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Message
re: Is Kobe Bryant a Top 10 All Time Great Player
Posted on 6/15/13 at 10:16 am to SPEEDY
Posted on 6/15/13 at 10:16 am to SPEEDY
quote:
Yes. Kobe wil force some terrible shots when he is tripled teamed, but just as many of those shots are taken at the end of the shot clock when he has no choice.
This goes for every elite perimeter player.
quote:Well he can't be rewarded for taking bad shots, that is a negative.
People keep referring to Kobe's shooting percentage as a negative. But he takes an extremely high number of difficult shots a game.
quote:Just likewwith jordan and Lebron, that happens for them too.
That scenario happens a few times a game.
1
Posted on 6/15/13 at 10:22 am to shel311
We all agree Kobe is very good at making difficult shots, but he shouldn't get graded on a curve because of that. You don't get extra points for making the game more difficult for yourself.
All the other top of the mountain players are also very efficient, high volume players. It's not a coincidence. His lack of high efficiency should hurt his argument considering we're talking about the best of the best and little differences like that have to be taken into account at some point.
All the other top of the mountain players are also very efficient, high volume players. It's not a coincidence. His lack of high efficiency should hurt his argument considering we're talking about the best of the best and little differences like that have to be taken into account at some point.
This post was edited on 6/15/13 at 10:23 am
Posted on 6/15/13 at 10:30 am to mikelowery1911
Kobe is better than Bird
Posted on 6/15/13 at 10:39 am to ItNeverRains
Career averages:
Bird:
24/10/6 on 49/37/88 shooting
Kobe:
25/5/5 on 45/33/83 shooting
Kobe is not better than Bird.
Bird:
24/10/6 on 49/37/88 shooting
Kobe:
25/5/5 on 45/33/83 shooting
Kobe is not better than Bird.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:27 am to ItNeverRains
Kobe - great scorer, compiler - been in the league forever...won his MVP his 12th year in the league but never had that all-around "it" factor to evelevate everyone...won titles his 5th, 6th, 7th, 14th and 15th years.
Bird...Rookie of the year, won his first of 3 MVPs his 5th year in the league...titles 3rd, 6th and 8th years...short career compared to Kobe due to back problems...but more impactful and dominating in his prime...trancendant player from 1980 to 1987...had the "it" factor. Bird's game was the whole game of basketball and all its facets to produce a winner..but everyone gets caught up in his shooting or 3-point...but Bird was simply one of the best all-around basketball geniuses to ever play.
Bird...Rookie of the year, won his first of 3 MVPs his 5th year in the league...titles 3rd, 6th and 8th years...short career compared to Kobe due to back problems...but more impactful and dominating in his prime...trancendant player from 1980 to 1987...had the "it" factor. Bird's game was the whole game of basketball and all its facets to produce a winner..but everyone gets caught up in his shooting or 3-point...but Bird was simply one of the best all-around basketball geniuses to ever play.
This post was edited on 6/15/13 at 11:29 am
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:32 am to ItNeverRains
quote:
Kobe is better than Bird
no
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:42 am to tgr4ever
quote:Kobe already has almost 2000 more points in the playoffs than Bird.
Kobe is not better than Bird.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:47 am to beaverfever
quote:
Kobe already has almost 2000 more points in the playoffs than Bird.
Bird is a better playoff performer as well.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:52 am to VerlanderBEAST
His 38 percent career 3 point shooting shrinking to 32 percent might suggest otherwise.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 11:52 am to mikelowery1911
short answer is no
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:13 pm to Tiger n Miami AU83
quote:
I will put Kobe at #5. I think he gets the nod over Magic, Malone, Russell, Dream, Duncan. For the combination of his peak and longevity.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:15 pm to Zamoro10
quote:
...but Bird was simply one of the best all-around basketball geniuses to ever play.
FACT.. Magic, Bird are both better than Kobe........
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:24 pm to mikelowery1911
quote:
I had this debate with a friend earlier. I say no Kobe is a top 15 maybe top 10 player. The biggest drawback for me is that he is very inefficient offensively. This is who I have ahead of him in no particular order. 1. Jordan 2. Bird 3. Magic 4. Shaq 5. Wilt 6. Olajuwon 7. Karl Malone 8. Tim Duncan 9. LeBron 10. Grant Hill (pre injury) 11. Bill Russell 12. Jerry West 13. Oscar Robertson 14. Kareem 15. Dr. J
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:26 pm to theunknownknight
Probably won't be a popular opinion, but I have Bird as the second best player of all-time just ahead of Wilt.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:40 pm to DURANTULA
quote:
Probably won't be a popular opinion, but I have Bird as the second best player of all-time just ahead of Wilt.
Magic >>. Bird.............
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:50 pm to shel311
quote:
Nice rebuttal, I know that's the best you can do
you must really love the heat if you think dwade has been the better player that last two years
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:51 pm to DURANTULA
quote:Damn son
Who gives a shite about Assist to turnover ratio? People associate assists with quality passing way too much. You can be a great passer and not get a lot of assists and you can be a mediocre passer and accumulate a lot of assists.
You want another reason why assists don't matter? You have no control over whether your teammate takes or makes the shot. That'd be like trying to measure a baseball player's hitting ability based on how many times he is driven in for a run after he gets on base. He has literally no control over that.
And to completely bury your asinine attempt at a point, who the frick would pass to Smush Parker, Chris Mihm, Kwame Brown, and Luke Walton? I sure as hell wouldn't.
Game-fricking-cock
This post was edited on 6/15/13 at 12:52 pm
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:58 pm to Louie T
I'm Grant Hill's biggest fan, but his isn't a top 10 player. Obviously had he been healthy the conversation could be different. I remember when the NBA announced it's 50 greatest in 50 years they were doing at the All-Star game in the mid 90s, young Shaq was named to it. Later on Sportscenter during the highlights, Dan Patrick said "If Shaq can be on this list for what he will do,why not Grant Hill?" he was that good as a young player.
That being said, Kobe is a fringe top 10 player. A case for him can go as high as six. His best years were in the early 2000s, man he was a complete player and dominant athletically.
That being said, Kobe is a fringe top 10 player. A case for him can go as high as six. His best years were in the early 2000s, man he was a complete player and dominant athletically.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 12:59 pm to StraightCashHomey21
quote:Or you just really hate the Heat so you have your blinders up and don't realize Kobe was the same guy who shot 43% last season.
ou must really love the heat if you think dwade has been the better player that last two years
last 2 seasons combined, Wade leads Kobe in PER, eFG, TS%, rebound rate, steal%, block%, win shares, win shares per 48.
Like I said, as usual, you have no real rebuttals, you just spew silly comebacks without every actually trying to debate anything, and let's be honest, you know that is true.
Posted on 6/15/13 at 1:07 pm to shel311
quote:
last 2 seasons combined, Wade leads Kobe in PER, eFG, TS%, rebound rate, steal%, block%, win shares, win shares per 48.
Like I said, as usual, you have no real rebuttals, you just spew silly comebacks without every actually trying to debate anything, and let's be honest, you know that is true.
Kobe has more ppg, boards and assist
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