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Labor Shortage

Posted on 7/16/18 at 12:35 pm
Posted by tiger10lsu
New Orleans
Member since Oct 2010
223 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 12:35 pm
I'm in a tough spot and have some tough decisions to make in the next 6 months.

I have been working for our family business for about 8 years and have the option to carry the business into its 4th generation as my dad is nearing retirement. Do any of you have problems with labor shortage in the younger generation? Mainly skilled trade?

We are in need of manual machinists, welders and all around metal fabricators. My gut says not to carry on because we can not find the guys to do what we do anymore and its only getting worse. Any of you have this problem?
Posted by b-rab2
N. Louisiana
Member since Dec 2005
12575 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 12:47 pm to
Tiger, Have you looked into the technical colleges and seen if their enrollment is up? I know that finding good entry level hands in the oil field is hit or miss. We've had some duds lately.
Posted by Golfer
Member since Nov 2005
75052 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:06 pm to
Likely a combination of not paying enough and not properly marketing/communicating your available positions to the workforce.
Posted by hungryone
river parishes
Member since Sep 2010
11987 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:09 pm to
Hmm, seems like you will need to grow your own skilled workforce, rather than looking for "finished" employees. Has the business ever thought about a training and mentorship program? Pair older skilled workers with the younger ones, esp those who learn best from example/doing (rather than classroom). Or develop a partnership with your closest vo-tech/community college to create paid internships for their students---you'd get discount workers, and be able to pick and choose from the ones you see through the internship program. Every business faces the need for skilled workers---how you respond to the challenges will determine your success or failure.

You say you can't find the guys to "do what you do"....but if the services are needed, someone will provide them. Is there strong demand for your services? That should be the guiding factor...not just having a labor shortage.

You don't say what the alternative is: what is your own skill set/potential for employment if the family business is no longer there? Will the family business be closed, or is there a potential to sell to someone else? Who actually owns it? You, dad, or a larger group of family members?

Frankly, your post sounds like your mind is made up and you're simply looking for reasons to justify getting out of the family business. If the work & challenges don't excite you, if you aren't thinking creatively about how to solve your labor problems, if you are already thinking about how the "old days" were better, perhaps you are not well suited to bring this business into the future. No shame in that--we aren't all entrepreneurs. Be honest with yourself & don't cling to the family business if it makes you miserable.
Posted by tiger10lsu
New Orleans
Member since Oct 2010
223 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:45 pm to
Our welders and manual machinists are in $30+ per hour range so not paying enough couldn't be farther from the truth.

Back in the day we had apprenticeship but now were so busy with work, I can't stop an older guy to teach someone else.

We will always have the work (repair work).

I currently meet with the customers and do the quoting, purchasing of material and running the jobs.

Every year I notice my phone ringing more and more with questions on what to do and problems with a job. Jobs are running over because guys that can "do it all". Simply can't
Posted by brian_wilson
Member since Oct 2016
3581 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:46 pm to
there is a severe shortage of skilled trades where I am. Businesses aren't doing a good job responding to it though. Generally when there is a shortage, wages shoot up but that isn't happening, as businesses can't pass price increases along to their customers.

Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
20397 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:53 pm to
quote:

Back in the day we had apprenticeship but now were so busy with work, I can't stop an older guy to teach someone else.


This is your issue. I do volunteer work with some underprivelaged and disabled, their issues is that no one is looking to do any sort of on the job training. Everyone wants people to show up with experience.

Its all about investing in your future honestly. You say you have plenty of work and pay $30/ hour. I bet you can easily get some young help for $15-20/ hour and train them up. Its all about figuring out how to invest in your young employees education.

I don't think 20-30 years ago there were nearly as many places to learn welding and machinery as there are in todays Vo tech schools. Everyone learned on the job.

ETA: I also feel like the VO Techs that do the training do a piss poor job of setting up on the job trainings and jobs in general. Basically, they train the very basic skills and set the students free with almost no help. Someone needs to help the students go from basic skills to a job.
This post was edited on 7/16/18 at 1:55 pm
Posted by cave canem
pullarius dominus
Member since Oct 2012
12186 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:54 pm to
quote:


Our welders and manual machinists are in $30+ per hour range so not paying enough couldn't be farther from the truth.


That is broken thinking, regardless if you believe it is enough the market decides that, and it seems to be speaking to you.

Welders are in pretty high demand with all the pipeline work going on and you just have to find what it is that will lure them.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
20397 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 1:59 pm to
quote:

Welders are in pretty high demand with all the pipeline work going on and you just have to find what it is that will lure them.


While I absolutely agree here, I also think its been goofy to compare Oil and Gas jobs to other jobs. Oil and Gas almost always pays something in a different league, often times 2-3 times or more over other fields. I know there's reasons for that in that its boom or bust, many jobs are traveling, many are shift, many are 14 on 14 off, or whatever.

But its still goofy to compare someone that does a local 8-5 fabricating job pay scale to O&G. It likely won't be close, and that's a big issue we have on the gulf coast IMO. All the good help goes to O&G for the money and that leads a void that no one is really willing to fix.
Posted by castorinho
13623 posts
Member since Nov 2010
82010 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:02 pm to
There's a lot of folks who got burned in the last o&g downturn who are willing to trade that money for stability
Posted by The Spleen
Member since Dec 2010
38865 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:07 pm to
Was reading an article a few weeks ago about the decline in the number of skilled laborers because so many companies have abandoned their apprenticeship programs while also skimping on on-the-job training.

But I do also think there's been a decline in them because our society as a whole has placed more emphasis on kids going to college. Then the ones not cut out for college miss the boat on lucrative skilled labor careers.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
20397 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:08 pm to
quote:

There's a lot of folks who got burned in the last o&g downturn who are willing to trade that money for stability


No doubt. But I find that seems to be older folks, usually people with kids and a wife that need something more stable. I'm just saying you have these idiots in the schools that advertise $30/ hour O&G jobs to these Vo tech students that are in Vo Tech because they can't graduate from HS with a normal diploma. They should be the ones headed to local places for $18/ hour to apprentice for 5 years. Not aim big for pipeline job in North Dakota or some other goofy thing.
Posted by tiger10lsu
New Orleans
Member since Oct 2010
223 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:09 pm to
Agreed^^^
Posted by tiger10lsu
New Orleans
Member since Oct 2010
223 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:11 pm to
I would love to keep the business going. We are close to 100 years old and have a great customer base. Things will always break and need fixing. Finding the employees has been an 8 year venture that I haven't found an answer for yet.
Posted by baldona
Florida
Member since Feb 2016
20397 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:12 pm to
quote:

But I do also think there's been a decline in them because our society as a whole has placed more emphasis on kids going to college. Then the ones not cut out for college miss the boat on lucrative skilled labor careers.


No doubt. We need some degrees that combine Business with trades, outside of simply like construction like Building science. That way you have some college educated guys going to the trade schools.

The way the trade schools are now are basically the bottom of the barrel for guys that don't have any other choices. Which is ridiculous. I'm not advertising skipping college to be a welder, I'm advertising skipping college to own a welding company.
Posted by hungryone
river parishes
Member since Sep 2010
11987 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:18 pm to
quote:

Finding the employees has been an 8 year venture that I haven't found an answer for yet.

So re-think how you're finding employees....where do you advertise? How do people find out about your jobs? What benefits do you offer? The labor market evolves, and you've got to evolve with it.

I know you say you can't afford to slow an older guy down with on-the-job training, but that's the wrong mindset. Identify your best productive/highest skilled workers....set aside X hours a week for them to teach less skilled employees. Make it a formal part of the job....like a Friday AM safety & training meeting, or a once a week (or month) inservice. Survey your existing lower-skilled workers and find out what is preventing them from gaining skills or better managing their work: what can you as a labor manager do to make them more productive? Whether it is better tools, more practice at certain tasks, using technology in the field to speed up paperwork/invoicing or on-the-fly access to job details, you need to listen to your employees and not just claim "they don't work like the older guys"....

But I do agree that premium pay and benefits will solve most any labor problem. Get creative with your benefits package--that might set you apart from your competitors.
Posted by Mr.Perfect
Louisiana
Member since Mar 2013
17438 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:42 pm to
So if you do decide to exit, can you sell the company or will it just fold?
Posted by Powerman
Member since Jan 2004
162198 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:48 pm to
quote:

Our welders and manual machinists are in $30+ per hour range so not paying enough couldn't be farther from the truth.

If that doesn't include opportunity for overtime it might be an issue

Welders can make that and get on jobs paying 60+ hours a week and per diem and bring home a lot more money
Posted by hottub
Member since Dec 2012
3325 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 2:52 pm to
Since college I have always been a mentor at local schools I was stationed by in the military. I was fortunate enough to be stationed in Florida relatively close to home, the panhandle. A kid that I was mentoring there was an awesome kid in a really shitty situation. Mom and dad both in and out of jail, he had been to over 8 different schools before HS, but generally a good kid who wanted to do right but had never been shown how. His grades were terrible and he was in an alternative school, so college was not happening soon for him. So as he was approaching the end of his junior year, I introduced him to a childhood friend who(like you) was taking over his family HVAC business. He gave him a job that summer as a helper in his shop and the kid impressed him so he committed to helping him get through the school and training, financially and mentoring him. This was all about 6 years ago and the “kid” is now making an honest living and extremely loyal to my buddy for investing in him. They both thank me for introducing them, one has a great employee and the other has a great career.

The point is you will probably have to invest your time and treasure to find what you are looking for in today’s labor market. I think it will be worth it. My mom and her brothers sold our family business about 10 years ago and they won’t say it, but they regret it.

Good luck.

This post was edited on 7/16/18 at 2:55 pm
Posted by barry
Location, Location, Location
Member since Aug 2006
50337 posts
Posted on 7/16/18 at 3:10 pm to
quote:

Back in the day we had apprenticeship but now were so busy with work, I can't stop an older guy to teach someone else.



That's shortsighted.
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