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re: Why do Louisiana conservatives like TOPS?
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:40 pm to SaintsnTigers1
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:40 pm to SaintsnTigers1
quote:I assume you believe that college athletic scholarships are social programs, too, right?
TOPs is a fricking social program and must be eliminated.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:45 pm to RebelExpress38
Why? It's a government give-a-way program. The students who deserve scholarships get them. These days, there is plenty of scholarship $ for deserving students. A student that receives TOPs in addition to other scholarships is allowed to keep the TOPs $ and receives a check from the state that can be used for anything, including a new car, parties, trip, etc.. What a ripoff to taxpayers.
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 10:47 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:46 pm to SaintsnTigers1
quote:
Public education has NEVER been cut and is full of FAT, WASTE, and INEFFICIENCES. BUT, no one wants to go there.. Cut public education funding and let the parishes primarily fund it, just like every other state. Also eliminate TOPS while you're at it. AND then give everyone who pays taxes a huge tax cut.
i'm all for having local school district fund more of their own education costs (like most other states). But understand a few things about that...
1) Local school districts are going to have to raise sales and/or property taxes to do that. That's really the only two mechanisms they have
2) Our sales tax rate is already obscene
3) Because of our highest-in-the-nation homestead exemption, most of this new local taxation is going to fall on the middle and upper class
4) Because of all of the above, there better damn well be a reduction in state taxes.
I'm in favor of more local funding for K-12, not because I feel it's going to overall reduce funding, but I believe it will get more people invested in the system, and the system will have to more clearly show the need for money. Both of those should result in better school systems for the same amount of money.
PS - the only thing fiscal conservatives in LA like more than TOPS, is their homestead exemption of 75K
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 10:49 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:48 pm to LSURussian
quote:
I assume you believe that college athletic scholarships are social programs, too, right?
To compare TOPS to athletic scholarships, is like saying a kid with a 5.2 in the 40 yard dash would get a track and field scholarship.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 10:49 pm to LSUFanHouston
The voters of each parish SHOULD decide how much they want to fund public education. It works like this in almost every other state. Why are we different? We are spending WAY to much on public education in this state. Why doesn't the Advocate ever do some comparison studies with the spending levels of other states? Why is there no emphasis to make public education operate more efficiently in this state. There are millions that could be cut from the public education budget. We spend more per student than any other state in the South, by far (as of 2016):
LA $11,038
FL 8920
GA 9769
MS 8702
NC 8792
SC 10249
TN 8810
TX 9016
LA $11,038
FL 8920
GA 9769
MS 8702
NC 8792
SC 10249
TN 8810
TX 9016
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 11:07 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:05 pm to SaintsnTigers1
LINK
We spend per pupil the 29th-highest, and less than the national average.
Problem is, we get the 50th-highest results.
It's not the total amount we are spending is too high, rather, it's we are wasting tons of it. Plus, the percentage of money we spend on student support is way high, which is a function of the poverty level in this state. We have a lot of poor kids who need special services in this state.
There is hundreds of millions in fat, such as too many admins, too many central office people, and bloated contracts, not to mention, the bottom 20 percent of teachers. If that money was instead invested in the classroom, better teachers, better tech, etc... you would have much better results.
I guess the flip side is, we could cut spending in half, and we would still be the worst in terms of results.
We spend per pupil the 29th-highest, and less than the national average.
Problem is, we get the 50th-highest results.
It's not the total amount we are spending is too high, rather, it's we are wasting tons of it. Plus, the percentage of money we spend on student support is way high, which is a function of the poverty level in this state. We have a lot of poor kids who need special services in this state.
There is hundreds of millions in fat, such as too many admins, too many central office people, and bloated contracts, not to mention, the bottom 20 percent of teachers. If that money was instead invested in the classroom, better teachers, better tech, etc... you would have much better results.
I guess the flip side is, we could cut spending in half, and we would still be the worst in terms of results.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:07 pm to LSURussian
quote:
No, it's not.
Your average HS track and field athlete isn't getting a scholarship to LSU... but your average student academic record is getting a TOPS "scholarship"
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:08 pm to LSUFanHouston
It's both spending AND waste.
We spend more per student than any other state in the South, by far (as of 2016):
LA $11,038
FL 8920
GA 9769
MS 8702
NC 8792
SC 10249
TN 8810
TX 9016
So, we're spending more than other Southern states and getting little in return. Don't blame it on poverty. MS, TN, AL, and SC are poverty-stricken as well.
We spend more per student than any other state in the South, by far (as of 2016):
LA $11,038
FL 8920
GA 9769
MS 8702
NC 8792
SC 10249
TN 8810
TX 9016
So, we're spending more than other Southern states and getting little in return. Don't blame it on poverty. MS, TN, AL, and SC are poverty-stricken as well.
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 11:11 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:11 pm to touchdownjeebus
quote:
A privately funded scholarship, set up by Pat Taylor, for New Orleans public school students. It wasn’t meant for any other students in the state. It was privately funded and completely self sufficient. Then the state sold this grand plan to Mrs. Taylor and ruined the damn thing.
this. private and Catholic school kids getting TOPS ruined the whole thing. it should be an incentive to send your kid to public schools
also, the high acheiving kids who will likely leave the state don't need to be getting TOPS money. maybe our students from the 61st to the 94th percentile who will stick around after graduation should get it, even if they aren't the best of the best students
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:14 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
To compare TOPS to athletic scholarships, is like saying a kid with a 5.2 in the 40 yard dash would get a track and field scholarship.
some of them do if they can put the shot...
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:19 pm to chalmetteowl
No one should be getting TOPS $. TOPs and fiscal conservatism are not in sync with each other.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:19 pm to SaintsnTigers1
quote:
Don't blame it on poverty. MS, TN, AL, and SC are poverty-stricken as well.
And none of them have what I would call great schools, either. But I guess at least they are paying less for their shitty schools?
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:21 pm to Zach
quote:
I've always advocated that if TOPS is gonna happen then the requirements should be higher. I think 26 ACT should be the minimum
Why?
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:25 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:No but he might get a scholarship at Nicholls St or McNeese.
Your average HS track and field athlete isn't getting a scholarship to LSU..
One program awards scholarships based on athletic achievement and the other awards scholarships based on academic achievements, although the "achievement" requirements are too low, IMO.
But even with the too low requirements of TOPS a C student (an average student) is not eligible for TOPS unless he does above average on his ACT.
A social program for scholarships is the Pell Grant program.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:27 pm to LSUFanHouston
I agree. What a ridiculous comparison. Any kid who deserves an academic scholarship is getting one. They are getting TOPs in addition to the academic scholarship and using the TOPs money to buy a car, take a trip, have a few parties, etc.. And we taxpayers are footing the bill for this..
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 11:30 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:33 pm to Lsujacket66
quote:
It’s literally socialized education and a ridiculous program with the requirements so weak.
Louisiana is a highly taxed state that returns very little to the people that pay the taxes.
Somalia has better roads than my parish for example.
They have stopped fixing roads where I live and are just roping off hazards.
Why not start a thread like this about Medicaid or EBT?
frick off.
TOPS is one of the few things that the middle class grinders that pay taxes actually get a return on.
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:35 pm to LSUFanHouston
quote:
We spend per pupil the 29th-highest, and less than the national average.
Problem is, we get the 50th-highest results.
other statistics that will make you look twice on those numbers.
Which parish schools in the state qualifies most students quality for TOPS?
Orleans & EBR ranked #1 & #2, and it wasn't close.
Which makes sense when you consider-
quote:
New Orleans has the highest percentage of students attending private schools of any metro area in the country,
found that 25.1 percent of students in the New Orleans metro area attend private school, ranking it first above Honolulu and San Francisco.
Baton Rouge was fourth, with 19.1 percent enrolled in private schools
private school rates
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:39 pm to Scoop
Cut taxes for everyone (that pays taxes) and pay your own kids' education.
This post was edited on 6/24/18 at 11:40 pm
Posted on 6/24/18 at 11:48 pm to SaintsnTigers1
quote:That is not what the TOPS website says.
They are getting TOPs in addition to the academic scholarship and using the TOPs money to buy a car, take a trip, have a few parties, etc..
quote:
If the total of your scholarships, state and federal aid, and TOPS Award exceed the cost of attendance, your school will reduce any loans (if applicable) first and it will continue reducing your financial assistance until your awards do not exceed the cost of attendance. If the TOPS Award is totally eliminated, the semester or term will not be counted toward the maximum semesters or terms allowed.
Question 42 on page 13
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