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re: Albert Belle on Mike Trout HOF talk: "I played 12 yrs & my stats are better than his"
Posted on 2/3/24 at 10:36 am to InkStainedWretch
Posted on 2/3/24 at 10:36 am to InkStainedWretch
quote:
Sandy Koufax is IMO the benchmark for someone getting into Cooperstown with a short career and peak. So you have to ask yourself is Belle’s peak equivalent to Koufax’s peak.
Good argument.
Sandy Koufax 5 years by every metric and observation was THE most dominant of his era by far among many great pitchers.
I don't think any player's "5-year peak" in baseball history compared to Koufax. Plus he inspired his teammates. ( Based on that same "Benchmark Excellence"+ "Leadership" I believe both Roger Maris AND Donnie Baseball ought to be in the HoF.)
Belle's stats were great; but he did have company. I ding Belle for his laziness, attitude, and for his "negative clubhouse waves."
0
Posted on 2/3/24 at 10:37 am to theunknownknight
quote:well thats not true
It takes Trout 10 seasons to play 162 games
Posted on 2/3/24 at 10:42 am to lsufanva
quote:no one ever has or ever will be as valuable as roided, turn of the century, bonds
Next thing you know they'll be trying to convince us he's better than Bonds and Griffey. He ain't.
but pre pandemic trout was equally valuable than non roided bonds and was decidedely more valuable than griffey
This post was edited on 2/3/24 at 10:45 am
Posted on 2/3/24 at 12:12 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
but pre pandemic trout was equally valuable than non roided bonds
This is a draw at best. Pre-roid Barry won 3 MVP's('90, '92 & '93)
quote:
was decidedely more valuable than griffey
Now you're being ridiculous. Prime Griffey was every bit the player and as valuable as Pre-pandemic Trout, not to mention Junior was much more durable.
This post was edited on 2/3/24 at 12:17 pm
Posted on 2/3/24 at 12:22 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
This is a draw at best
quote:
was equally
quote:trout basically accumulated the same amount of WAR in 9 seasons as griffey did over his entire career
Prime Griffey was every bit the player and as valuable as Pre-pandemic Trout
Posted on 2/3/24 at 12:31 pm to WestCoastAg
I watched Griffey in his prime, young buck. He was just as good, if not a little better, than Trout. He was the best player in baseball for half a decade.
You WAR nerds are something else.
You WAR nerds are something else.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 12:34 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
You also think Ozzie Albies is on a HOF trajectory so forgive me if I question your eye test boomer
Posted on 2/3/24 at 12:44 pm to Jack Ruby
And what about defensive stats for Trout vs Belle?
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:04 pm to WestCoastAg
WAR doesn’t tell you who was better. I say that being on record in this thread that it’s a valid albeit flawed metric.
The only thing peak Trout could do appreciably better than peak Griffey was draw walks and it’s not like Griffey was Steve Garvey as far as being selective at the plate. And Griffey was much better in the field.
JAWS which considers both cumulative WAR and the player’s best seven seasons of WAR is a somewhat better way to assess “who was better” although I still think using the metric at all to do that is problematic. And it has Trout slightly ahead of Griffey in fifth and sixth, respectively, behind Mays, Cobb, Speaker and Mantle. I don’t have an issue with that, really.
But I think Griffey suffers in the public consciousness right now the same way Eddie Mathews and Duke Snider suffered in having to wait to get into Cooperstown, he was shot as an elite player at 30 because of injuries but hung on for another decade, and his peak is 25-30 years ago now.
But he was a hellacious player at his peak.
The only thing peak Trout could do appreciably better than peak Griffey was draw walks and it’s not like Griffey was Steve Garvey as far as being selective at the plate. And Griffey was much better in the field.
JAWS which considers both cumulative WAR and the player’s best seven seasons of WAR is a somewhat better way to assess “who was better” although I still think using the metric at all to do that is problematic. And it has Trout slightly ahead of Griffey in fifth and sixth, respectively, behind Mays, Cobb, Speaker and Mantle. I don’t have an issue with that, really.
But I think Griffey suffers in the public consciousness right now the same way Eddie Mathews and Duke Snider suffered in having to wait to get into Cooperstown, he was shot as an elite player at 30 because of injuries but hung on for another decade, and his peak is 25-30 years ago now.
But he was a hellacious player at his peak.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:04 pm to WestCoastAg
quote:
You also think Ozzie Albies is on a HOF trajectory
Well, he is, especially considering that 2B is the easiest position to get into the HoF, if you can't see that then I can't help you.
quote:
forgive me if I question your eye test
I trust my eyes a lot more than a subjective metric like WAR.
quote:
boomer
I'm 42. I'm Gen X.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:11 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
Well, he is,
quote:the unimaginable levels of irony in this sentence and the fact that you don't see that is beyond amazing
I trust my eyes a lot more than a subjective metric
quote:my eye test says you're a boomer
I'm Gen X.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:13 pm to WestCoastAg
I've watched him play every day young man, not only is he on a HoF trajectory but he is also one of the most underappreciated(outside Atlanta) and underrated players in the game.
I ain't that old.
quote:
my eye test says you're a boomer
I ain't that old.
This post was edited on 2/3/24 at 1:14 pm
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:15 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
OK boomer
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:19 pm to WestCoastAg
If you think 42 is a boomer than I don't know what to tell you.
You fricking millennials are the worst.
You fricking millennials are the worst.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:23 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
He’s trolling you Steeler. Chillax.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:24 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
im just following my objective eye test boomer
This post was edited on 2/3/24 at 1:25 pm
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:28 pm to InkStainedWretch
I know. He just rubs me the wrong way. Comes across as someone who was constantly stuffed in lockers at school
But I'll let it lie.
But I'll let it lie.
This post was edited on 2/3/24 at 1:36 pm
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:30 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
42
quote:holy shite HAHAHHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
You fricking millennials
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:45 pm to SteelerBravesDawg
quote:
I'm 42. I'm Gen X.
Nope. You're an old Millennial.
Posted on 2/3/24 at 1:46 pm to David Ricky
quote:
before you edited
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