re: Game of Thrones S5 OFF-SEASON THREAD, NO SPOILERS/BOOKREADERS!

Catelyn's actions were a bit extreme towards Jon. You would think after all those years she'd have gotten over it and accepted him. I'm trying to figure out why she hated him so much besides the obvious. That bedside scene was cold and not like her at all.

So yea Ned not telling her would seem to be inconsistent with his relationship with Catelyn as well. Something's missing.

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But all of a sudden this "Jon Snow heritage" thing seems to be a huge deal, and aside from maybe a line or two from early in season one, there hasn't really been much (if anything) on the show that has even remotely touched on that. Yet it's all people can talk about. That had to come from somewhere else.

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this all this and this some more.

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I like the theories as well, but again, strictly going on info from the show, NO ONE should be posting about it in here. The show has barely said anything about Jon's origins. A theory may be deduced, but certainly not these elaborate theories that these "Hodors" have been posting.

Just my .02

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seriously?

You haven't wondered about John Snow's true origins from the beginning? Ned was the most honorable person on the show and it got him killed. Is it so hard to fathom that he didn't cheat on his wife and that John is really someone else's kid? And if John is Ned's son, it makes you wonder why he just wouldn't say who the mother is and be done with it. That mystery alone makes me question who John's mother is. Then you get the look from red nice titty witch and you have to think, ok there is something up w/ John Snow. He isn't just Ned Stark and some commoner's kid.

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You haven't wondered about John Snow's true origins from the beginning? Ned was the most honorable person on the show and it got him killed. Is it so hard to fathom that he didn't cheat on his wife and that John is really someone else's kid? And if John is Ned's son, it makes you wonder why he just wouldn't say who the mother is and be done with it. That mystery alone makes me question who John's mother is. Then you get the look from red nice titty witch and you have to think, ok there is something up w/ John Snow. He isn't just Ned Stark and some commoner's kid.

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You can wonder about his origins, but it's the specifics that came out in this thread (like the posted from the back of a book) that ppl are referring to. I think it's hilarious that someone would think it's ok to post something straight out of a book in a hodor thread.

I didn't bring in anything.

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You haven't wondered about John Snow's true origins from the beginning?

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I've wondered who his mother was. But they've told us time and time again that he was fathered by Ned Stark, and nothing on the surface has shown us otherwise. Ned was honorable, sure. But even honorable men back could frick up and have a bastard child. And that explains why Catelyn hates JS so much...because he was a child by Ned from outside of her marriage. Like someone said, she's even said straight up that he looks more like Ned than his other children.

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Is it so hard to fathom that he didn't cheat on his wife and that John is really someone else's kid?

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It's not hard to fathom, but why would you doubt it in the first place? Everything on the show, including this week's episode, has pointed to Jon being Ned's bastard. Yet all of a sudden people are coming up with these random theories about him being so-and-so's kid. I find that hard to believe that all of this new information is the result of a single, simple shot of Jon and red titty witch staring at each other for a few seconds. So while that scene could make you wonder what's up with it, it sure as hell isn't gonna lead you to believe that he's the fricking son of Rhaegar Targeryen.

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Uhh, he's not a true born Stark. That's why.

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Once again, Ramsey isn't a true born Bolton. If Ned is raising him as his son, in his home, with his children, it would seem giving him his name would not be out of the question. Then, when Ned goes to King's Landing, Jon goes to the Wall. Wouldn't it seem prudent to have Jon stay and help out? Why does Ned not stop Jon from that Hell hole and keep him protecting the family? Seems odd. Unless he thought Jon would be in danger left at Winterfell without him.

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Robert loved Lyanna and started a war for her that led to him being king.

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Yes. I don't doubt Robert and Ned would have that lengthy talk and walk down to the gravesite IRL. But when filming a tv series, that's a lot of time to waste on a character who is dead. Unless there's something more to it.

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Yall are getting what I said wrong. Jon is my favorite character and I believe he will be really important in the story, but yall are bringing in extracurricular information to justify your theory that otherwise would not be known based on what the show has given us. How do yall not get this?

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I haven't brought in anything except for the NYT recap. And that's already been brought up in this thread. I didn't even know Lyanna's connection to the Targaryen until reading this thread last night. That relationship opens up a whole lot of more possibilities. Witchy-Woman could have seen the future... a Gendry - Jon Battle Royale. House of Baretheon vs House of Targaryen/Stark. (I should be a writer)

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Yes. I don't doubt Robert and Ned would have that lengthy talk and walk down to the gravesite IRL. But when filming a tv series, that's a lot of time to waste on a character who is dead. Unless there's something more to it.

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Or it could be that it was the very first episode and they just wanted to give screen time to establish the history of the two major characters for that season.

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I didn't even know Lyanna's connection to the Targaryen until reading this thread last night.

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And herein lies the problem.

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I've wondered who his mother was. But they've told us time and time again that he was fathered by Ned Stark, and nothing on the surface has shown us otherwise. Ned was honorable, sure. But even honorable men back could frick up and have a bastard child. And that explains why Catelyn hates JS so much...because he was a child by Ned from outside of her marriage. Like someone said, she's even said straight up that he looks more like Ned than his other children.

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When you watch these shows, don't you wonder why certain characters are there? Why the hell is Jon a bastard? We know Gendry's role. But what's Jon's role? You must suck at chess.

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It's not hard to fathom, but why would you doubt it in the first place? Everything on the show, including this week's episode, has pointed to Jon being Ned's bastard. Yet all of a sudden people are coming up with these random theories about him being so-and-so's kid. I find that hard to believe that all of this new information is the result of a single, simple shot of Jon and red titty witch staring at each other for a few seconds. So while that scene could make you wonder what's up with it, it sure as hell isn't gonna lead you to believe that he's the fricking son of Rhaegar Targeryen.

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The look made me think there's something up. The "pedigree" comment in the NYT made me think Robert and Lyanna. The Rhaegar Targeryen connection was completely out of left field from a poster in this thread. But makes sense.

We haven't heard from Gendry at all. Something's up with that. Odd that he'd play such a huge role then vanish. He knows who he is now. I just came up with the thought that witchy was seeing a Gendry - Jon battle. But what if Gendry meets up with his old buddy Arya in Braavos? The two team up and join forces with Jon (rather than fight him) against Stannis. Maybe that's what Witchy sees.

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give him a proper name if he survived

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Really? I don't remember that. I remember her saying that she would just love Jon and treat him as one of her own.

Ramsay being named a Bolton does not equal Jon's situation. Ramsay took a strategic military position for Roose and then rewarded Ramsay for it.

Ned wouldn't just name his bastard a Stark because he raised him with his family. He's named Snow to recognize that he is a high born bastard and even getting that name is rare. You know why Gendry only had a first name? Because Robert didn't recognize him.