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re: I just finished The Empire Strikes Back...there's nothing in the prequels...
Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:07 am to Scoob
Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:07 am to Scoob
quote:
Empire is the greater dramatic achievement, but not the ground breaker the original was within the medium.
I think Empire is more the one that has ensured the longevity of the franchise. If Empire sucked, then Star Wars would be looked at as a one hit wonder with memorable special effects and characters. Empire though took the franchise in a completely different direction from what everyone was expecting and turned Vader's intimidation and villainy up to 11.
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Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:22 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
1. Lightsabers
They're glowing cool swords. Who gives a shite? If the character that is holding it I don't give a damn about, I have no reason to care about the scene.
quote:
2. Lore/The universe
Well, that's retarded, because I'd argue that the Empire Strikes Back gives you the most lore out of the 7 films. Yoda is a dispensary of information on the lore of Star Wars.
quote:
These things are both severely lacking in the originals. In fact, if you take away all the supposedly useless knowledge that we gained from the prequels and just look at the OT, we know pretty much jack shite about anything in the Star Wars universe. We know very little alien species, and hardly anything about the ones we do know.
bullshite. You find out more about the Star Wars universe in the Cantina scene than you do about anything in the prequels. We already knew the Senate existed and we already knew the Jedi Order existed. What else did we find out? That the Force is microscopic bacteria and Anakin was tricked by the Emperor in the name of love instead of actually being seduced by the Dark Side? Also Anakin and Obi Wan did really nothing but yell at each other, so there's that too.
quote:
We know tons of planet names but nothing about them. We don't understand any of the space travel stuff, nothing about the force besides some tiny tidbits from Yoda, nothing about lightsabers, nothing about any governments or way of life... Etc... You can go on with this. Lucas tried to pack a lot of this into the prequels and it made it extremely watered down and terrible. I get that. But that's just what I like the most: IMO it's what make Star Wars unique. If you just have tons of space battles with very little force usage and almost no lightsabers (I can't believe people defend any of rhe saber fights in the OT: they all suck major balls), you might as well just watch Star Trek because other than these things, it does the rest better.
This should be an appropriate response to all your garbage points: LINK
quote:
I think TESB is a fine film, and I adore Star Wars so it's up there for me, but it doesn't do what I personally like in Star Wars so it's not even among my top 3 in the series (ROTS, ROTJ, TFA).
LINK
Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:28 am to blueboy
quote:
Most people I know think it's the third best in the OT.
You hang out with morons then.
quote:
Star Wars is #13 in the AFI Top 100. Empire isn't even on the list, so that should give you an idea how most people in the business feel about it.
Star Wars has certainly had a larger impact on cinema than Empire has and it deserves that position. That's really how AFI measures the movies it places on the list. But that doesn't change that Empire should be on that list. Even more than The Godfather Part II, The Empire Strikes Back has completely defined what a sequel should be. It set the bar. Critics and audiences were initially confused by this, in how dark and aimless the plot is, and how it doesn't really have a beginning and end. It is a movie that gets that it is the second of 3 acts. Save for the Godfather, no other sequel really got that before. Almost every movie sequel has tried to emulate it in some way.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:30 am to blueboy
quote:
It's kind of corny and is really just a setup for Jedi. Most people I know think it's the third best in the OT.
Maybe you just hang out with people who analyze films poorly. The whole "birds of a feather" thing ...
Posted on 12/31/15 at 7:40 am to blueboy
Maybe you should just give up on Star Wars and threads about Star Wars since you seem not to like anything about it..
Posted on 12/31/15 at 8:40 am to OMLandshark
You're clearly blinded by your hatred. You must have missed the several times in my post where I clearly pointed out that that was my opinion. Nowhere did I say that what I like abojt Star Wars has to be what you like.
You're literally delusional about the cantina scene. That's what everyone always says. we see a bunch of aliens in that scene... And learn nothing about them. No lore at all.
We hear about the senate? We never see them. Know nothing about them. Don't know what it's like, how it operates. You see all of that in the prequels. You learn about alien species. You learn about some politics.
I understand that all of you like different things about Star Wars than me - that's fine. Go on your merry way. You don't need to attack me for it.
About the lightsabers thing - personally I prefer swords over guns, but I don't like like "medieval" time type stuff so there is a small window of things that I really get to enjoy swords in. Star Wars is one, and the prequels clearly did it better IMo.
You're literally delusional about the cantina scene. That's what everyone always says. we see a bunch of aliens in that scene... And learn nothing about them. No lore at all.
We hear about the senate? We never see them. Know nothing about them. Don't know what it's like, how it operates. You see all of that in the prequels. You learn about alien species. You learn about some politics.
I understand that all of you like different things about Star Wars than me - that's fine. Go on your merry way. You don't need to attack me for it.
About the lightsabers thing - personally I prefer swords over guns, but I don't like like "medieval" time type stuff so there is a small window of things that I really get to enjoy swords in. Star Wars is one, and the prequels clearly did it better IMo.
This post was edited on 12/31/15 at 8:44 am
Posted on 12/31/15 at 8:43 am to CRAZY 4 LSU
quote:Of course it is. IV is the best to me. As much as i love V, it's considered overrated by me just because of how highly people rate it. It was great, but it wasn't as good as IV.
It's not even up for debate it's the best film in the franchise
Posted on 12/31/15 at 8:45 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
These things are both severely lacking in the originals. In fact, if you take away all the supposedly useless knowledge that we gained from the prequels and just look at the OT, we know pretty much jack shite about anything in the Star Wars universe. We know very little alien species, and hardly anything about the ones we do know.
The unknown is what makes the OT great. Literally everything that Lucas tried to explain in the Prequels failed. Great storytelling doesn't mean spelling out every single detail through dialogue.
Things like the Force, the Clone Wars, Anakin's history, etc. we're all much more interesting until Lucas tried to explain them in the Prequels.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 8:50 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
You're clearly blinded by your hatred.
quote:
You're literally delusional about the cantina scene
quote:You will enjoy this board a lot more if you put that guy on ignore.
Go on your merry way. You don't need to attack me for it.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:02 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
Things like the Force, the Clone Wars, Anakin's history, etc. we're all much more interesting until Lucas tried to explain them in the Prequels.
Absolutely. Sometimes a little mystery goes a long way.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:04 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
You're literally delusional about the cantina scene. That's what everyone always says. we see a bunch of aliens in that scene... And learn nothing about them. No lore at all.
We see that they are highly violent. We see that death at this point in the universe, no matter how over the top it may be, is mostly ignored. We see prejudice against droids. We learn how violent mobsters seem to rule things. We see how the Empire doesn't seem to really run things around there.
quote:
We hear about the senate? We never see them. Know nothing about them. Don't know what it's like, how it operates. You see all of that in the prequels. You learn about alien species. You learn about some politics.
What did we learn about the Senate? Just that they meet in a big room and had a Chancellor? Also that they are composed of 99% idiots? I don't know what we learned about them that couldn't have been reasonably deduced in the OT.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:07 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
The unknown is what makes the OT great. Literally everything that Lucas tried to explain in the Prequels failed. Great storytelling doesn't mean spelling out every single detail through dialogue.
Things like the Force, the Clone Wars, Anakin's history, etc. we're all much more interesting until Lucas tried to explain them in the Prequels.
This is something I can understand some people enjoy - and it a valid thing to like. Many people have told me they like not understanding everything. That is perfectly fine.
What is not fine - and is honestly kind of a joke - is trying to say that the OT explains more stuff than the PT. IT doesn't - it leaves a lot more open to interpretation. Which again, IS FINE, but as I said in my first post, I personally enjoy to learn everything about it. I like to know the backstory and the lore. I like to understand the force and the makeup of lightsabers and as much about the politics of the time and the origin of characters. All that sort of stuff. It's just what I enjoy. Nothing wrong with that, or with being the opposite.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:26 am to FreddieMac
I saw empire 7 times at the theater in the summer of 80' as a 6 year old. Thanks mom for taking me so many times.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:29 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
This is something I can understand some people enjoy - and it a valid thing to like. Many people have told me they like not understanding everything. That is perfectly fine.
This is how I am. I want somethings to guess about. Of course with Empire we knew another movie was coming and with all movies now we know other movies will come and tie things together.
I still enjoyed the prequels. Just not as much as the originals.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:40 am to Rand AlThor
quote:
I like to know the backstory and the lore. I like to understand the force and the makeup of lightsabers and as much about the politics of the time and the origin of characters
Which is great if the storyteller nails it and doesn't spend all of his time worrying about CGI effects and trying to cram every minute detail at the expense of character development.
The Phantom Menace has no true protagonist and the supposed antagonist has zero character development. We get two hours of indigestible political bickering via a green screen without any developed story.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 9:54 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
Which is great if the storyteller nails it and doesn't spend all of his time worrying about CGI effects and trying to cram every minute detail at the expense of character development.
The Phantom Menace has no true protagonist and the supposed antagonist has zero character development. We get two hours of indigestible political bickering via a green screen without any developed story.
I mostly agree with this. The prequels are definitely super flawed. They are mostly a jumbled, chaotic mess with questionable characters and terrible acting. They still give you a lot of information. Some, or most (
) would say it is too much, but I mostly disagree. There is just so much to Star Wars, I can understand why Lucas had to pile so much into these movies- because he didn't explain nearly enough to really create a massive universe in the OT. Too much was left wide open. I can see why he would want to lock a lot of that down. 
Posted on 12/31/15 at 11:18 am to LSUlefty
quote:
Empire is actually my favorite film of all time.
Same here. Empire and The Wrath Of Khan that is.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 1:18 pm to OMLandshark
quote:You're talking out of your arse. You have no idea how the AFI chooses the movies on the list.
That's really how AFI measures the movies it places on the list.
quote:
But that doesn't change that Empire should be on that list. Even more than The Godfather Part II
Posted on 12/31/15 at 2:52 pm to lsufan9193969700
It's a good thing Lucas cut the Wampa attack scenes inside the rebel base on Hoth or you would be lumping it in with The Phantom Menace.
Posted on 12/31/15 at 3:37 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Even more than The Godfather Part II, The Empire Strikes Back has completely defined what a sequel should be.
Um....no.
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