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re: Why are the SW prequels fair game for criticism, but TFA somehow sacred?
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:22 pm to fr33manator
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:22 pm to fr33manator
Yeah, Phasma had no point, and I thought the name was kind of stupid too.
I fully expect there to be gay marriage in the next one. Nothing says Star Wars like dudes getting hitched.
I fully expect there to be gay marriage in the next one. Nothing says Star Wars like dudes getting hitched.
2
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:24 pm to Antonio Moss
I just don't understand why some people, not just on here, but elsewhere, keep harping on the similarities of the new movie with the original trilogy. It is obvious to me that this backtracking was absolutely necessary after the prequels to re-establish credibility before they can go off on tangents in the next two. With the standalone films there will be plenty of opportunity to flesh out the universe as well. Let's face it, had they completely gone in a different direction, just as many, if not more, people would have complained about how it wasn't "star wars".
The other thing that gets me is that people keep complaining about the death star as the mechanical embodiment of power too great for any "human" to wield. No shite they use the same thing, what could be worse than that? However, the key to understanding why the trope is unimportant in the whole scheme of things is that evil/dark side continues to exist after its destruction every time. That is the true antagonist in these films, and in life in general. Does anyone care to complain about how evil/dark side is always the bad guy?
Maybe it is because I spent literally years of my life studying myth and archaeology, but tropes don't bother me when the characters are as interesting to follow as the ones are in these films. One reason: all myth is based on tropes. You see the same themes in myths and origin stories in every culture, just slightly modified. It is why we as humans are emotionally attached to these stories.
One last point, I for one have no problem with the Finn character- I think he is a very important part of the universe- not the born hero so to speak, but the one that is "human", has fears, has doubts, but when he actually connects with other people, his ties allow him to overcome his fears. I just wonder if so many don't like him because they are far closer to him in reality than the born-heros. Hell, maybe he isn't a hero at all- just a guy trying to find himself in the universe, which is fine with me as well. This series needed his type as much as the others.
The other thing that gets me is that people keep complaining about the death star as the mechanical embodiment of power too great for any "human" to wield. No shite they use the same thing, what could be worse than that? However, the key to understanding why the trope is unimportant in the whole scheme of things is that evil/dark side continues to exist after its destruction every time. That is the true antagonist in these films, and in life in general. Does anyone care to complain about how evil/dark side is always the bad guy?
Maybe it is because I spent literally years of my life studying myth and archaeology, but tropes don't bother me when the characters are as interesting to follow as the ones are in these films. One reason: all myth is based on tropes. You see the same themes in myths and origin stories in every culture, just slightly modified. It is why we as humans are emotionally attached to these stories.
One last point, I for one have no problem with the Finn character- I think he is a very important part of the universe- not the born hero so to speak, but the one that is "human", has fears, has doubts, but when he actually connects with other people, his ties allow him to overcome his fears. I just wonder if so many don't like him because they are far closer to him in reality than the born-heros. Hell, maybe he isn't a hero at all- just a guy trying to find himself in the universe, which is fine with me as well. This series needed his type as much as the others.
This post was edited on 12/21/15 at 5:25 pm
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:25 pm to fr33manator
Agreed, in general. While I truly did like TFA, there were definite flaws that really bugged me that put it at the bottom of the SW movie rankings for me. That doesn't mean I think it's bad at all. I just love everything Star Wars and am very excited as to where it all goes (along with the spin-offs)!
I think the prequels have had an overly bad reputation pushed upon them which intensified through the years since they were released. I watched them all prior to seeing the TFA, and they hold up very well IMO. Do they have issues? Of course, but so does the OT and TFA. I guess it just depends on what kind of SW you prefer. We all have opinions, and I don't pretend that mine is more valid than anyone else's. Just my two cents...
I think the prequels have had an overly bad reputation pushed upon them which intensified through the years since they were released. I watched them all prior to seeing the TFA, and they hold up very well IMO. Do they have issues? Of course, but so does the OT and TFA. I guess it just depends on what kind of SW you prefer. We all have opinions, and I don't pretend that mine is more valid than anyone else's. Just my two cents...
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:30 pm to fr33manator
B/c the prequels sucked arse and TFA was a good movie. But everyone has the right to there opinion.. And we all know there's plenty of people out there on the internet who relish the opportunity to say they thought a movie sucked that the majority of people enjoyed....
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:34 pm to JumpingTheShark
quote:
The new one is good and the prequels suck.
So everything about the new one is good and everything about the prequels suck?
It's like there's no middle ground with some people.
You've chosen a side (ha. Light and dark) and nothing will sway you.
This post was edited on 12/21/15 at 5:38 pm
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:36 pm to fr33manator
You're just trying too hard now.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:37 pm to fr33manator
The prequels managed to take a great premise and suck the very soul out of it with truly horrendous dialogue, leading to mostly bad acting. Having sucked the soul out of the story, they did themselves no favors by putting everything in front of a green screen, which only rendered it even more cold and unemotional.
The fact they were trying to tell the story of one of the greatest emotional turnabouts in cinematic history while doing the above just makes them irredeemable in my opinion.
The fact they were trying to tell the story of one of the greatest emotional turnabouts in cinematic history while doing the above just makes them irredeemable in my opinion.
This post was edited on 12/21/15 at 5:41 pm
Posted on 12/21/15 at 5:40 pm to AlxTgr
quote:What is trolling to you?
No, I don't think you do.
quote:Did I say differently?
Activity has little to do with trolling. A troll can be one post.
This post was edited on 12/21/15 at 5:41 pm
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:09 pm to blueboy
Wow, these threads are pretty funny. Some of the over-the-top comments just boggle the mind.
For some odd reason, I remember the review in the papers of Star Wars when it came out.
King Arthur in space; mindless swashbuckling adventures, implausible last-second escapes, a bland and unoriginal storyline that doesn't match the epic visuals. A good popcorn flick, but overall, just pointless fun lacking substance. Compared to Speilberg's intelligent and equally epic Close Encounters of the Third Kind, this is just a roller coaster ride, exciting while it's going, but easily forgotten afterwards. 3 stars out of 5. Think it was written up by Rex Reed, I could be wrong.
That seems to be the major gripe on this film too.
For some odd reason, I remember the review in the papers of Star Wars when it came out.
King Arthur in space; mindless swashbuckling adventures, implausible last-second escapes, a bland and unoriginal storyline that doesn't match the epic visuals. A good popcorn flick, but overall, just pointless fun lacking substance. Compared to Speilberg's intelligent and equally epic Close Encounters of the Third Kind, this is just a roller coaster ride, exciting while it's going, but easily forgotten afterwards. 3 stars out of 5. Think it was written up by Rex Reed, I could be wrong.
That seems to be the major gripe on this film too.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:13 pm to Scoob
quote:
A good popcorn flick, but overall, just pointless fun lacking substance.
Was he wrong?
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:13 pm to SoGaFan
quote:There's a difference between having similarities and basically doing the exact same shite they did in the OT.
I just don't understand why some people, not just on here, but elsewhere, keep harping on the similarities of the new movie with the original trilogy. It is obvious to me that this backtracking was absolutely necessary after the prequels to re-establish credibility before they can go off on tangents in the next two.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:23 pm to SoGaFan
quote:
One last point, I for one have no problem with the Finn character- I think he is a very important part of the universe- not the born hero so to speak, but the one that is "human", has fears, has doubts, but when he actually connects with other people, his ties allow him to overcome his fears. I just wonder if so many don't like him because they are far closer to him in reality than the born-heros. Hell, maybe he isn't a hero at all- just a guy trying to find himself in the universe, which is fine with me as well. This series needed his type as much as the others.
He is the window the audience has into the Star Wars world.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:45 pm to fr33manator
quote:
Downvote if you agree.
First, kudos on making yourself seem important by making people who don't read everything be in favor of your asinine opinion.
Last, nobody gives a crap you feel butthurt for liking the prequels.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:47 pm to Scoob
quote:Well, history didn't exactly vindicate him. SW is #13 in the AFI's top 100 films of all time.
For some odd reason, I remember the review in the papers of Star Wars when it came out.
King Arthur in space; mindless swashbuckling adventures, implausible last-second escapes, a bland and unoriginal storyline that doesn't match the epic visuals. A good popcorn flick, but overall, just pointless fun lacking substance.
quote:Disagree. My gripes have no similarity to that review, and I don't see it in others' criticisms either.
That seems to be the major gripe on this film too.
Except the "forgettable" part. That has merit.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:49 pm to fr33manator
Bullshite.
The Phantom Menance got the biggest pass in movie history when it opened for the first month. There was tons of praise for it because people were just happy to see Star Wars back.
And then people realized, damn - that sort of really sucked.
TFA has gotten and may get more criticism as time passes.
But Phantom Menance was not panned when it was playing - it was panned later after reflection and the exuberance wore off.
The Phantom Menance got the biggest pass in movie history when it opened for the first month. There was tons of praise for it because people were just happy to see Star Wars back.
And then people realized, damn - that sort of really sucked.
TFA has gotten and may get more criticism as time passes.
But Phantom Menance was not panned when it was playing - it was panned later after reflection and the exuberance wore off.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 6:56 pm to Sellecks Moustache
quote:No, but he missed the overall point, which is that movies are meant to be entertainment. Star Wars became a part of mainstream culture, while countless "brilliant masterpieces" fade into obscurity.
quote:
A good popcorn flick, but overall, just pointless fun lacking substance.
Was he wrong?
Escapism is an achievement unto itself. Plenty (most) of us have enough drama, politics and complex moral problems in our own lives, and have no need or desire to find more manufactured and presented to us. Sometimes we just want to be the hero
Posted on 12/21/15 at 7:05 pm to blueboy
quote:There was a series of comic books that rewrote the original trilogy; it was all the same, until something changed (in one, Luke dies on Hoth before Han can save him).
There's a difference between having similarities and basically doing the exact same shite they did in the OT.
I THINK that's the basic intent of this new set of movies. It all starts very much similar, but there are some subtle differences, and I think things will change a lot, progressing from those differences.
A pure copycat version would have Luke being the old guy bringing Rey in (and introducing her to the Jedi notion), like Kenobi did with Luke.
Solo did instead, and he introduced her to the world of pirates and criminals (some of who are also, apparently, aware of the Force). Maz is running a dive, but is a thousand years old; she probably has a different but equally useful amount of wisdom regarding things, in ways the Jedi would likely not approve of.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 7:33 pm to Scoob
quote:Again, similarities are good, but this was just a Star Wars formula.
I THINK that's the basic intent of this new set of movies. It all starts very much similar, but there are some subtle differences, and I think things will change a lot, progressing from those differences.
quote:It doesn't have to be a pure copycat version to be bad, and I didn't say it was a pure copycat.
A pure copycat version
There's a list of things in the main thread that are straight-up ripped out of the OT, especially Star Wars.
But that wasn't my only problem with it. The writing was bad, some of the actors were terrible, some characters were superfluous and most of the jokes were corny.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 7:49 pm to Smoke7024
quote:
You're just trying too hard now.
Now? That implies that he stopped at some point prior to this.
Posted on 12/21/15 at 8:04 pm to fr33manator
quote:
So everything about the new one is good and everything about the prequels suck?
It's like there's no middle ground with some people
I'm not going to use the T word, but it does seem to me that the above applies to you as well. It seems you predetermined to not like the movie and are shitting on it just for the sake of it. There are legit criticisms you've made but then you make comments like this below that kinda show an all or nothing mentality as well
quote:
Captain Phasma:So cool she rules Star Wars
See, this is the shite I'm talking about.
Her character was awful, had no point, and did nothing at all cool or worthy of any praise besides having a vagina apparently.
This is easily Prequel level garbage but they are acting like it is some great addition.
You link to an interview in USA Today with the actress that played this character. The "So cool she rules Star Wars" line in the headline for said interview and is an exaggeration to draw attention to it. But you are acting like this is some widespread viewpoint. Has this character been discussed? I really didn't even remember her name. As you note she does nothing, so how can she be awful unless you are just looking for things to bash or crying PC because it is a woman? Its like saying the Lt in Star Wars that says to Vader "She'll die before she tells you anything" is an awful character. Its a background character, nothing more. I know it was shown in the trailer, making it seem like a more important character (maybe that was a red herring, maybe it was marketing or maybe she'll have bigger role going forward) That she has a silver, cool looking different uniform is no doubt designed to sell toys but that hardly makes her an awful character, I mean every damn creature we see for 2 seconds in the original cantina scene had a action figure trust me, i got all of them over several birthday's/christmas' back then
This post was edited on 12/21/15 at 8:33 pm
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