re: Soldiers Hate the M4 and M16. The Pentagon Is Finally Doing Something about It.

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We need to swallow our pride and use the AK47.

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wtf?

Doooood ... no.

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We need a new caliber. 300 Blackout is useless. Shooting paper and people is exactly the same in all regards because Indians know stuff.

Now you're spun up.

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Haha Perfect

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Haha Perfect

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I think we could probably just move to 6.5 and call it good. Get rid of it all. 6.5 does everything.

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Explain please.

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Not to answer for him, but the stopping power sucks. Some on here have lauded the M, and for good reason. It is by far the most accurate commonly used rifle on the battlefield. With that said, it jams a lot. The weapon system is meh.

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Special units that might need something other than what mass armies in the field use are authorized to have flexibility in what they want to utilize.

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Yep. Some of the elite units have the option to use other weapons and calibers, and the use the m4 more often than any other platform. It's the best weapon of its type on God's green earth.

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I'm pretty sure that I read somewhere sometime in the past that, not only are your reasons for the pivot to the 5.56 round true, but, also, a Logistics reason. The Logistics reason for the adoption of the round is that the huge small arms ammo shipments that supply mass armies in the field overseas can fit WAY more 5.56mm than larger rounds

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This makes total sense to me. Anyone who has ever accidentally grabbed a case of .45 thinking it was something else can attest to the difference a few pounds makes

Back to the other point: a basic load of 5.56 mags is 210/7ish lbs. 7.62 is 7ish lbs for 100 rounds of belted ammunition if I recall correctly. Having double the ammunition for a basic load is not small advantage. It allows troops to carry more of the important stuff, like MG ammo, mortars, specialized equipment, radios, batteries, water, and also MG ammo and MG ammo while still carrying twice the effective ammo.

Given that we've been fighting enemies more maneuverable than us in every conflict since WWII makes sustainability a major issue in firefights.

And of course there is the reality that 99% of rounds loosed in combat are not fired at a point target. "Knock down power" isn't an advantage for covering fire, though sometimes penetration can be. The green tip and tungsten core rounds have bridged that gap pretty well. Well enough that there is no need for most units to carry anything other that 5.56 as a primary.

Of course there are specialized weapons designed to extend the effective range of riflemen. M14s, the 5.56 SPR, and the various battle rifles like the SR25 that are being used more and more by snipers and interspersed throughout the ranks of light infantry and SOF units to address those occasions where it is necessary. If anyone has carried those systems, they know it's not nearly as effective as the 5.56 round for 95% of all engagements for several reasons. It's just a fact that an m4 can, on average, put down more rounds more accurately for longer than 30cal rounds.

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I think we could probably just move to 6.5 and call it good. Get rid of it all. 6.5 does everything.

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Whatever. I'm keeping my 12 ga buckshot. 465 inch spread at 6 feet. When the captain calls me and asks for "Overwhelming Firepower" to clear a barrel, I tell him to frick off. But when the ole Kernel calls, I whip out the shotty!

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Not to answer for him, but the stopping power sucks.

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So? "Stopping power" can be an issue with any of the common infantry calibers. Sometimes it just takes more rounds. That's true of 7.62 sometimes too.

The primary use for ammo in combat it to provide cover for movement by forcing the enemies to stop shooting effectively momentarily. The overwhelming majority of rounds are fired at positions or areas, not point targets. That means a lot of rounds are fired at no particular person in an effort to prevent them from occupying a particular space at a particular time. 5.56 does that better in most instances, because it is smaller and troops can carry more of them, and the effective range isn't a big problem for most engagements. Particularly when going h2h with AKs. Other weapon systems, particularly MGs and grenade launchers provide effectiveness at further ranges.

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Get rid of it all. 6.5 does everything.

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Not really

I sleep with my M16 every night in NOLA waiting for someone to make me use it

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Not really

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Sure it does.

Muh ballistics.