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re: Should the Thunder have traded Harden?
Posted on 5/16/13 at 1:29 am to VerlanderBEAST
Posted on 5/16/13 at 1:29 am to VerlanderBEAST
Should have kept Harden and Ibaka traded Westbrook and thats not hindsight because he got hurt. KD Ibaka Harden is just a better fit basketball wise.
0
Posted on 5/16/13 at 1:32 am to DrSteveBrule
quote:
That's true, but the Harden trade was widely criticized when it happened.
quote:
Simmons hated the trade from the beginning. Said OKC should resign him before he was traded.
I'll give the guy credit for calling it, but if Westbrook is still there, are we having this discussion? It's a cliche comment but the media (any media) is so unbelievably "I told you so" bullshite that I really, at 27, can't take any of them seriously. Call me jaded.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 1:33 am to okietiger
quote:
Ibaka is overrated?
He is a good 4th man. That's all he will ever be.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 1:38 am to kfizzle85
quote:
I'll give the guy credit for calling it, but if Westbrook is still there, are we having this discussion
Yes, this conversation happens unless the Thunder would have managed to win the title.
Trading away one of the key players of a young team that made the finals, is the issue with the trade.
People like Simmons who criticized the trade, aren't saying "told you so" bc they lost to Memphis. That can be chalked up to the Westbrook injury.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 8:10 am to jacks40
It was a terrible trade and I'm not sure how there is any debate. Last night matters a lot less than the long term with the trade. Without Westbrook, they probably weren't winning the title this year. But without Harden, they went from a team that was likely to win at least one title (maybe multiple titles) to a team where that is unlikely (far from impossible, but not likely). The Harden trade decreased their chances at a championships (not to mentioned multiple championships), which is the main reason you buy/ follow a team in the first place.
ETA: This is completely off topic and has likely been posted elsewhere, but I was impressed with the OKC fans cheering for the team after they lost last night. We have seen them be an incredible fanbase when things were going well, but that is a lot harder when you lose in disappointing fashion. A pretty awesome fanbase there.
ETA: This is completely off topic and has likely been posted elsewhere, but I was impressed with the OKC fans cheering for the team after they lost last night. We have seen them be an incredible fanbase when things were going well, but that is a lot harder when you lose in disappointing fashion. A pretty awesome fanbase there.
This post was edited on 5/16/13 at 8:13 am
Posted on 5/16/13 at 8:33 am to emmanuellewis
Why is no one mentioning Harden's absolute no-show vs the Heat and low scoring efficiency vs OKC in the first round?
Posted on 5/16/13 at 8:36 am to kfizzle85
quote:Pretty sure Simmons was hating on this trade right when it was made, as a lot of folks were.
Media, the King of 20-20 hindsight. Good article, all media in all forms can go f themselves though
Posted on 5/16/13 at 9:05 am to shel311
What about the horrible trade that sent Jeff Green to Boston for Perkins?
Posted on 5/16/13 at 9:09 am to okietiger
quote:
Why is no one mentioning Harden's absolute no-show vs the Heat and low scoring efficiency vs OKC in the first round?
Because those 2 things are extremely small samples.
Look at Harden's larger body of work and those 2 incredibly small samples are not indicative of the player he is.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 10:07 am to jacks40
quote:HA! I seem to remember a thread last summer praising Sam presti and his brilliance of building a team with 4 top 4 picks in the draft. I was lampooned for suggesting we wait to see what he does with all these contracts on the horizon before crowning his arse. Quite the fall from grace he's experiencing...
They lose both Harden and Ibaka that GM is going to look real bad.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 10:47 am to okietiger
quote:
Why is no one mentioning Harden's absolute no-show vs the Heat and low scoring efficiency vs OKC in the first round?
And I don't hear you saying anything about Harden being the closer in the Dallas, LA Lakers, and San Antonio series last year. He was great for OKC on their run to the finals. He just laid an egg in the finals (Also, it can't be forgotten that he was only 22 years old). It was much more of an exception than the rule. James Harden is very good and what brought OKC to that next level.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 10:59 am to DrSteveBrule
quote:
I didn't see anyone with the ability to create a shot other than Durant after Westbrook went down. Their offense was putrid.
Fisher and Ibaka did...they just missed everything. EVERYTHING
quote:
The Inside the NBA guys think Harden wouldn't have made a difference, but I think he would have.
Well, they are stupid. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Dude scored 20 a game off the bench in the playoffs last year and they think that wouldn't make a difference over a 40 year old guard that can't score?
And to the big man point, collison had a decent game and Ibaka is usually a good shooter, but he was trash last night.
But to answer, they should have traded Ibaka and kept harden. Collison is good enough.
This post was edited on 5/16/13 at 11:01 am
Posted on 5/16/13 at 10:59 am to ThePistol
You're dismissing the opening round for Harden. Points were there, but efficiency was low.
And yes, he played very well up to the Finals, especially against San Antonio.
I wanted to keep Harden, but I am fairly certain he wanted to be the star of his own team. I don't necessarily blame him. I'm just curious to see how it goes for him once Houston adds another piece or two.
And yes, he played very well up to the Finals, especially against San Antonio.
I wanted to keep Harden, but I am fairly certain he wanted to be the star of his own team. I don't necessarily blame him. I'm just curious to see how it goes for him once Houston adds another piece or two.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 11:02 am to okietiger
Moves like that are why the Rockets have two championships in their history and the Thunder are still a long way from their first.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 11:08 am to okietiger
No one really knows if Harden would have been content playing third fiddle for much longer but OKC really needed to try harder to keep him.
The Westbrook-Harden-Durant combo is what made OKC a lethal team. Ibaka is a nice player, but given the defensive attention those other three received, there are many other players that could have filled his role.
Ibaka got overrated because of the rest of the dogshit front court they surrounded the Big 3 with. They basically couldn't let their only decent big man go.
The Westbrook-Harden-Durant combo is what made OKC a lethal team. Ibaka is a nice player, but given the defensive attention those other three received, there are many other players that could have filled his role.
Ibaka got overrated because of the rest of the dogshit front court they surrounded the Big 3 with. They basically couldn't let their only decent big man go.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 11:13 am to TigerStripes06
quote:When was the last time Fisher was able to create his own shot?
Fisher and Ibaka did
Posted on 5/16/13 at 11:14 am to shel311
2001
Posted on 5/16/13 at 11:41 am to mattz1122
Bill Simmons is the most overrated and least talented writer.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 12:27 pm to SabiDojo
I think the Thunder are in a good position.
Without Harden they are still the number one seed.
I think they made the best basketball move they could make. Remember Ibaka main role was as a defender, his added offensive game is just extra.
Also Martin expires, you can amnesty Perkins if you like, that clears up cap room, not to mention you still have Jeremy Lamb and Perry Jones III brewing in the wings. Also two first round draft picks that could be trade bait.
They are fine, what choice did they really have? Ibeka did not take max money, but Harden wanted max money plus starting minutes, two things the Thunder could not give him. He wanted out and I think everyone knew it, they just kind of went through the song and dance with him.
Without Harden they are still the number one seed.
I think they made the best basketball move they could make. Remember Ibaka main role was as a defender, his added offensive game is just extra.
Also Martin expires, you can amnesty Perkins if you like, that clears up cap room, not to mention you still have Jeremy Lamb and Perry Jones III brewing in the wings. Also two first round draft picks that could be trade bait.
They are fine, what choice did they really have? Ibeka did not take max money, but Harden wanted max money plus starting minutes, two things the Thunder could not give him. He wanted out and I think everyone knew it, they just kind of went through the song and dance with him.
Posted on 5/16/13 at 12:39 pm to bigpetedatiga
Yeah, they improved their offensive efficiency this year, were the first seed in a loaded Western Conference, all the while losing Harden near the end of training camp.
Thunder will be fine. Can't wait for 2014 in The Peake.
Thunder will be fine. Can't wait for 2014 in The Peake.
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