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re: Greg Maddux faced 20,421 batters in his career, only 133 saw a 3-0 count
Posted on 8/4/18 at 7:03 pm to LSUsmartass
Posted on 8/4/18 at 7:03 pm to LSUsmartass
One of my favorite Maddux stats:
8. Greg Maddux+ (23) 355 R
9. Roger Clemens (24) 354 R
Sticking around to make sure you have one more win than a steroid user so you are the GOAT of your generation
8. Greg Maddux+ (23) 355 R
9. Roger Clemens (24) 354 R
Sticking around to make sure you have one more win than a steroid user so you are the GOAT of your generation
0
Posted on 8/4/18 at 7:10 pm to Rhino5
quote:
He also had the quickest complete game. The game started at 7:05pm and ended at 8:50pm. 102 pitches with 13 strikeouts.
They played a nine-inning game in less than an hour back in the early 1920s.
ETA. 1919. Giants 6 Phillies 1.
This post was edited on 8/4/18 at 7:27 pm
Posted on 8/4/18 at 7:30 pm to ZZTIGERS
quote:
Zack Godley has 7 more wins than deGrom this season,
Yea, cause it makes complete sense to compare 1 season
to a guy who pitched 20+ seasons,had over 3,000 K's and
had an ERA of 3.10
quote:
Wins should never be factored into a pitcher’s value,
It is if said pitcher has over 130 more wins to the other pitcher he's being compared to
Holy Mother of God,where do you people come from?
Posted on 8/4/18 at 8:05 pm to RD Dawg
quote:
Yea, cause it makes complete sense to compare 1 season
Yes, because it provides a starting point to the “how fricking stupid pitcher wins are when evaluating & comparing pitchers” argument.
quote:
It is if said pitcher has over 130 more wins to the other pitcher he's being compared to
No, not really, that’s you saying that. Sandy Koufax only had 165 wins, but is widely considered one of the best pitchers of all time. Do we disregard him because he retired early because he didn’t wanna destroy his arm?
quote:
Holy Mother of God,where do you people come from?
I’m wondering the same thing.
Posted on 8/4/18 at 9:13 pm to Drewbie
It used to be mine, but then i heard the Joey Votto stat the other day. Dude has never flown out to the catcher and has only flown out to an infielder SEVEN times!!! Blows my mind.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 8:19 am to ZZTIGERS
quote:
Yes, because it provides a starting point to the “how fricking stupid pitcher wins are when evaluating & comparing pitchers”
It provides nothing more than an insipid talking point that means nothing.I also brought up ERA and K's...once
again to dismiss 130+ more wins and wins in general as part of this arguement is idiotic.
quote:
No, not really, that’s you saying that. Sandy Koufax only had 165 wins, but is widely considered one of the best pitchers of all time.
How bout JR Richard?Mark Prior?Kerry Wood?
So lets take the best 7 year stretch for each if your going to completely dismiss wins.Maddux stills comes out on top except for K's
quote:
Greg Maddux
127-53, 2.15 ERA, 0.968 WHIP, 1286 K's in 1675 IP, 4 Cy Young's, 6 All Stars, 7 Gold Gloves, 1 World Series Champ
Pedro Martinez
118-36, 2.20 ERA, 0.937 WHIP, 1761 K's in 1408 IP, 3 Cy Young's, 5 All Stars
Posted on 8/5/18 at 9:29 am to RD Dawg
quote:No, it isn’t. Pitcher wins can mean a lot of things...the pitcher played for really good, high powered offensive team, or bad, low scoring, poor defensive team. It can also mean something as simple as longevity. He just played a long time, which is impressive, but there’s so many other stats that can provide context. There’s also just the way the game is played in different eras or managed by a particular manager that may play a part in the pitcher “win”
once
again to dismiss 130+ more wins and wins in general as part of this arguement is idiotic.
Looking at Nolan Ryan’s career, he “won” 324 games in 27 seasons. An average of 12 games per season. In 1987, Ryan went 8-16 with a 2.76 ERA. He led the NL in K, ERA, WAR & FIP that season, he was clearly the best pitcher, and should’ve won the Cy Young(he finished 6th), but Steve Bedrosian, a reliever, and not even close to being the best reliever nonetheless, won because he had 40 “saves”. Saves, which may be an even dumber stat. Ryan played for some pretty bad teams throughout his career, referenced by only making the playoffs 5 times, only 5 times in 27 seasons. That’ll hurt your win total.
quote:
So lets take the best 7 year stretch for each if your going to completely dismiss wins.Maddux stills comes out on top except for K's
I think that makes a lot more sense, and your stats show that they’re pretty dead even. In fact, I said as much in my initial post in this thread when someone said Pedro>>Maddux, and I defended Maddux, only giving Pedro the edge when it came to their respective peaks. I think Pedro’s peak is better than Maddux, it’s close, but I’ll go with Pedro. What he did during the steroid booming era, especially in 99-00, is almost unbelievable.
This post was edited on 8/5/18 at 5:34 pm
Posted on 8/5/18 at 9:36 am to RollTide1987
quote:
It's ridiculous to think that despite having Glavine, Maddux, and Smoltz (three HoF pitchers) in the bullpen, the Braves managed only one World Series title during their run in the 90s.
I said it a million times. Everyone in Atlanta talks about how great they were during that period winning all those division championships
To me, it was one of the biggest under achieving things ever
Posted on 8/5/18 at 10:10 am to LSUsmartass
Sounds like he was paying the umps
Posted on 8/5/18 at 11:37 am to Undertow
quote:
It’s actually not ridiculous when you consider how hard it is to win a World Series. And I don’t think you know what bullpen means.
I’d say that it was actually easier for a good team to win the World Series back then. Less teams in the playoffs reduce a good teams chance of getting knocked out before the WS.
Nowadays, with so many teams making the playoffs, it’s more of a crapshoot.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 1:16 pm to baldona
I watched that game on tv. He threw like 90% first pitch strikes
Posted on 8/5/18 at 1:18 pm to RollTide1987
quote:
The Braves should have won more than one with all the talent they had.
There is literally one play for each of two of those World Series that the entire Series turned on.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 4:40 pm to LanierSpots
quote:
Everyone in Atlanta talks about how great they were during that period winning all those division championships
No they don't...Jesus,almost every hardcore Braves fan and season ticket holder I know is pissed they didn't win more WS.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 5:25 pm to RD Dawg
quote:
1 outta 14 is pathetic with that collection of talent.
An Atlanta team chokes
Water is wet
Posted on 8/5/18 at 5:49 pm to GynoSandberg
The Braves were good in the wrong decade. In general, teams in the 90’s were better than teams in the 80’s or 00’s. Put those Braves teams in either of those decades and we’re talking about 3-4 World Series titles.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 6:37 pm to TigerintheNO
quote:
essage
Greg Maddux faced 20,421 batters in his career, only 133 saw a 3-0 count
That’s an incredible stat. But is there any more context?
How many 3-0 counts did his contemporaries have? Particularly HOF level contemporaries.
What were Glavine and Smoltz numbers? Clemens, Pedro.
This is not meant to knock GM, he’s my favorite pitcher of all time. But would be nice to see if his numbers were really that much better than the other greats of his generation.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 8:21 pm to mizzoubuckeyeiowa
quote:
that first pitch strike called that was a foot off the plate outside.
Posted on 8/5/18 at 8:28 pm to LSUsmartass
And the 16 voters that didn’t put Maddux on their hall of fame ballot need their voting rights stripped
Posted on 8/5/18 at 8:32 pm to SPEEDY
quote:
And the 16 voters that didn’t put Maddux on their hall of fame ballot need their voting rights stripped
Agreed...............
Posted on 8/5/18 at 10:32 pm to ZZTIGERS
quote:
No, it isn’t. Pitcher wins can mean a lot of things...the pitcher played for really good, high powered offensive team, o
When comparing the 2 they both played for very good teams so yea,wins is an important PART of the equation...to dismiss a "longevity" is silly.
quote:
What he did during the steroid booming era, especially in 99-00, is almost unbelievable.
1 season sample size?
So Maddux didn't encompass the steroid era? Perhaps more so?
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