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re: Construction Project Management and Career Changes

Posted on 12/1/20 at 1:02 pm to
Posted by Carson123987
Middle Court at the Rec
Member since Jul 2011
66468 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

I wouldn't give two shits about a homeowner. Try explaining to a plant manager why his FCCU isn't up and running and he's losing millions of dollars a day...


Yeah, I daydream about being in residential. If I ever want to have a better life balance and take a big pay cut, I'll do it. Only way to make money in residential is if you're the GC and you own the company, though.

I'll deal with a clueless doctor and his bimbo wife 10/10 times over engineers and plant managers that have spent YEARS designing a complex new unit that costs 10s to 100s of millions of dollars and needs to be done by some absurdly aggressive deadline with the threat of liquidated damages hanging over your head. Never mind the far more dangerous work environments, the far more stringent safety/QC requirements, the far more expensive/dangerous equipment, etc

It really sucks when the client knows far more about what you're building than you do LMAO. They may be less knowledgeable about constructability in some regards, but most of the time, you aint gonna bullshite them
Posted by Carson123987
Middle Court at the Rec
Member since Jul 2011
66468 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 1:03 pm to
quote:

quote:
For those that don't know, this job is like sitting in a giant pressure cooker of stress and anger day in and day out. There is always someone to fight with, always someone to argue with, always a problem, always someone unhappy, and always someone blaming you for things that you don't and will never have control over.


You just described almost every job with a decent salary attached to it.


This is also very true. There are very few easy, nonstressful, high salary jobs.

If the high paying jobs were easy, everyone would do them
Posted by Spirit of Dunson
Member since Mar 2007
23111 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 3:58 pm to
29 isn't too young at all to make a switch. I was 30 when I finished my second degree and had my first kid. So I was really just starting out at that age. My career has taken so many turns since then (including industrial project management). I am in my 40's and still expect 1-2 more career changes. So don't let age get in the way.

As for the job - yes, industrial CM is a pressure cooker. I was on the owner's side, but still traveled Sunday-Friday, worked crazy hours, and was always stressed out about deadlines, budgets, technology working, etc.
I've moved up since then. I still have a ton more stress since I'm responsible for a lot more people, budget, EHS..., but I make a good bit more money and actually work less hours. So as long as I can compartmentalize the work stress, I'm really able to enjoy time with my wife and kids - which is really the reason we do what we do in the end.

It sounds like you have figured out what is important and what you aren't willing to do. Make the change.
Posted by down time
space
Member since Oct 2013
1914 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 5:27 pm to
It sucks even more when a client thinks they know what they want and really doesn't have a clue.
Posted by Cdawg
TigerFred's Living Room
Member since Sep 2003
59612 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 5:39 pm to
quote:

Unless you own the business.

Posted by southerntiger83
Metairie, La
Member since Aug 2008
100 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 8:30 pm to
I was basically in your exact same shoes at almost the same age. I graduated from LSU in CM and started working as an estimator at a good sized commercial GC in the New Orleans area. Moved up to Assistant PM then to PM. Worked in those three positions for about 8 years.
The company I worked for was great. The owner took care of his employees. They did great work and had a very good reputation in the industry but I eventually grew into hating what I was doing. For me personally, the stress that came along with what I was doing just wasn’t worth it. To me, all I felt like I was doing was fighting with people to get them to actually do what the said they were going to do and what they were contracted to do.
I was literally running three jobs with roughly 25 different subcontractors on each job. Just to name A FEW job requirements, I wrote all subcontractor agreements, built and maintained all schedules, reviewed and processed all submittals, balanced job budgets, reviewed and processed all RFI’s, change order proposals, change orders, produced bills to the owner, reviewed and coded all invoices for every aspect of each job, held weekly architect/owner meetings and typed the meeting minutes, held weekly subcontractor meetings and typed the meeting minutes. The list goes on and on. Lots of people don’t realize what actually goes in to building something and the GC is obviously on the front line of the whole thing.

My blood pressure got to the point to where I needed medicine. I didn’t sleep well because I always woke up worrying about schedules and potential problems. I was fighting with my wife because I was very irritable. I finally decided that this job wasn’t for me. It just didn’t work with my personality. I made a change at age 31 and it has been the best decision of my life. I now work in the equipment rental business and many of the contractors I dealt with, are now customers of mine. I love the construction industry but just didn’t like what I was doing in that industry. I make a lot more money now and I’m no longer on the BP medication. To the OP, make the change ASAP.
This post was edited on 12/1/20 at 8:56 pm
Posted by braindeadboxer
Utopia
Member since Nov 2011
8742 posts
Posted on 12/1/20 at 11:18 pm to
Currently doing industrial estimating and love the work. It just seems like clients are becoming more clueless and more unreasonable all at the same time. I know I have to play their game, but dammit it sucks. Current cutthroat market isn’t helping for sure.

I feel your pain, but for me at the end of the day I can’t imagine anything that pays decent and isn’t stupid risky that I’d rather do. Company and colleagues are great and that helps.

Posted by Nguyener
Kame House
Member since Mar 2013
20603 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 6:44 am to
(no message)
This post was edited on 12/2/20 at 6:46 am
Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 9:57 am to
I'm in the same industry as you are, albeit as a sub.
Unfortunately, this trend isn't just in construction. The only professional joy that I have had was this past year after finally starting out on my own. I don't let those people get to me anymore. I'll finish my project with them and never bid another job for them. I don't HAVE to work for greedy people anymore, and I won't allow them to affect my personal life anymore.

TLDR: you are going to find greedy, shitty people no matter what industry you are in. Greed is the reason our nation is in the situation we find ourselves in now.
Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 9:58 am to
quote:

hate to break it to you but if that’s your life you work for a shitty contractor. I’m a contractor and my days are nothing like that

I love my job, my customers love me and my employees are living the dream. Every day we do our part to keep the wheels of commerce turning by designing, building or improving facilities that our owners use to employ others and generate revenue

you need to go job hunting




Said it better than I did
Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 10:01 am to
quote:

Unless you own the business.

Explain that more please?
Are you implying that business owners have it easy and stress free?
Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 10:02 am to
quote:

residential.

quote:

Imagine this time 1000x

That's cute

Also, to the OP, I wish I would have seen a therapist or psychiatrist at 30 instead of waiting until I was 40.
It has made an unimaginable difference.
This post was edited on 12/2/20 at 10:05 am
Posted by OGD
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2020
42 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 12:24 pm to
I'm sure it helped you, but the way I see it if you need a therapist to help you do your job (and you aren't in a direct combat role in the Military) you probably should not be doing that job.
Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 12:29 pm to
I made it to 40 without one, so I wouldn't say it was necessary. However, I did say it made a world of difference, as in, it helped.
I'm sorry you are too cool for counseling and reading comprehension.
Posted by OGD
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Apr 2020
42 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 12:49 pm to
quote:

I was basically in your exact same shoes at almost the same age. I graduated from LSU in CM and started working as an estimator at a good sized commercial GC in the New Orleans area. Moved up to Assistant PM then to PM. Worked in those three positions for about 8 years.
The company I worked for was great. The owner took care of his employees. They did great work and had a very good reputation in the industry but I eventually grew into hating what I was doing. For me personally, the stress that came along with what I was doing just wasn’t worth it. To me, all I felt like I was doing was fighting with people to get them to actually do what the said they were going to do and what they were contracted to do.
I was literally running three jobs with roughly 25 different subcontractors on each job. Just to name A FEW job requirements, I wrote all subcontractor agreements, built and maintained all schedules, reviewed and processed all submittals, balanced job budgets, reviewed and processed all RFI’s, change order proposals, change orders, produced bills to the owner, reviewed and coded all invoices for every aspect of each job, held weekly architect/owner meetings and typed the meeting minutes, held weekly subcontractor meetings and typed the meeting minutes. The list goes on and on. Lots of people don’t realize what actually goes in to building something and the GC is obviously on the front line of the whole thing.


Man, I don't know that I could have said it better than that. I always resort back to the thought "maybe I'm just complaining too much and need to suck it up. Work sucks and you have to suffer"
Posted by TIGERSby10
Central Lafourche
Member since Nov 2005
6956 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 12:55 pm to
Sounds like you need a company change, not a career change.

I've been in commercial construction for over 20 years. I kept putting in the long hours and climbing my way to the top all while chasing the big money. I got there, but realized after about 5 years of the ridiculous stress and no social life that the huge paycheck only will keep you happy for so long.

I walked out one day on my own, basically telling my former employer to shove it (in so many words), without having anything else lined up. I was ready for a career change in my mid 40's. All the money the could throw at me wasn't worth my sanity and health problems due to the stress.

I went to a smaller company making less money, but also reducing my stress significantly. I make plenty to pay the bills and still have extra to spend when I want, but I feel it is the best decision I've ever made in my life. Plenty of free time and enjoying life again.

I took me a while to realize it's not the industry, just the situation you are in with your current company. Make that move somewhere else and get a fresh start. It may take a few moves, but find somewhere where you feel the fit is right and don't worry about the money.
Posted by Elusiveporpi
Below I-10
Member since Feb 2011
2576 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 1:02 pm to
I am a CM around your age as well. I work for the Client/Owner though (PetroChem Plant). This may be a route you can try and take.

I'm pretty new in my roll, but the stress is less than you are talking about. As a CM on the owners side, I put all the stress on you (which I see you are getting lol). At the end of the day, I still have a boss to report to and i still have to make deadlines, but at least i can push the majority of the stress to the GM to make it happen.

When Projects fall inside of turnarounds, the stress level is definitely elevated. but once its over I can usually work 4-10's.



Posted by shawnlsu
Member since Nov 2011
23682 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 1:25 pm to
quote:

Sounds like you need a company change, not a career change.


See my first post here, I started my own company a little over a year ago. I've never been happier!
Posted by HamCandy
Team Meat
Member since Dec 2008
894 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 2:39 pm to
quote:

Sounds like you need a company change, not a career change.


Have you considered working for a subcontractor? Its more specialized and sometimes can be less stress than working for a GC and being pulled in a 100 different directions (don't get me wrong its still construction). I went the GC route for 4 years, the subcontractors route for 7, and now I'm on the Owner/Developer side. The stress has progressively lessoned and through my personally experience the only way I was able to pull my self out of any work funk was to move on.

To me, and I've been through this, is your scared of the change. You work in an industry that's constantly changing everyday there is the unexpected or unknown that you have to deal with and the only consistent thing you can rely on is the job you have. Its like we almost trick ourselves into thinking that staying put is better than moving on. But as you can see from most of the other posters taking the next step of moving on will help out tremendously.

Good luck either way. Its sounds like you are good, well trained PM who could work anywhere.
Posted by UncleSlick
PA
Member since Mar 2019
125 posts
Posted on 12/2/20 at 7:02 pm to
I know you’ve already got a lot of good responses but here’s my advice.

I just made the switch about 2 years ago. Started out working as a CM for a large commercial GC. Company and coworkers were great. But as you said the stress, work-life balance, and hating the person I had to be. Arguing with people constantly to get them to do what needs to be done. I did not enjoy it at all.

But the part that scared me the most was looking around at my superiors, people 5, 10, or 15 more years into their careers and seeing how much they resented it.

So I decided to leave and now Im in business for myself doing residential work. I am so thankful that I made the move when I did. I am much more passionate about what I do now. And find myself looking forward to getting back to work after the weekend. Not that I don’t enjoy my time off. But it feels good to be excited about what your doing for a living.

I’d do some self reflection and imagine what you want your life to be like 5-10 years from now. Then ask yourself if this current career is going to get you there
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