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re: At what point will you say Lebron is better than Jordan was?

Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:39 am to
Posted by sms151t
Polos, Porsches, Ponies..PROBATION
Member since Aug 2009
140067 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:39 am to
quote:

At what point will you say Lebron is better than Jordan was?


I wont
Posted by TbirdSpur2010
ALAMO CITY
Member since Dec 2010
134050 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:40 am to
quote:

Know how i know you're too biased to have this discussion?


Nostalgia is some powerful stuff smh. As annoying as LeBron fan boys are, the out and out deifying of MJ is absurd.
Posted by UnluckyTiger
Member since Sep 2003
37515 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:42 am to
He's top 5 all time but he'll never be number 1. He's literally had a cakewalk his entire career to the Finals. Last year was probably his best performance. If he can do that against the Warriors a few more times over the next few years then maybe. But that's not happening.

In many cases perception is reality and Lebrons public perception is that he is bitch made and a primadonna. He did it to himself.
This post was edited on 4/25/17 at 10:43 am
Posted by Goldrush25
San Diego, CA
Member since Oct 2012
33794 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:45 am to
quote:

He's top 5 all time but he'll never be number 1. He's literally had a cakewalk his entire career to the Finals


Is that his fault no one wants to play in the East to get bounced in the first round? Watch where Paul George goes.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
111936 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:45 am to
quote:

If he can do that against the Warriors a few more times over the next few years then maybe
I know we're talking about something that'll never happen, but let's be honest...if Lebron gives us game 5-7 Lebron "a few more times" he'll certainly overtake MJ at that point, not sure why you'd put a "maybe" on that.

Posted by PhiTiger1764
Lurker since Aug 2003
Member since Oct 2009
14118 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:45 am to
quote:

If LeBron wins 5 titles, and loses 5 times in finals. Would it have been better if he lost in the ECF instead in 3 of those years?

I don't think losing in the finals is a knock.

But 6-0 in the finals is bettter than 5-5 in the finals. That's not the only thing to judge a player on but without question 6-0 is better than 5-5. LeBron would even tell you that.
Posted by Kracka
Lafayette, Louisiana
Member since Aug 2004
41162 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:46 am to
quote:

Archibald for sure.


Tiny retired a year after leaving the Celtics. Let's not act like he was at his peak during Birds rookie year.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
111936 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:46 am to
quote:

Is that his fault no one wants to play in the East to get bounced in the first round? Watch where Paul George goes.

It's just odd that Lebron does what he needs to do, beat the teams he should beat. Why would we count that as a negative?


Also, if you moved him over to the West for his entire career and keep all other teams the same, he likely still has right around 3 titles, with just less trips to the Finals. So he'd end up being 3 for 3 or something like that.
Posted by Baloo
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
49645 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:46 am to
quote:

I think Lebron's legacy will change once he retires and people look back and reflect on his entire career and what he accomplished and all the records he set. I think he will begin to get more credit than he does now. It will still be a subjective argument.

The only thing that can't be argued or disputed is that he is an all-time great.


Pretty much this. Also, their production looks different so its hard to make a direct comparison. Jordan won TEN scoring titles and LeBron only won one. Jordan was better at scoring, but LeBron has a more well-rounded game, getting more assists and rebounds. But Jordan still has the highest PER of all-time, and LeBron's will likely go down when he enters his decline phase.

I think the level of Jordan's dominance over the league was great than LeBron's, which makes me favor Jordan. But we also don't know how the rest of LeBron's career will play out. But if we go by the level of dominance argument, that introduces Wilt to the conversation.
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
111936 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:47 am to
quote:

Tiny retired a year after leaving the Celtics. Let's not act like he was at his peak during Birds rookie year.

Ok....Ricky Davis.

That's all I gotta say, Ricky Davis.
Posted by dabigfella
Member since Mar 2016
6687 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:47 am to
when he magically erases his 4 finals losses that jordan never had.

when he doesn't leave 2 teams to chase titles with super teams

Posted by dukke v
PLUTO
Member since Jul 2006
207856 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:47 am to
Never.....
Posted by lsupride87
Member since Dec 2007
100212 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:53 am to
quote:


when he magically erases his 4 finals losses that jordan never had.
6-4 would be far greater than 6-0. Like exponentially greater
Posted by litenin
Houston
Member since Mar 2016
2425 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:58 am to
Jordan is the best of my lifetime. Lebron is in the conversation and could potentially make a strong argument with a few more rings.

I think Lebron's best may be better than Jordan's best. However, Lebron has had a few moments of shrinking in certain situations or not taking over when he should. The overall resume for Jordan is currently much stronger.
Posted by Goldrush25
San Diego, CA
Member since Oct 2012
33794 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 10:59 am to
quote:

But Jordan still has the highest PER of all-time


By like .3 or something. It's a razor thin margin, but also very tough to overcome since we still have to figure in Lebron's decline as you said.

But if he has some kind of unforeseen resurgence for a couple of years, he could overtake MJ's PER. Highly unlike though.
Posted by Buckeye06
Member since Dec 2007
23506 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:00 am to
I won't get there. LeBron left the team that drafted him and had behind closed door conversations to create a "super" team.

He quit on his team against the Magic, and the owner, who now loves him again, said it himself. It was too hard for him, so he left. What did Jordan do when it was tough and he couldn't beat the Pistons?

He went to Miami, and admittedly won titles, but when the big 3 started, he had 2 of the top 5, and 3 of the top 15 players in the game on his team, as Bosh was a top 15 player when he left Toronto.

When he came back to Cleveland, he joined Irving and had the front office bring Love in. I certainly don't blame him for wanting to get the best team on the floor, everyone should. They lost to a great GS team, and won last year.

When other hall of famers talk about Jordan, you realize how special he was.

LINK

The 31 minute mark there Drexler Robinson and Coach K talk about how he never slept and was superhuman.
Posted by gorillacoco
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2009
5324 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:05 am to
quote:

As Larry Bird said, you can't compare eras, you can only compare success.


I know it's out of date for Lebron, but if you're crowning someone based on success, Bill Russell is the undisputed GOAT.

Posted by c on z
Zamunda
Member since Mar 2009
128401 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:12 am to
quote:

He went to Miami, and admittedly won titles, but when the big 3 started, he had 2 of the top 5, and 3 of the top 15 players in the game on his team, as Bosh was a top 15 player when he left Toronto.


Do we have to continuously underrate what MJ had when he began to win titles?
Posted by shel311
McKinney, Texas
Member since Aug 2004
111936 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:17 am to
quote:

LeBron left the team that drafted him and had behind closed door conversations to create a "super" team.
Quite literally has no bearing on how good of a player he is.

quote:

He quit on his team against the Magic
I've officially heard it all on Lebron with this take. Lebron averaged 39/8/8 in that series

quote:

It was too hard for him, so he left.
Look above at the numbers he put up, ya don't say it was too hard for him!

Posted by Hamma1122
Member since Sep 2016
20551 posts
Posted on 4/25/17 at 11:21 am to
Never
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