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Brennan vs Johnson Part II: The Tape
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:26 pm
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:26 pm
I'll preface this by saying although the author presents some compelling data to support Brennan, there are other intangibles like mobility, pocket awareness and processing speed (my impression) that seem to favor Max.
SB Nation Brennan vs Max Part II
Videos are in the link. Someone more tech savvy can post. His final analysis:
He puts a heavy emphasis on how much better Brennan is as a vertical passer and provides film showing Brennan's ability to throw under pressure. My take is that I saw Max slide in the pocket more and those little movements took angles away from defenders and reduced the appearance of pressure.
His metrics from his original article are below where he breaks down pressure and efficiency. This again favored Brennan.
Part I
I think both QBs offer distinctly different skill sets and we can win with both so I'm not advocating for either. I am a little surprised that what at least looks like a quantitative analysis leans that heavy in favor of one of the two.
SB Nation Brennan vs Max Part II
Videos are in the link. Someone more tech savvy can post. His final analysis:
quote:
Personally, I think the tape is even clearer than the data on who was the better quarterback last year. The main takeaway is the same as last time though, Myles Brennan offers you explosion, he threatens defenses all over the field, and he offers you efficiency. In 2021, that’s what constitutes upside, and what constitutes talent.
There are enough ways (heavy RPO use, heavy play action use, standard down passing) to simplify a QBs process nowadays that, unless processing is really sketchy, the things I listed are what differentiate you at the college level
quote:
LSU’s offense is straight dropback heavy, the way they run play-fakes doesn’t really influence defenders as much as I’d like, and it is heavy on quick passing. Despite this, Brennan was able to operate quite well in it, and they do make you defend a lot by sending 4-5 guys out in the concept every time. Hopefully Brennan still has his physical abilities, because if he does, that’s the guy I want to ride into the season. If he doesn’t, I think Johnson is solid, but limited in what he can really give you independently. It’s not 2007 anymore, I don’t want LSU to operate with those limits if they don’t have to.
He puts a heavy emphasis on how much better Brennan is as a vertical passer and provides film showing Brennan's ability to throw under pressure. My take is that I saw Max slide in the pocket more and those little movements took angles away from defenders and reduced the appearance of pressure.
His metrics from his original article are below where he breaks down pressure and efficiency. This again favored Brennan.
Part I
I think both QBs offer distinctly different skill sets and we can win with both so I'm not advocating for either. I am a little surprised that what at least looks like a quantitative analysis leans that heavy in favor of one of the two.
28
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:29 pm to BayouCowboy
quote:
I'll preface this by saying although the author presents some compelling data to support Brennan, there are other intangibles like mobility, pocket awareness and processing speed (my impression) that seem to favor Max.
In other words, despite whatever anybody presents to show that Brennan is better, I'm going to find reasons to say Johnson is better, because that's what The Rant Group Think tells me I should do.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:34 pm to BayouCowboy
Because Brennan was better than Johnson last year by a considerable amount. He put up better numbers against better defenses with more responsibility on his shoulders. If that idiot from Florida wouldn’t have thrown a shoe this wouldn’t even be a debate among fans. Now do we know how much Johnson’s improved, do we know if Brennan’s injuries have had long term effects? No, we don’t know those things and we don’t know who the starter is but anyone claiming Johnson played better than Brennan last season is not being objective in the least bit.
This post was edited on 7/14/21 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:34 pm to Hold That Tiger 10
PFF had Brennan rated significantly higher than Johnson in every category last year
The only arguments for Johnson are
1. He can run better
2. People that use team results
The only arguments for Johnson are
1. He can run better
2. People that use team results
This post was edited on 7/14/21 at 3:35 pm
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:38 pm to lsupride87
quote:
The only arguments for Johnson are
1. He can run better
2. People that use team results
You mean to tell me that I can't blame it on Brennan that Mississippi State put up 600 yards, and scored 500 points against our defense?
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:39 pm to lsupride87
Another obstacle to comparing the two QBs from last year's performances is the fact Johnson didn't have Terrace Marshall in his final 3 games (out of 5 total and both starts).
It's not worth the effort to try and compare the guys based on the past. It should be up to Jake Peetz to decide who fits what he wants to do best.
It's not worth the effort to try and compare the guys based on the past. It should be up to Jake Peetz to decide who fits what he wants to do best.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:40 pm to lsupride87
quote:
The only arguments for Johnson are
1. He can run better
2. People that use team results
I think you have to factor in opponents which PFF does a terrible job of. Max saw time against Auburn, A&M, Bama, Florida and Ole Miss. Myles got to go against the 3/4 worst teams LSU played and lost two of them.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:40 pm to BayouCowboy
Only the one contigent of LSU fans think Johnson is better. Most people that are not LSU fans too, that watch tape, scout for a living, are coaches, and regular old sports analysts, expect it to be Myles.
For the same reasons he says, Myles can attack the entire field. While Johnson should be good going forward, Brennan is the guy now.
For the same reasons he says, Myles can attack the entire field. While Johnson should be good going forward, Brennan is the guy now.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:41 pm to lsupride87
Yep. Either Brennen is still hurt or Max made a huge 2nd year jump if he is playing over Brennen. In no objective way is it even close if you base the decision on last year and the spring game. Brennen was objectively better in every phase but mobility.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:42 pm to skullhawk
quote:Lazy analysis
I think you have to factor in opponents which PFF does a terrible job of. Max saw time against Auburn, A&M, Bama, Florida and Ole Miss. Myles got to go against the 3/4 worst teams LSU played and lost two of them.
Defenses faced by each based on starts
Myles faced the 5th, 10th, and 12th ranked passing defenses in the sec
He averaged
371 yards/game--60.3%--3.6tds/game--1 int/game--154.7 rating
Max faced the 8th and 13th ranked passing defenses in the SEC as a starter
he averaged
337 yards/game--55%--3 tds/game-- 0.5 int/game--141 rating
But I agree with the other poster. I have confidence our OC will put forth the QB that gives him the best chance to run his offense
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:43 pm to BayouCowboy
I’m fine with Myles as the starting QB this season if Max will stay but I’m not fine losing Max, and maybe more importantly his brother Jake, to do it.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:43 pm to Jwho77
Because that’s a faulty premise. If Marshall’s there does he develop the connection with Boutte and how does that effect his bottom line? You don’t miss something you never had.
This post was edited on 7/14/21 at 3:45 pm
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:44 pm to tigerballs
quote:
In no objective way is it even close if you base the decision on last year and the spring game.
?
Spring game stats
MAX JOHNSON
11-17
180 Yards
2 TDs
MYLES BRENNAN
12-20
116 Yards
1 TD
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:46 pm to skullhawk
quote:Correct me if I am wrong, but wasnt Johnson like 1-6 against the starters with a dropped int?
Spring game stats
MAX JOHNSON
11-17
180 Yards
2 TDs
MYLES BRENNAN
12-20
116 Yards
1 TD
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:46 pm to lsupride87
quote:
Myles faced the 5th, 10th, and 12th ranked passing defenses in the sec
He averaged
371 yards/game--60.3%--3.6tds/game--1 int/game--154.7 rating
Max faced the 8th and 13th ranked passing defenses in the SEC as a starter
he averaged
337 yards/game--55%--3 tds/game-- 0.5 int/game--141 rating
this is hardly a gotcha. Now factor in one has been in a college program for 4 years and the other was the third string qb until October.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:46 pm to BayouCowboy
quote:
The Missouri game is where it all came together for him, and he looked like a top-5 pick. In that game, Brennan didn’t look like a good passer, or even a really good one, he looked like a future All-Pro.
LSU wins turnover margin 3:0
Brennan & LSU offense goes 0-10 on 3rd down
Can’t covert inside 5yd line
Sorry but if you can’t win a shootout against Missouri going +3 on TO, you ain’t had a top 5 pick kinda day lol
This post was edited on 7/14/21 at 3:47 pm
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:48 pm to BayouCowboy
This is all assuming that Myles comes back the same QB as before he got hurt last year. Some of the throws in the spring game were really weak. If he doesn’t have a cannon still, it’s a no brainer
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:50 pm to lsupride87
quote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but wasnt Johnson like 1-6 against the starters with a dropped int?
I do remember Max having a shaky start but he settled in. If we're nitpicking the game, Myles' biggest play, only TD pass , and what accounted for nearly 50% of his yardage was a forced 50/50 ball that should have been knocked down by the DB.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:50 pm to BayouCowboy
Johnson showed potential and promise after Finley looked mediocre. It was refreshing and a little exciting when the season was essentially over and nobody cared.
Brennan looked good on paper each week but the defense sucked in those games and we lost some which people remember. He looked nervous and lacked emotion which isn’t ideal for your QB. But his numbers were better than any QB through his first few games as a starter.
Either will do fine but for multiple reasons I start Brennan week one.
Brennan looked good on paper each week but the defense sucked in those games and we lost some which people remember. He looked nervous and lacked emotion which isn’t ideal for your QB. But his numbers were better than any QB through his first few games as a starter.
Either will do fine but for multiple reasons I start Brennan week one.
Posted on 7/14/21 at 3:51 pm to Lester Earl
And honestly, they turned them over on downs in the 1Q for what could be considered a 4th change of possession, obtaining the ball at the Missouri47
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