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Started By
Message
re: OFFICIAL - The Dark Knight Rises Discussion Thread - *SPOILERS*
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:27 pm to iwyLSUiwy
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:27 pm to iwyLSUiwy
This is a long review but I am writing it at iwyLSUiwy’s request. He wanted to know my main complaint for TDKR but I can’t do fully explain that without going back and looking at the first two movies of the trilogy.
First, let’s go back to Batman Begins. I wholehearted love this movie, it’s one of my favorite movies of all time, and rightfully so. It changed the game for the entire genre of comic book movies by taking a super hero out of the comics and putting him into our world.
How was Batman presented in Batman Begins? Well the title answers that question (and is also very important to the theme of TDK, but we’ll get to that in a second). The entire movie takes the audience on a journey that SHOWS us how Batman literally began. We learn a lot about Bruce Wayne and the concept of what Batman is and is not. Through the movie we learn that Batman
1. Has a legitimate, understandable beginning
2. Represents order and justice
3. Thinks logically as we are shown through his methodical approach
4. Sees the good in others and hopes to inspire.
5. Lives in a realistic universe with rules very similar to ours as created by Nolan – for instance, the bruising from failing, the fear he faces, the gadgets he uses, his limitations, etc
6. He trusts people implicitly, especially Alfred, who seems to always be right
Now let’s move on to TDK. This is where it gets REALLY good in juxtaposition to the above points. We are now introduced to a character named the Joker who:
1. Has no stated beginning
2. Represents chaos and anarchy
3. Thinks seemingly irrational at times and is carefree in his approach
4. Sees people as inherently evil and hopes to bring that evil out in others (see Boat scene)
5. Lives in a realistic universe and turns that realism on the audience as it shows us OUR fears of unpredictability being realized
6. He trusts no one
This really was the genius behind TDK. It was Batman vs The Joker. It was Batman being forced to question everything about himself. It was his ultimately failing and the loss of Rachel that stuck with us and reinforced the reality of this universe. I truly believe the trilogy peaked with the death of Rachel and the capture of the Joker. The third act of TDK is where the trilogy started to slip. You see, this third act was necessary for TDKR as it was one of the major pillars for the plot…aka the Dent Act. This last act seemed to have been forced and rushed into the movie to set up the final movie, but in reality, more time should been given this in its own movie with TDKR being the 4th movie of the series.
First, let’s go back to Batman Begins. I wholehearted love this movie, it’s one of my favorite movies of all time, and rightfully so. It changed the game for the entire genre of comic book movies by taking a super hero out of the comics and putting him into our world.
How was Batman presented in Batman Begins? Well the title answers that question (and is also very important to the theme of TDK, but we’ll get to that in a second). The entire movie takes the audience on a journey that SHOWS us how Batman literally began. We learn a lot about Bruce Wayne and the concept of what Batman is and is not. Through the movie we learn that Batman
1. Has a legitimate, understandable beginning
2. Represents order and justice
3. Thinks logically as we are shown through his methodical approach
4. Sees the good in others and hopes to inspire.
5. Lives in a realistic universe with rules very similar to ours as created by Nolan – for instance, the bruising from failing, the fear he faces, the gadgets he uses, his limitations, etc
6. He trusts people implicitly, especially Alfred, who seems to always be right
Now let’s move on to TDK. This is where it gets REALLY good in juxtaposition to the above points. We are now introduced to a character named the Joker who:
1. Has no stated beginning
2. Represents chaos and anarchy
3. Thinks seemingly irrational at times and is carefree in his approach
4. Sees people as inherently evil and hopes to bring that evil out in others (see Boat scene)
5. Lives in a realistic universe and turns that realism on the audience as it shows us OUR fears of unpredictability being realized
6. He trusts no one
This really was the genius behind TDK. It was Batman vs The Joker. It was Batman being forced to question everything about himself. It was his ultimately failing and the loss of Rachel that stuck with us and reinforced the reality of this universe. I truly believe the trilogy peaked with the death of Rachel and the capture of the Joker. The third act of TDK is where the trilogy started to slip. You see, this third act was necessary for TDKR as it was one of the major pillars for the plot…aka the Dent Act. This last act seemed to have been forced and rushed into the movie to set up the final movie, but in reality, more time should been given this in its own movie with TDKR being the 4th movie of the series.
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 2:45 pm
2
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:28 pm to theunknownknight
That brings us to TDKR. We have Bruce Wayne now ruined in effect, because of his run in with the Joker. He is very distrustful and has removed himself from society for 8 years after the death of Dent. He seems to no longer be needed. Obsolete, he seems to have lost his will to fight and his will to live. This is evident from the many references of him no longer fearing death, no longer fearing anything really.
Bruce Wayne is now:
1. Truly fearless
2. Non-trusting
3. Emotionally detached
We also have a plethora of other characters introduced to the audience late in the game, so to speak.
1. Talia – shown to be the ultimate mastermind behind TDKR. Her goal is to please her father, to finish what he started, to prove her worth.
2. Bane – shown to be everything Batman COULD have been had he stayed in the LOS. A man who is methodical, in the hunt of pure cold justice, a force of nature seeking out a new ORDER for the LOS, protective of those he loves. His “Rachel” is Talia.
3. Daggert – Conniving plot device used to funnel Wayne’s money
4. Foley – a selfish stubborn cop who only looked out for himself. His goal is to survive.
5. Blake – came out of nowhere, the implication is he is much like Bruce Wayne. His goal is to serve the city of Gotham and he is loyal to those he perceives to be his friends.
6. Selina Kyle – Selfish but with a good heart. Looks out for herself, realizes she is in over her head and her goal is to have a fresh start
With all that said, it appears the goal of this movie to show, from a bigger perspective, the lessons learned in Batman Begins on a larger scale. “What do we do when we fall Bruce? We get back up…” Bruce had fallen, figuratively and literally, after his run in with the Joker. He is then confronted by Bane, basically and seemingly evil uninhibited version of his younger self. Aside from a few minor issues, the movie was fantastic up until the point Bane’s (Talia’s) master plan started being enacted. At this point, Nolan begins to bend the very rules in the universe he created by way of characters beginning to act slightly out of character. This was enough to take me out of the movie.
Let’s start with Bane. He is methodical, yet we see him hijack Wall Street with machine guns to make a false trade under Wayne’s stolen fingerprints all under the guise of getting Wayne to trust in Talia to move the plot forward. There are two risky assumptions made here:
1. The SEC would allow this trade to be finalized. In reality, trading would have immediately been shut down and all trades invalidated as witnesses saw Bane tampering with the trades. This removes us from the realistic universe Nolan created.
2. Wayne would suddenly trust Talia, someone he barely knows, without her earning his trust. Keeping with his character at this point, however, he more than likely would have held everything close to the vest, secured the device EVEN MORE, and kept the device hidden monitoring it until he ascertained with real purpose of the threat against him. If anyone came close, he could flood it. This would be expected of Wayne, non-trusting at this point, it would have been a game of chess. But the ENTIRE plot of the movie and Talia hinges on this trust coming from Wayne out of nowhere.
Bane, a reflection of Batman, should have made decisions the audience could follow. When he found the Bat Equipment “off the books” we are left wondering how? When we see hundreds of bombs planted throughout the city, we are left wondering how Bane assumed this would escape the attention of a single authority; we are left wondering how Bane assumed the government would go along with him holding an entire city hostage with a nuclear device? We wonder about Bane’s assumptions regarding the nuclear device after he killed the only guy who truly knew anything about it. What if the nuclear scientist lied to him?
In fact, in Nolan’s realistic universe we are left wondering lots of things in TDKR: Why everyone was able to figure out exactly when the device would explode even though the only guy who knew anything about the device was dead? Why did the nuclear device not create nuclear fallout as it surely would have? Why did it not create a small wave that would have devastated the coast? How did the Bruce’s back heal from a dislocated vertebra in only 5 months of strenuous exercise and taking at least three falls of about 50 feet with a rope tied to his lower back? How did he survive being stabbed in the kidney? How did he escape the bomb? How much did Selina Kyle really know about Batman’s plan to escape Gotham? How so many people were able to sneak into Gotham while under siege but no one was able to get out? Why didn’t the U.S. government send in the SEALS clandestinely to disable the nuke with an EMP, after all, Bane didn’t seem to care that cops were out in the open tagging the Nuke transport vehicles? It would have been very easy to do. How was Wayne’s knee healed with a prosthetic device, he still had no cartilage. It would have been better to establish Wayne was clearly still in pain or that there was some healing serum or pain killer he had to take to put him in direct juxtaposition with Bane (see Batman vs. The Joker). Back to the characters…
Bruce Wayne is now:
1. Truly fearless
2. Non-trusting
3. Emotionally detached
We also have a plethora of other characters introduced to the audience late in the game, so to speak.
1. Talia – shown to be the ultimate mastermind behind TDKR. Her goal is to please her father, to finish what he started, to prove her worth.
2. Bane – shown to be everything Batman COULD have been had he stayed in the LOS. A man who is methodical, in the hunt of pure cold justice, a force of nature seeking out a new ORDER for the LOS, protective of those he loves. His “Rachel” is Talia.
3. Daggert – Conniving plot device used to funnel Wayne’s money
4. Foley – a selfish stubborn cop who only looked out for himself. His goal is to survive.
5. Blake – came out of nowhere, the implication is he is much like Bruce Wayne. His goal is to serve the city of Gotham and he is loyal to those he perceives to be his friends.
6. Selina Kyle – Selfish but with a good heart. Looks out for herself, realizes she is in over her head and her goal is to have a fresh start
With all that said, it appears the goal of this movie to show, from a bigger perspective, the lessons learned in Batman Begins on a larger scale. “What do we do when we fall Bruce? We get back up…” Bruce had fallen, figuratively and literally, after his run in with the Joker. He is then confronted by Bane, basically and seemingly evil uninhibited version of his younger self. Aside from a few minor issues, the movie was fantastic up until the point Bane’s (Talia’s) master plan started being enacted. At this point, Nolan begins to bend the very rules in the universe he created by way of characters beginning to act slightly out of character. This was enough to take me out of the movie.
Let’s start with Bane. He is methodical, yet we see him hijack Wall Street with machine guns to make a false trade under Wayne’s stolen fingerprints all under the guise of getting Wayne to trust in Talia to move the plot forward. There are two risky assumptions made here:
1. The SEC would allow this trade to be finalized. In reality, trading would have immediately been shut down and all trades invalidated as witnesses saw Bane tampering with the trades. This removes us from the realistic universe Nolan created.
2. Wayne would suddenly trust Talia, someone he barely knows, without her earning his trust. Keeping with his character at this point, however, he more than likely would have held everything close to the vest, secured the device EVEN MORE, and kept the device hidden monitoring it until he ascertained with real purpose of the threat against him. If anyone came close, he could flood it. This would be expected of Wayne, non-trusting at this point, it would have been a game of chess. But the ENTIRE plot of the movie and Talia hinges on this trust coming from Wayne out of nowhere.
Bane, a reflection of Batman, should have made decisions the audience could follow. When he found the Bat Equipment “off the books” we are left wondering how? When we see hundreds of bombs planted throughout the city, we are left wondering how Bane assumed this would escape the attention of a single authority; we are left wondering how Bane assumed the government would go along with him holding an entire city hostage with a nuclear device? We wonder about Bane’s assumptions regarding the nuclear device after he killed the only guy who truly knew anything about it. What if the nuclear scientist lied to him?
In fact, in Nolan’s realistic universe we are left wondering lots of things in TDKR: Why everyone was able to figure out exactly when the device would explode even though the only guy who knew anything about the device was dead? Why did the nuclear device not create nuclear fallout as it surely would have? Why did it not create a small wave that would have devastated the coast? How did the Bruce’s back heal from a dislocated vertebra in only 5 months of strenuous exercise and taking at least three falls of about 50 feet with a rope tied to his lower back? How did he survive being stabbed in the kidney? How did he escape the bomb? How much did Selina Kyle really know about Batman’s plan to escape Gotham? How so many people were able to sneak into Gotham while under siege but no one was able to get out? Why didn’t the U.S. government send in the SEALS clandestinely to disable the nuke with an EMP, after all, Bane didn’t seem to care that cops were out in the open tagging the Nuke transport vehicles? It would have been very easy to do. How was Wayne’s knee healed with a prosthetic device, he still had no cartilage. It would have been better to establish Wayne was clearly still in pain or that there was some healing serum or pain killer he had to take to put him in direct juxtaposition with Bane (see Batman vs. The Joker). Back to the characters…
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 2:48 pm
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:28 pm to theunknownknight
We see Talia’s character acting out of the very character defined for her in the movie. Her goal as a character is to please her dead father and to honor him by finishing his work. Yet, she takes Bane back into the LOS, a man exiled by her father.
We see Blake as a plot device, not really a character. He seems to be everywhere figuring everything out and forcing us to ask how and why? If he is to be the next Batman, SHOW us how and why. CONVINCE us he would be a great Batman. Figuring out who Bruce Wayne was by one look isn’t convincing in and of itself. In the vein of Batman, it would have been great to say “I SUSPECTED who you were so I did some more digging over EIGHT years…I have proof now” Again, SHOW us Blake is worthy of the cape.
Foley: He was a good character to a point but was introduced a little too late in the series. That’s all I’ll say about him.
Selina Kyle: She was pretty good but I think it would have been helpful to get some slight insight into where she received her training to maintain the realism Nolan created. The only character in the Batman trilogy that could get away without a back-story was the Joker because not having a back-story REINFORCED his character.
As stated earlier on TD, I get the artistic metaphorical arc of Batman RISING again after falling in TDK. I see how it ties into the grand trilogy and it is a great arc I just wanted that arc in TDKR to follow the semblance of believability and established rules from Batman Begins and for the characters, as established, to act reasonably within their designed character’s framework (like the first two movies). These small inconsistencies added up enough to take me out of the movie as a member of the audience, and once you aren’t in the audience, you are a critic
We see Blake as a plot device, not really a character. He seems to be everywhere figuring everything out and forcing us to ask how and why? If he is to be the next Batman, SHOW us how and why. CONVINCE us he would be a great Batman. Figuring out who Bruce Wayne was by one look isn’t convincing in and of itself. In the vein of Batman, it would have been great to say “I SUSPECTED who you were so I did some more digging over EIGHT years…I have proof now” Again, SHOW us Blake is worthy of the cape.
Foley: He was a good character to a point but was introduced a little too late in the series. That’s all I’ll say about him.
Selina Kyle: She was pretty good but I think it would have been helpful to get some slight insight into where she received her training to maintain the realism Nolan created. The only character in the Batman trilogy that could get away without a back-story was the Joker because not having a back-story REINFORCED his character.
As stated earlier on TD, I get the artistic metaphorical arc of Batman RISING again after falling in TDK. I see how it ties into the grand trilogy and it is a great arc I just wanted that arc in TDKR to follow the semblance of believability and established rules from Batman Begins and for the characters, as established, to act reasonably within their designed character’s framework (like the first two movies). These small inconsistencies added up enough to take me out of the movie as a member of the audience, and once you aren’t in the audience, you are a critic
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 1:59 pm
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:30 pm to Proximo
quote:
As did I; didn't think of the Gladiator end, but that is spot on.
I said it 5 or 6 pages back.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:30 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
This last act seemed to have been forced and rushed into the movie to set up the final movie
What was really rushed about this?
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:34 pm to theunknownknight
Looking forward to reading it but I would say talia's revenge against Bruce is paramount to destroying Gotham which is why she doesn't just blow the bomb as soon as they get it
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:36 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
Disagree. I kinda get what you're saying, but Batman very much got his arse handed to him the first go round with Bane.
It's just an interpretation, but conquering fear, and employing fear as agent of triumph is a major theme in the story arc of all 3 films. And to conquer fear, you have to feel fear.
Given the way he was dominated in the first fight, 5 months of body weight training in a cave isn't likely to give him the required physical strength necessary to defeat Bane (if you assume his failure was due to physical inferiority).
Even in the prison, as Wayne is doing push ups, the doctor tells him it's "not his body", and that a small child made the jump. So victory in this sense was more profound - making the jump (a symbolic rebirth of Batman) and defeating Bane didn't require an augmentation to his strength, it required the redevelopment of his spirit.
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 1:38 pm
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:42 pm to Polar Bear
I agree with just about all of that, but it doesn't change the fact that he got his arse kicked the first time.
Regardless of the reason (he's weaker than bane, his mind wasn't in the right place - maybe even his heart, etc.), he got handed a beatdown of epic proportions.
Regardless of the reason (he's weaker than bane, his mind wasn't in the right place - maybe even his heart, etc.), he got handed a beatdown of epic proportions.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:42 pm to Polar Bear
I can definitely say this movie is far superior upon its second viewing. Looks as though I am not alone in thinking that either.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:44 pm to Ross
quote:
I can definitely say this movie is far superior upon its second viewing. Looks as though I am not alone in thinking that either.
I expect to have some of my issues somewhat alleviated after seeing it a second time. I think when all else is done, and it's 6 months or more from now, I'll have TDKR ranked #2 in the trilogy behind TDK. And like someone pointed out earlier, that's not a slight to any of the movies at all really because I think it's one of the best trilogies ever.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:44 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
He is very distrustful
I'm going to continue reading your post, but felt I needed to respond to this line.
Wayne was recklessly trusting with others in TDKR. He trusted Miranda with the fusion generator, when he could have alternatively destroyed the machine. He trusted Selenna to take him to Bane, despite the fact that she stole his prints for Daggett. He then put his trust in her yet again to take him to Fox, despite the fact that the last time he made such a request, she almost got him killed.
quote:
nd has removed himself from society for 8 years after the death of Den
He hadn't been Batman for 8 years, but he became socially withdrawn because the the fusion project fell through. Miranda mentions this to him at the fundraiser.
The Dent Act resulted in a tranquil crime scene, and no need for Batman, but he detached himself from Wayne Enterprises because he poured money into the clean energy project, which ultimately fell apart.
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:49 pm to theunknownknight
My only issue is I wish the final Bane/Batman battle would've been more epic.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:52 pm to Akit1
quote:
My only issue is I wish the final Bane/Batman battle would've been more epic.
That was one of my two issues.
1. I wish they could've devoted more time to the occupation of Gotham
2. Bane's death, while it was a cool "yay! Catwoman came back, and saved Batman" moment. It was a little anticlimactic.
Probably the only time I'll ever say, I wish a 2 hour and 45 minute movie could've been longer, wish they could've had some more exposition here and there. I actually didn't want the movie to end.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 1:55 pm to Polar Bear
quote:
Wayne was recklessly trusting with others in TDKR. He trusted Miranda with the fusion generator, when he could have alternatively destroyed the machine. He trusted Selenna to take him to Bane, despite the fact that she stole his prints for Daggett. He then put his trust in her yet again to take him to Fox, despite the fact that the last time he made such a request, she almost got him killed.
Exactly my point. He is established as being distrustful for 8 years and suddenly as you say, he is recklessly trustful
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:00 pm to theunknownknight
He had no choice to trust her.
First, he knows that dagget, not Tate, has hired bane and brought him to Gotham. And he saw bane at dagget's building. Furthermore, he cannot allow dagget to take control of Wayne enterprises
Second, he does not want to flood it because the potential for good is extraordinary
Third, Tate has devoted her own resources to continuing the project and he has no reason to suspect she is the head of tLoS because as I said, Dagget is known to be funding and allying himself with Bane
He was still hesitant to trust Tate but made a difficult decision
First, he knows that dagget, not Tate, has hired bane and brought him to Gotham. And he saw bane at dagget's building. Furthermore, he cannot allow dagget to take control of Wayne enterprises
Second, he does not want to flood it because the potential for good is extraordinary
Third, Tate has devoted her own resources to continuing the project and he has no reason to suspect she is the head of tLoS because as I said, Dagget is known to be funding and allying himself with Bane
He was still hesitant to trust Tate but made a difficult decision
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:02 pm to theunknownknight
quote:
At this point, Nolan begins to bend the very rules in the universe he created by way of characters beginning to act slightly out of character. This was enough to take me out of the movie.
Let’s start with Bane. He is methodical, yet we see him hijack Wall Street with machine guns to make a false trade under Wayne’s stolen fingerprints all under the guise of getting Wayne to trust in Talia to move the plot forward. There are two risky assumptions made here:
1. The SEC would allow this trade to be finalized. In reality, trading would have immediately been shut down and all trades invalidated as witnesses saw Bane tampering with the trades. This removes us from the realistic universe Nolan created.
2. Wayne would suddenly trust Talia, someone he barely knows, without her earning his trust. Keeping with his character at this point, however, he more than likely would have held everything close to the vest, secured the device EVEN MORE, and kept the device hidden monitoring it until he ascertained with real purpose of the threat against him. If anyone came close, he could flood it. This would be expected of Wayne, non-trusting at this point, it would have been a game of chess. But the ENTIRE plot of the movie and Talia hinges on this trust coming from Wayne out of nowhere.
I'm deciding to respond to this as I go, instead of reading the entire post and then having to go back and remember how I wanted to reply.
There is a huge, enormous problem with your argument, at least here - you're complaining about character motives, and start with Bane, yet your number one complaint in this area deals not with Bane doing something out of character, but doing something that "wouldn't actually be possible in real life". Ra's al Ghul in Begins wanted to destroy Gotham by vaporizing the city's water supply with a microwave emitter, which is one of the most fantastical concepts in the trilogy.
And, the trust for Talia doesn't come out of "nowhere". He trusted Miranda because, as the film mentioned numerous times, she was the only one for years that backed his funding of the clean energy project. It's not like he closed his eye and chose someone to help him - he went to the one person that showed interest and helped fund his project for years.
This post was edited on 7/23/12 at 2:07 pm
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:05 pm to CGB Spender
quote:
He had no choice to trust her.
Yes...he did. The point of the ENTIRE trilogy ultimately is based on choices, both bad and good. Why arbitrarily take this choice away? Because it's convenient to the plot? No, Wayne, at this point, is paranoid and untrusting. I'd argue that is the Bruce Wayne we all know and love from the comics: keeping things close to the vest, calculating, gathering intel, figuring contingencies, THEN acting. Wayne was becoming that man, then suddenly trusts someone he barely knows with a device that could destroy Gotham?
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:06 pm to theunknownknight
You made some decent points and critiques up until this last paragraph.
I can see your point, but I personally don't have a problem with a character discovering things off the screen. They are possible explanations as to how he discovered the equipment. He was underground for quite some time working on the infrastructure of Gotham, it's plausible that he had been looking for the room for some time before he found. I just don't see that as something that needs to be explained to the audience.
There was a major construction project rebuilding the infrastructure of Gotham. Bane amassed an Army while underground of the lower class of Gotham. It's even said that Bane was giving people work underground. The construction workers had made the concrete explosive while taking on the rebuild of the infrastructure.
He threatened to detonate a nuclear device if anyone entered Gotham.
Well we could also assume everyone in every movie lied.
The guy who was killed is the one who figured out when the device would explode and put a timer on the device counting down its degradation until explotion.
Decent points, I did't find that this hurt the movie, but if it did for you then I'll respect your opinion.
Batman was the only one to sneak in, 3 federal agents snuck in under the guise of delivering supplies but they were quickly killed and hung. Fear of a nuclear bomb prevented people from escaping as well as being executed on the ice if caught.
They tagged the "nuke" once and it was with the "help" of Talia.
So you are ok with a healing serum but not a fancy knee brace device? I mean Batman is known for all his devices.
quote:
Bane, a reflection of Batman, should have made decisions the audience could follow. When he found the Bat Equipment “off the books” we are left wondering how?
I can see your point, but I personally don't have a problem with a character discovering things off the screen. They are possible explanations as to how he discovered the equipment. He was underground for quite some time working on the infrastructure of Gotham, it's plausible that he had been looking for the room for some time before he found. I just don't see that as something that needs to be explained to the audience.
quote:
When we see hundreds of bombs planted throughout the city, we are left wondering how Bane assumed this would escape the attention of a single authority
There was a major construction project rebuilding the infrastructure of Gotham. Bane amassed an Army while underground of the lower class of Gotham. It's even said that Bane was giving people work underground. The construction workers had made the concrete explosive while taking on the rebuild of the infrastructure.
quote:
we are left wondering how Bane assumed the government would go along with him holding an entire city hostage with a nuclear device?
He threatened to detonate a nuclear device if anyone entered Gotham.
quote:
we are left wondering how Bane assumed the government would go along with him holding an entire city hostage with a nuclear device?
Well we could also assume everyone in every movie lied.
quote:
Why everyone was able to figure out exactly when the device would explode even though the only guy who knew anything about the device was dead?
The guy who was killed is the one who figured out when the device would explode and put a timer on the device counting down its degradation until explotion.
quote:
Why did the nuclear device not create nuclear fallout as it surely would have? Why did it not create a small wave that would have devastated the coast? How did the Bruce’s back heal from a dislocated vertebra in only 5 months of strenuous exercise and taking at least three falls of about 50 feet with a rope tied to his lower back? How did he survive being stabbed in the kidney?
Decent points, I did't find that this hurt the movie, but if it did for you then I'll respect your opinion.
quote:
How so many people were able to sneak into Gotham while under siege but no one was able to get out?
Batman was the only one to sneak in, 3 federal agents snuck in under the guise of delivering supplies but they were quickly killed and hung. Fear of a nuclear bomb prevented people from escaping as well as being executed on the ice if caught.
quote:
Bane didn’t seem to care that cops were out in the open tagging the Nuke transport vehicles?
They tagged the "nuke" once and it was with the "help" of Talia.
quote:
It would have been better to establish Wayne was clearly still in pain or that there was some healing serum or pain killer he had to take to put him in direct juxtaposition with Bane
So you are ok with a healing serum but not a fancy knee brace device? I mean Batman is known for all his devices.
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:09 pm to EarthwormJim
quote:
So you are ok with a healing serum but not a fancy knee brace device? I mean Batman is known for all his devices.
The Serum/Pain Killer would have paralleled Bane better
Posted on 7/23/12 at 2:10 pm to Polar Bear
quote:
Bane. He is methodical, yet we see him hijack Wall Street with machine guns to make a false trade under Wayne’s stolen fingerprints all under the guise of getting Wayne to trust in Talia to move the plot forward. There are two risky assumptions made here:
1. The SEC would allow this trade to be finalized. In reality, trading would have immediately been shut down and all trades invalidated as witnesses saw Bane tampering with the trades. This removes us from the realistic universe Nolan created.
Maybe Bane was too busy growing up in an Asian prison, doing terrorist stuff, and securing illegal, diamond mining rights in Africa to care about how the SEC investigates and finalizes trades.
Maybe he didn't care if it bankrupted Bruce Wayne, he just wanted another way to cause him grief. 
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