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re: so lebron said the world cup is better than the nba finals
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:22 am to shel311
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:22 am to shel311
All arguments evolve when you argue long enough. My stance hasn't changed one bit though. I have used multiple points to support my stance and you guys accuse me of moving the line. Whatever makes you all feel better but like I said the basis of my argument is and has always been that soccer is currently fairly irrelevant in the USA.
It's growing but it has a looooooooooong way to go.
I also posted the premiere league stats which are still horribly low.
If Soccer wasn't irrelevant it wouldn't matter if it were on at 9AM. More than 440K people would be up watching it.
You guys don't have to get mad over it or try to continue to convince me otherwise. Its hard to argue with hard data that I have posted yet no one on the other side of the fence has been able to refute with anything other than hyperbole.
It's growing but it has a looooooooooong way to go.
quote:
I'd think even you'd agree that that's quite the flaw.
I also posted the premiere league stats which are still horribly low.
If Soccer wasn't irrelevant it wouldn't matter if it were on at 9AM. More than 440K people would be up watching it.
You guys don't have to get mad over it or try to continue to convince me otherwise. Its hard to argue with hard data that I have posted yet no one on the other side of the fence has been able to refute with anything other than hyperbole.
1
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:26 am to stout
quote:You were accused by multiple people of moving the line. Maybe you actually moved the line, just a thought
All arguments evolve when you argue long enough. My stance hasn't changed one bit though. I have used multiple points to support my stance and you guys accuse me of moving the line. Whatever makes you all feel better
quote:
You guys don't have to get mad over it
Man, you're all over the place, not very Stout-like, a bit odd.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:34 am to shel311
quote:
You were accused by multiple people of moving the line. Maybe you actually moved the line, just a thought
Where?
My original argument still stands. Using multiple examples and points to support that argument isn't moving the line.
I am accused of moving the line because it's easier to do that and personally attack me like some did than to try and refute the links I posted that have hard data in them supporting what I have been arguing. One guy even threw in the towel instead of trying to counter my points by saying I insulted him when I simply said my point went over his head. That was simply an excuse to end the argument because he had nothing left and he was trying to make me look like the one defeated. That or my point really did go WAY over his head.
quote:
Man, you're all over the place, not very Stout-like, a bit odd.
How is that all over the place? Some people legitimately got mad at me over my stance and were personally attacking me.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:42 am to stout
quote:It is when you don't follow through on 1 part of a debate, completely ignore it, and move on to your next portion of a debate, absolutely that's moving the line. The other dude was still waiting for a response on the EPL stuff, and you just completely ignored it and went on to your next point, to post links to MLS ratings, which had nothing to do with the mini-topic at hand you 2 were discussing.
My original argument still stands. Using multiple examples and points to support that argument isn't moving the line
quote:Yea, I'm really attacking you right now. If that's how you rationalize this, so be it man, have at it.
I am accused of moving the line because it's easier to do that and personally attack me
quote:Well you accused me of being mad or telling me not to be mad, so that seems like a solid time for me to say you're all over the place.
How is that all over the place?
Also, check your post that 2 or 3 people called you on regarding ESPN on page 2 or 3, that was wayyyyyy off, you whiffed on that one, to be honest. It was the epitome of a strawman argument.
This post was edited on 7/14/14 at 7:45 am
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:46 am to shel311
quote:
It is when you don't follow through on 1 part of a debate, completely ignore it, and move on to your next portion of a debate, absolutely that's moving the line.
What? I still think it's easier to find a WNBA game on TV than Soccer and have yet to be proven wrong.
quote:
Yea, I'm really attacking you right now. If that's how you rationalize this, so be it man, have at it.
Did I say you were the one attacking me? Please point to where I said that?
quote:
Well you accused me of being mad or telling me not to be mad,
I never said, Shel311....don't be mad. It was a generalization. Not meant towards you in particular and I said it because some people were mad last night about this whole silly argument.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:46 am to stout
quote:
Fair enough but for it to grow here the average American is going to need a local team to support. I am not educated on Soccer like many of you obviously but outside of the MLS, what other leagues have American teams?
In the meantime, soccer fans here want to watch a good product and that's Euro leagues. MLS isn't going to build up to that kind of product in just a 20 year span (the league officially started in '93) when some Euro league teams have been around since the late 1800s and typically bets the best athletes in their respective countries. And actually getting access to that product with consistency is a pretty new thing.
That said, having played in the 90s even living in a major city, there were limited opportunities for youth soccer. It was basically the Y and maybe in some major cities and out west high school/college squads. And IMO the push was stronger on the women's end because of the success of the US Women's Team at that point. Now you have club teams, indoor/outdoor, MLS, more colleges sanctioning teams instead of just having club soccer, and so on. It's growing and has been for awhile.
Just because it hasn't overtaken firmly rooted sports such as football, basketball, and baseball doesn't mean it's not trending upward as a whole.
This post was edited on 7/14/14 at 7:48 am
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:53 am to stout
It is easier to find WNBA on TV....if you only watch ESPN/espn2. And there are people like that. On top of NBC playing EVERY BPL match, they also show MLS as does ESPN. Univision shows most Liga MX games. If you have ghe sports package, you probably have Bein Sport which shows almost nothing but La Liga, Serie A and Ligue One 24/7. Fox just got the rights to the Bundesliga but that's not until next year. If you think its easier to find a WNBA game you simply are only watching ESPN.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 7:57 am to thesoccerfanjax
quote:
If you think its easier to find a WNBA game you simply are only watching ESPN.
Or I am not actively searching for Soccer games which I admit I am not.
Fair enough and if I am wrong I will conceded that point.
How many games per week do you think you can EASILY catch in the USA. With basic channels like NBC or ESPN. Not having to add the sports package and such?
Just curious.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:00 am to stout
You need satellite to watch many of the channels these games come on. Cox with basic sports package only offers 1 or 2 of the channels.
At least we don't have 1 particular poster trying to argue Houston averages 40k a soccer game again
At least we don't have 1 particular poster trying to argue Houston averages 40k a soccer game again
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:00 am to stout
quote:
Fair enough and if I am wrong I will conceded that point.
well you are wrong
quote:
How many games per week do you think you can EASILY catch in the USA. With basic channels like NBC or ESPN
Once the season starts 10-15 easy. FS1 will show Champions league. NBC will show EPL and you can stream any match online. ESPN will still have MLS
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:01 am to stout
A minimum of 11. Every BPL game + at least one MLS.
Eta: Univision shows several Liga MX games also, so I'm just gonna say 13.
Eta: Univision shows several Liga MX games also, so I'm just gonna say 13.
This post was edited on 7/14/14 at 8:03 am
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:02 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
FS1 will show Champions league. NBC will show EPL and you can stream any match online. ESPN will still have MLS
I asked for basic programming and never even mentioned streaming.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:03 am to thesoccerfanjax
quote:
A minimum of 11. Every BPL game + at least one MLS.
So about the same amount of WNBA games one can catch during the week give or take?
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:04 am to stout
frick if I know. All I know is I can count one one hand how many I've ever accidentally come across.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:05 am to thesoccerfanjax
Funny...I can say the same for soccer games
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:05 am to stout
Most hardcore soccer fans have favorite teams overseas. MLS is just starting to grow within that base. I have a hard time picking an MLS team so I watch it casually.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:11 am to stout
So did you avoid your TV for the last month or actually watch soccer on purpose?
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:14 am to hendersonshands
quote:
Most hardcore soccer fans have favorite teams overseas.
Yea I understand that but hardcore is the key word. You know how the average dumb American is. They are going to need home teams to root for in order for it to grow more IMO.
quote:
MLS is just starting to grow within that base. I have a hard time picking an MLS team so I watch it casually.
I have tried to watch Soccer, but it just doesn't appeal to me home team or not. I feel the same way about baseball. Neither one do anything for me. I do like to go to baseball games, but it's not a sport I will actively follow or watch on TV.
Like I said earlier, to each their own, and at no point was I ever bashing soccer or fans of it. I was just pointing out that, as it currently stands, it still has a long way to go to be a permanent fixture with any relevance in the USA.
I don't think many can really argue with that.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:16 am to thesoccerfanjax
I didn't watch a single World Cup match actually.
I just don't care for soccer.
But if you are using the world cup as an argument as to why soccer isn't irrelevant in the USA then that is a very flawed argument and I already pointed out why earlier in the thread.
I just don't care for soccer.
But if you are using the world cup as an argument as to why soccer isn't irrelevant in the USA then that is a very flawed argument and I already pointed out why earlier in the thread.
Posted on 7/14/14 at 8:21 am to stout
The only thing I think you got wrong is how easy it is to find soccer on TV. During the Premier League season, it's almost hard to avoid. My favorite league is coming to Fox in 2015 as well. It's going to be everywhere within 10 years.
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