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Message
re: Herb Jones Bandwagon
Posted on 1/26/23 at 5:58 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
Posted on 1/26/23 at 5:58 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
quote:
Playing Herb at the four (as a backup) is a role he should be considered for.
Last night going small in the late second and third basically lost the game for the Pels. There were other issue but that lineup lost all the momentum.
In an article extolling the virtues of Edwards driving ability, Aiden Berg of SB Nation pointed out “[s]even of his eight shots from the 4:45 mark in the second quarter to 9:46 in the third were rim attacks” which happens to coincide exactly with when the Pels put 3 wings out with JV and CJ. The result was a free for all race to the rim because the secondary defenders can’t protect it.
Sometimes going small works, and the Pels have played some great ball with those lineups, but it hasn’t worked at all when the wings weren’t making up for the D by scoring.
1
Posted on 1/26/23 at 7:35 pm to BamaPelican
I beat a dead horse on this board but I think Coach Green is so out on Hayes that he forgets he’s the only big the Pels have that can move his feet.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 7:56 pm to Pistol44
quote:
I beat a dead horse on this board but I think Coach Green is so out on Hayes that he forgets he’s the only big the Pels have that can move his feet.
This time of year...serious contenders start looking for that defensive player that can make a difference in playoffs. Just not sure there's a "big" out there... that can help the Pels in that respect. At least not one that is cost effective. I expect Pels to remedy this situation...by next year.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 8:11 pm to Dinky Mulberry
That’s my point on Hayes, he could be cost effective but he gets no consistent run. When Pels were rolling there was a case for him being out of the rotation, but if Nance is less than 100% and you are getting rolled over the past 15 games really not a reason not have him get significant minutes. Same with Kira except insert Devonte as being less than 100%
Posted on 1/26/23 at 8:54 pm to Pistol44
quote:
I beat a dead horse on this board but I think Coach Green is so out on Hayes that he forgets he’s the only big the Pels have that can move his feet.
If Larry isn’t playing the 4 at all, then Jax simply has to play or the Pels can’t protect the rim and struggle rebounding, which is particularly bad if the Pels are missing shots and need to get some offensive boards.
Sometimes they can’t do those things even with Hayes, since he is pretty inconsistent, but the Trey/Herb/Naji at small ball 4 experiments have mostly fallen flat.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 8:55 pm to Pistol44
quote:
That’s my point on Hayes, he could be cost effective but he gets no consistent run.
Yep...but I think sometimes it reaches a point where a Coach just doesn't trust a player to try & do what he's suppose to do on the court while some other guy might not physically be able to handle the job but at least he gives a solid effort.
I fear Hayes may have entered that dreaded "can't be trusted" zone. Some Coaches just WILL NOT back off...and probably rightfully so...& it will take quite a bit for that player to regain that trust...& I'm not sure Hayes has what it takes...to regain it.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 9:00 pm to Pistol44
With the play-in we know there are less sellers and more buyers. Even those at 13th are buying.
Doesn’t bode well for a big who can defend and shoot market.
Collins is linked for a reason.
Doesn’t bode well for a big who can defend and shoot market.
Collins is linked for a reason.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 9:05 pm to ThanosIsADemocrat
Yeah I don’t think green is the biggest JV fan. Or at least has a ton of trust in him late game. I think we rank dead last in rim protection
Posted on 1/26/23 at 9:14 pm to Macintosh
quote:
Yeah I don’t think green is the biggest JV fan. Or at least has a ton of trust in him late game. I think we rank dead last in rim protection
I think we would’ve won the game Tuesday night if he put in JV on the final play.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 9:18 pm to Macintosh
quote:
I think we rank dead last in rim protection
It’s on Willy…teams have figured out the formula…(1) run off Pels misses, and in the half court (2) pull JV away from the basket and put him in a P&R, then drive hard and finish over one of Trey/Herb/Naji/CJ/Jose at the rim.
Can’t blame teams for doing it. Everyone knows JV’s biggest weakness is moving his feet on D and Willy keeps leaving him on an island as the only big (although he does it to Larry and Billy too).
Posted on 1/26/23 at 9:39 pm to Dinky Mulberry
quote:
Hayes may have entered that dreaded "can't be trusted" zone.
I get it, but stop wasting a roster spot, be done with it and get a warm body, even a rental because you still have the glaring hole particularly come playoffs, even with a healthy squad. I’m with Bama, this is way more a problem than another shooter.
This post was edited on 1/26/23 at 9:41 pm
Posted on 1/26/23 at 10:27 pm to Pistol44
quote:
I get it, but stop wasting a roster spot, be done with it and get a warm body, even a rental because you still have the glaring hole particularly come playoffs, even with a healthy squad. I’m with Bama, this is way more a problem than another shooter.
My preference is to do what Fun Bunch said the other day and get someone that kills two birds with one stone. Bigger guys like, Jalen McDaniel, Kelly Olynyk, Trey Lyles, Mike Muscala, maybe Mo Bamba, Naz Reid, have a contract value that could reasonable come off the bench, but can provide some interior D (blocks/steals) and are competent shooters.
Posted on 1/26/23 at 10:47 pm to BamaPelican
I want no bamba. However I’m coming around to the idea of John Collins if he is cool with coming off the bench. Graham jax Kira gets us close. Throw in a lottery protected 1st. Collins is a good rebounder, has been a good 3pt shooter every year except for this year, and can protect the rim a little. I think it’s a low cost move and he could be flipped next trade deadline if it doesn’t workout
This post was edited on 1/26/23 at 10:48 pm
Posted on 1/27/23 at 6:33 am to Balsamic_duck
Hawks have been trying to trade him for three years. If he’s that good why? And why would he be easy to flip for us but not them?
Posted on 1/27/23 at 6:47 am to Balsamic_duck
quote:
I want [M]o bamba. However I’m coming around to the idea of John Collins if he is cool with coming off the bench. Graham jax Kira gets us close.
Something like (1) DG and a 1st for Bamba, or (2) DG, Jax, Temple, and a first and second for Bamba and Ross, both work from a money standpoint. The Magic reportedly are looking for a 1st to get Bamba and Ross is likely a 2nd since he is on an expiring.
Collins is undoubtedly a good player, he is just so expensive at $25-26mm per year for 3 more years.
This post was edited on 1/27/23 at 6:51 am
Posted on 1/27/23 at 7:58 am to Balsamic_duck
quote:Basically his entire issue with ATL is he used to be a 23 and 11 guy and now his role is diminished. It doesn't seem likely he'd want to come here and have the same diminished role he is unhappy with now.
However I’m coming around to the idea of John Collins if he is cool with coming off the bench
I worry about the fit also. Offensively, it's great. But Zion and Collins as your 4 & 5s...not good defensively.
Posted on 1/27/23 at 8:43 am to shel311
John Collins is a good rim protector.
Posted on 1/27/23 at 8:52 am to Epic Cajun
I could be persuaded, but I was under the impression that the John Collins as backup/closing center was largely a failed one and that is why they ultimately abandoned it?
That he is a solid weakside defender but that he struggles to anchor when asked. And that is ultimately what we'd need from him come playoff time.
That he is a solid weakside defender but that he struggles to anchor when asked. And that is ultimately what we'd need from him come playoff time.
Posted on 1/27/23 at 9:20 am to Epic Cajun
quote:I was not aware of that. is that something only this season or that he has posted good rim protection stats yearly?
John Collins is a good rim protector.
Rebounding would be an issue with our would be 4 and 5 ranking 40th and 50th in rebounding rate. That would be a problem.
Posted on 1/27/23 at 9:31 am to shel311
Sorry, forgot my sarcasm font. There was an argument on here a couple months ago with someone attempting to persuade us that he was a good rim protector. He is not 
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