understand why we are saying when this iteration of the team fails it will be Zion's fault. We have literally done nothing to accentuate his talents or make his job easier. It is why I won't believe this is our opening night roster until we take the court.
I fully understand why national media members are not high on this team. Objectively, it is a worse fitting team who has a league worst situation at a position. This is the least optimism I have felt going into a season in a long time.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:07 pm to ThePistol
quote:
We have literally done nothing to accentuate his talents or make his job easier.
That is absolutely not true. Murray is a huge get for Zion. He will get him easy looks, he can drive and penetrate for Z to grab oreb/put backs. He's a true pg too.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:09 pm to brmark70816
quote:
He has to be at 30+/10+/6+ to sniff "MVP level". Is that the expectation
You're looking at this from too basic a level. If he's steps up another level on defense (which i expect), and averages 27/7/5, but with incredible efficiency, he'll be an mvp candidate.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:20 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:We were one of the healthier teams on average for the season.
It's also not crazy to think we're an late season injury from ingram away from being a top 6 team last year. It came down to the last two games.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:31 pm to brmark70816
quote:The big loss was Val (mainly because we did not replace him). However, we basically traded some depth for a much needed facilitator.
We lost a lot. We basically traded Val, Nance, Daniels and Marshall for Murray, Theis and some rookies/journeyman. We are so much smaller now. It's not the same team..
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:35 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
That is absolutely not true. Murray is a huge get for Zion. He will get him easy looks, he can drive and penetrate for Z to grab oreb/put backs. He's a true pg too.
By not moving on from Ingram this means that the most likely scenario is that Zion will be on the court with zero plus shooters to start every game. How is that possible in year 6 of the Zion era? Also, with Ingram still here and Murray coming in, that is 3 players that need the ball to be effective in the starting lineup. I was a huge fan of the Murray trade. However, I hate this current roster construction. No viable center, three ball dominant players with minimal ability to effect games off ball and your only real shooters relegated to the bench is not a recipe for success.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:44 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
You're looking at this from too basic a level. If he's steps up another level on defense (which i expect), and averages 27/7/5, but with incredible efficiency, he'll be an mvp candidate.
No. He won't. Look at the MVP contenders from last season. They are putting up insane numbers. 27/7/5 isn't getting him in the top 8. Contender to me means top 3-5. Maybe we are just having a difference of definition..
Posted on 9/19/24 at 3:44 pm to whatiknowsofar
quote:
You're looking at this from too basic a level. If he's steps up another level on defense (which i expect), and averages 27/7/5, but with incredible efficiency, he'll be an mvp candidate.
If we don't finish top 3ish in the league, then he'd have to do something unprecedented to win MVP. 27/7/5 wouldn't cut it with a 50 win team.
Jokic - 2nd best record 57 wins
Embiid - 3rd best record 54 wins
Jokic - 10th best record 48 wins (only real outlier in the last 20 years)
Jokic - 5th best record 47 wins (72 game season)
Giannis - Best record 56 wins (72 game season)
Giannis - Best record 60 wins
Harden - Best record 65 wins
Westbrook - 10th best record 47 wins, first triple double average in 55 years since Big O
Curry - Best record 73 wins
Curry - Best record 67 wins
Durant - 2nd best record 59 wins
Lebron - Best record 66 wins
Lebron - 4th best record 46 wins (66 game season)
Derrick Rose - Best record 62 wins
Lebron - Best record 61 wins
Lebron - Best record 66 wins
Kobe - 3rd best record 57 wins (lifetime achievement award b/c CP3 should have won it)
Dirk - Best recrod 67 wins
Nash - 3rd best record 54 wins
Nash - Best record 62 wins
Garnett - 2nd best record 58 wins
so other than the Jokic 2022 MVP and Westbrook first triple double season average in 55 year MPV season, no one has won the MVP winning less 54 games in the last 20 years.
and yeah i know you said "candidate" but to seriously be in the conversation your team better be good. You think we are winning 54 games this year?
Posted on 9/19/24 at 4:08 pm to NOSHAU
quote:
The big loss was Val (mainly because we did not replace him). However, we basically traded some depth for a much needed facilitator.
All 4 of those guys played at least 60 games and averaged 19mpg or more. That's a ton of minutes/production to replace.
Also, Murray is our best option at PG and he's a slight upgrade. But I don't get the notion that he's the next Jason Kidd (I stole that from Simmons). He didn't play PG for the Hawks. It doesn't worry anyone else that it didn't work with the Hawks? By all logic, that should have been a great pairing. They dumped him 2 years later. That doesn't seem weird to anyone else?
Posted on 9/19/24 at 5:07 pm to brmark70816
quote:
Also, Murray is our best option at PG and he's a slight upgrade. But I don't get the notion that he's the next Jason Kidd (I stole that from Simmons). He didn't play PG for the Hawks. It doesn't worry anyone else that it didn't work with the Hawks? By all logic, that should have been a great pairing. They dumped him 2 years later. That doesn't seem weird to anyone else?
He played PG for San Antonio and was awesome. Then, he went to ATL and was put in a SG role and it didn't work.
We are going to have him play PG, so no, I am not worried in the slightest that it didn't work out with the Hawks.
Posted on 9/19/24 at 5:32 pm to ThePistol
quote:
If this is true, we gave him less shooting in the starting lineup, less protection on defense, and another player that needs the ball to be successful. Don't forget we also gave him the worst starting center situation in the league.
I don't understand why we are saying when this iteration of the team fails it will be Zion's fault. We have literally done nothing to accentuate his talents or make his job easier.
One of us is on crazy pills.
What did JV do for Zion except get in his way? We specifically let JV go because he was such a bad fit with Zion. The reason that we let him go was that our starting unit was a net negative with him in it. That's why we couldn't play him at the end of games. Because JV was a negative with our starters.
Theis is not a better player than JV, but he's a better fit for us and would improve our starting unit, even without Murray. The ability of Theis to pop out for 3s will help create space for Zion on the interior. And then there's this:
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here. The #1 reason that we lost our playoff series to OKC as bad as we did was that JV couldn't set a good enough screen to get Lu Dort off of BI. Now, you can say that BI should be able to take care of Dort on his own, and I don't disagree, but it's a fact that JV does not set good screens and he desperately needed good screens in that series.
Good screens will also make Zion's life a lot easier, because it will mean less contact -- less wear and tear on his body. Zion and Murray excel in iso situations and don't need screens to be successful, but good screens mean that someone else is taking more of the contact, and we've often talked about how Zion can't really take a beating all night every night.
And CJ was a top-ten scorer in the league last season off of screens. CJ can be very effective with good screens, and JV couldn't provide those.
And Theis was an above average defender last season. He's a far, far better defender than JV was. The days are over of opposing PGs getting repeated easy runs to the rim to start games.
It just blows my mind that we're still seeing all this nostalgia for JV. It was definitely fun watching him beat up on guys like Sabonis, but he wasn't a good starting center for us, and Theis is a better starting center for us with the guys we have on our roster.
This post was edited on 9/19/24 at 6:53 pm
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