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Message
re: Do any fans of a successful CFB program bitch about their coach more
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:28 am to Baloo
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:28 am to Baloo
quote:
Then you are doomed to be disappointed, because no team -- repeat NO TEAM -- in the history of football has ever or will ever do this
i agree, but doing it 11/12 times is better than 2/12 times
bama doesn't play up to its abilities every game. they lost to TAMU this year. but bama is playing for the title and beat LSU
quote:
Bama has lucked into two title games, and people trip over themselves to talk about Process. He has a very good program that has gotten incredibly fortunate to be given the chance to play for the title. Twice. Good for him. But there's no system,
Saban has won the SEC twice while at Bama (09, 12) and coached in a 3rd (08). Miles has done the same in more years, without rebuilding a program
Saban has 2 other SEC games/titles while at LSU
that has nothing to do with a popularity contest
0
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:29 am to EmperorGout
quote:
He's referring to the dominoes falling in other games that allowed Saban to play in 2 title games the past two years
well as an LSU fan, i'm not going to throw stones
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:30 am to SlowFlowPro
I'm beginning to think a lot of the hostility among our internet fanbase is jealousy of Alabama.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:30 am to Baloo
i'm not saying luck doesn't matter, but if you had the ability to eliminate as much luck/fluke/outliers, wouldn't you?
miles's philosophy seems to breed these scenarios by keeping so many games close. luck isn't always going to be there
miles's philosophy seems to breed these scenarios by keeping so many games close. luck isn't always going to be there
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:31 am to Golfer
quote:
I'm beginning to think a lot of the hostility among our internet fanbase is jealousy of Alabama.
it makes it harder to swallow
but the OG negatigers are saying the same stuff in 2013 that we said in 2005/2006, before saban was at bama
i can't speak for the noveau haters
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:33 am to Baloo
quote:
Usually, the national title comes down to luck.
Saban won two titles with a loss, looking for his 3rd
Spurrier & Miles both lost their last regular season game the year they won titles.
Meyer has losses both times he won BCS titles, but the year before & after joining the SEC he went undefeated and didn't play for the NC either time.
Tubberville went undefeated and didn't get a chance at the title.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:33 am to Golfer
quote:
I'm beginning to think a lot of the hostility among our internet fanbase is jealousy of Alabama.
I think the #1 reason people bash Miles is they are obsessed with Saban. Obsessed. Get over it. He's a very good coach who has moved on. Miles is a very good coach who is currently here.
Actually, it's not even Saban people are obsessed with, but the Saban Myth. No one can live up to the Saban Myth, not even the man himself.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:33 am to Kafka
alabama bill curry
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:34 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
but the OG negatigers are saying the same stuff in 2013 that we said in 2005/2006, before saban was at bama
The OG negatigers wanted Miles fired after the Tennessee game in 2005. You remember Nuts4LSU's 8000 word treatise on how we were finished as a program after that loss?
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:34 am to SlowFlowPro
Slow, I agree with this.
If we want to use a golf analogy Miles is a lot like Bubba Watson and his strange mannerisms that can be polarizing at times. Bubba doesn't play conventional golf and that results in him either being in contention or way off the leaderboard. He relies on luck (see the lie in the 2011 Masters) and is not as methodical as someone like Tiger is on the course.
If we want to use a golf analogy Miles is a lot like Bubba Watson and his strange mannerisms that can be polarizing at times. Bubba doesn't play conventional golf and that results in him either being in contention or way off the leaderboard. He relies on luck (see the lie in the 2011 Masters) and is not as methodical as someone like Tiger is on the course.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:35 am to Baloo
Saban is lucky, huh?
If he doesn't get "lucky", where does his team finished the year ranked the last five years? 8, 1, 9, 2, 3?
Show me Miles rankings in those same years. UR, 14, 9, 1, 13.
Two years ranked in the top 10, with a ton of luck in 2010.
You've got to be lucky to win a national title, but being one of the top 5 teams in the nation every year for a 5 year run is not luck.
If he doesn't get "lucky", where does his team finished the year ranked the last five years? 8, 1, 9, 2, 3?
Show me Miles rankings in those same years. UR, 14, 9, 1, 13.
Two years ranked in the top 10, with a ton of luck in 2010.
You've got to be lucky to win a national title, but being one of the top 5 teams in the nation every year for a 5 year run is not luck.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:35 am to H-Town Tiger
quote:Outside of a few teams, dominos have had to fall for many teams to get into title games.
I think I've been through this with you before, but no amount of Nick Saban's process caused Oklahoma State to lose to Iowa State. If OSU wins that game, Bama does not get a rematch. Same thing this year with Oregon and KSU losing. They are prepared when they get into the game, but that doesn't change the fact they they needed luck to get there and why did they need luck to get in? Because they didn't play up to full potential twice in home games, one to a 13.5 underdog.
I honestly have lost track of the debate at this point. I originally jumped in to talk about Miles' game management and now I find myself defending Bama. And I'm not one of those guys who has to argue just to be right. So I'm going to leave for a couple of minutes and see if I can jump back in later.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:36 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
but the OG negatigers are saying the same stuff in 2013 that we said in 2005/2006, before saban was at bama
Perhaps I should reword that to say jealousy of Saban and/or Bama.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:37 am to Baloo
quote:
the Saban Myth. No one can live up to the Saban Myth, not even the man himself.
if he wins monday, that's 3 titles in 4 years after winning 1 title with LSU
he's going to be the best coach of the modern CFB era if he wins monday
that's 4 titles in 9 years (with 2 of those having him not even coach CFB).
and saban isn't perfect...he's going to play it safe against ND, probably get up about 17, and then call off the dogs and let them get back in it...as if life with saban
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:39 am to Baloo
quote:
I think the #1 reason people bash Miles is they are obsessed with Saban. Obsessed.
Pretty much
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:39 am to Baloo
quote:
No. My expectations are for LSU to win a lot and contend for titles. Miles meets these expectations, as you admit. It's the constant shifting of the goalposts, just inventing new criteria that drives me insane. It makes me pretty much disregard all of your other arguments, which I admit, leads me to discard legitimate arguments as Cocomo points out.
If you're frustrated right now, I think it says a lot more about you than LSU football. The only time I was truly frustrated was the BCSCG. I've gotten over it.
quote:
And I think the exact opposite. This has been three of the most exciting years of football watching of my lifetime. Except 2007, which was also Miles. LSU games are incredibly exciting right now, and I don't think there's a more interesting program in the country. Now, this year was a bit of a disappointment, but I really don't have much to complain about 2010 and 2011, save the BCSCG.
I guess you and I are just complete opposites when it comes to enjoying LSU football. I don't like close/exciting games against teams that aren't very good.
I had this long, drawn out response going, but I deleted it because it doesn't matter...and I'll just say this..
You're right about Miles winning...he does. A lot. But even though W/L is ultimately the bottom line, it doesn't mean that a win justifies zero criticism. IMO there has been a lot to criticize the last few years, even though we were ultimately winning in the end.
And I disagree a good bit with this:
quote:
Really, the difference between Saban and Miles the past two seasons is luck. Saban has had it, and Miles hasn't. It happens. That's football.
..but don't feel like really getting into all of that. Luck is a big part of things, no doubt. But I disagree that the only difference between Saban and Miles is luck.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:40 am to Choupique19
Obsessed with Saban??? Right now, I'm obsessed with being outcoached by Dabo Freaking Swinney. Miles got depantsed Monday night.
32 first downs to 8
445 yards to 205.
32 first downs to 8
445 yards to 205.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:44 am to alajones
quote:
Outside of a few teams, dominos have had to fall for many teams to get into title games.
my point exactly, but some, not necessarily you, act like everything Miles does is due to luck and everything Saban does is skill. It doesn't work that way.
quote:
I originally jumped in to talk about Miles' game management
That's a valid criticism for the most part, which I think we've been discussing. I don't disagree with most points about poor game management and bad offense.
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:45 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
if he wins monday, that's 3 titles in 4 years after winning 1 title with LSU
3 of those are with a loss, which under the BCS means he could been on the outside looking in each time, without changing the results of any games in those seasons.
This post was edited on 1/2/13 at 11:46 am
Posted on 1/2/13 at 11:46 am to H-Town Tiger
quote:
3 of those are with a loss, which under the BCS means he could been on the outside looking in each time, without changing the results of any games in those seasons.
i don't disagree, but i'm talking about him in terms of the "Saban Myth"
i don't know what constitutes the myth, but the dude could die on Tuesday with one of the best resumes in CFB history
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