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re: Stan McChrystal - Good riddance: Americans need to set aside icons like Robert E. Lee...

Posted on 11/24/18 at 9:57 am to
Posted by Vacherie Saint
Member since Aug 2015
39752 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 9:57 am to
We need leftist journalists in their 30's in 2018 to tell us what Lee was really like. His contemporaries, ancestors, and historians over the last 100+ years didn't know the "truth".
Posted by DMagic
#ChowderPosse
Member since Aug 2010
46505 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 9:58 am to
The author of Rexy’s article is bashing Trump’s no shemales in the military two posts down the page as cruel


Rex regurgitating his words verbatim
Posted by OleWar
Troy H. Middleton Library
Member since Mar 2008
5828 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 10:00 am to
The real truth that they hate is the fact that most Northerners understood in the immediacy of the war was that is was a colossal frick up.
Posted by Mid Iowa Tiger
Undisclosed Secure Location
Member since Feb 2008
18844 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 10:48 am to
Delusional. And I thought we couldn’t speak bad about generals? Which is it?
Posted by ABearsFanNMS
Formerly of tLandmass now in Texas
Member since Oct 2014
17542 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 11:19 am to
quote:

Yeah, no love lost between me and Obamy, but these guys rose up through the Bush military for 8 years too. 2004, Bush was president for 4 years and had 4 remaining years AFTER this incident was discovered. Obama certainly didn't help, but let's not pretend like military leadership was great before Obama. Actually, Bush and Obama were not wildly different from one another. They agreed on many, many things, and I'm sure Bush would have had no major qualms with the general selected for leadership or commands under Obama. But anyhoo, the primary problem with the leadership in the US military is the size and scope of the current DOD mission. Until that changes, we will not clean house.


The real “Brain Drain” of Military General Officer occurred during the Clinton Administration. If you look at the pace General Officer retirements during that time period you will see how many really good Officers spoke with their feet. Then the promotion of Beltway Bandits occurred to fill the vacuum. Those officers were selected not for their Strategic capacity but also their political ambitions and they have mentored similar minions to follow in their footsteps.
Posted by Wolfhound45
Hanging with Chicken in Lurkistan
Member since Nov 2009
120000 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 11:39 am to
quote:

Rex
Watching you post is like observing the aftermath of a gruesome car wreck. I know I should look away but I just can’t.
Posted by Diamondawg
Mississippi
Member since Oct 2006
32516 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 12:08 pm to
quote:

Lee was the beneficiary of outstanding corps and division commanders, that’s it


Yeah - that must be reason Lincoln wanted him fighting for the northern aggressors rather the confederacy.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 12:40 pm to
In fairness, Lincoln was operating under the recommendations of his General-in-Chief at the time, Winfield Scott. Lee had been on Scott's staff during the Mexican War and was a fellow Virginian to boot.

It was probably for the best that Lee did not take the command because I feel his fate would have been the same as McDowell's at First Bull Run. Lee struggled at the beginning of the war as he found his footing and learned the rigors of high command. I feel like that would have hurt him had he been in charge early on in the conflict.
Posted by Strannix
District 11
Member since Dec 2012
49165 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:17 pm to
You’re a dumbass
This post was edited on 11/24/18 at 1:18 pm
Posted by LSUconvert
Hattiesburg, MS
Member since Aug 2007
6229 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:20 pm to
quote:

Holy frick man. Grow some damn balls.


Yeah dude!

Just be unapologetically racist! When someone calls you out on it, just look at them and tell them that THEY are the racists.

Who wouldn't want the chance to circle jerk about how racist you aren't!?!
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:35 pm to
quote:

You’re a dumbass


Am I?

Before the Civil War, the largest army any U.S. officer had ever commanded was the 12,000 General Scott took with him to Vera Cruz in the Mexican-American War. McDowell was immediately put in charge of an army more than twice that number. West Point had not prepared its officers for assignments like that. At the time, the U.S. Military Academy was focused more on small unit tactics than large-scale, grand strategy involving armies numbering in their tens of thousands.

Lee struggled early on in the war. He lost the Confederacy what is now West Virginia while in command there in the early-summer of 1861. The man did not start off with a brilliant reputation. In fact, when he took command of the Confederate army in 1862, just about every southerner thought the war was lost. Had he commanded the Union army at Bull Run he would have run into similar problems McDowell did: undisciplined militia who did not respond well to orders and who moved extremely slowly on the march.

Lee's solid command of the tactical picture would not have been enough to win Bull Run. We saw that during the Seven Days' Campaign when Lee first took command. You can have the best battle plan ever designed, but if your troops don't get into position when they need to, everything can go awry. That's why the Union army lost Bull Run in the first place.
Posted by Strannix
District 11
Member since Dec 2012
49165 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:45 pm to
quote:

In fact, when he took command of the Confederate army in 1862, just about every southerner thought the war was lost.


Why are you posting facts that back up Lee’s incredible reputation. Probably one of the finest commanders in world history.
Posted by Lima Whiskey
Member since Apr 2013
19577 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:45 pm to
quote:

At the time, the U.S. Military Academy was focused more on small unit tactics than large-scale, grand strategy involving armies numbering in their tens of thousands.


Much of the curriculum focused on Engineering.
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:50 pm to
quote:

Just be unapologetically racist! When someone calls you out on it, just look at them and tell them that THEY are the racists.
A career military officer having a picture of a well respected military commander is unapologetically racist now


Thank you for letting me know you should never be taken seriously.
Posted by Lima Whiskey
Member since Apr 2013
19577 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 1:52 pm to
quote:

Lee struggled early on in the war. He lost the Confederacy what is now West Virginia while in command there in the early-summer of 1861


He made mistakes, but that one was not his fault.

The Confederacy sent two separate armies, led by rival commanders, and then they sent Lee to oversee them.

It’s been a long time, I don’t remember the rational for dividing the confederate forces, but I assume it was politics, and finding billets for people who wanted them. Neither commander was willing to work with the other and McClellan wrapped up their divided forces.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 2:01 pm to
He was in overall command. There were circumstances no doubt, but as the commanding officer, it was Lee’s job to keep them in line. He failed to do so.
Posted by Lima Whiskey
Member since Apr 2013
19577 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 2:04 pm to
He didn’t have any real power over them.
Posted by RollTide1987
Augusta, GA
Member since Nov 2009
65147 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 2:09 pm to
He was sent to West Virginia specifically to get Wise and Loring on the same page and working together.
Posted by wadewilson
Member since Sep 2009
36780 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 7:19 pm to
If there was a civil war general that McChrystal admired, I would have guessed it would have been Nathaniel Banks or John Bell Hood.
Posted by Roaad
White Privilege Broker
Member since Aug 2006
76820 posts
Posted on 11/24/18 at 8:08 pm to
quote:

quote:

Classic example of holding historical figures to modern standards.


As they should be.



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