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Telling 15+ caps to improve by practicing short game is wrong, and insulting
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:09 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:09 pm
Drives me nuts seeing this advice given to guys who struggle with every part of their game. OBVIOUSLY chipping and putting is important for all of this and they need to work on it.
90% of these guys will improve much faster learning to get their driver in play and be able to hit irons and full wedges on or near the green. Doesn’t matter if they can chip or putt if they’re chipping for bogey every hole
90% of these guys will improve much faster learning to get their driver in play and be able to hit irons and full wedges on or near the green. Doesn’t matter if they can chip or putt if they’re chipping for bogey every hole
15
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:18 pm to Tiger1242
Didn't you start this exact same thread a few months ago?
Edit: Yes, same thread except beginners instead of 15+ handicappers.
Edit: Yes, same thread except beginners instead of 15+ handicappers.
This post was edited on 8/21/25 at 2:49 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:25 pm to Tiger1242
Speaking as a 15 handicap.... The driver is the best club in my bag. Everything else needs improvement. It is true to say that if you can chip and putt your score will decrease. My issue is my irons. Im just too inconsistent with them.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:27 pm to Tiger1242
This is just an awful take.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:27 pm to Tiger1242
quote:
90% of these guys will improve much faster learning to get their driver in play and be able to hit irons and full wedges on or near the green.
Maybe I’m mistaken but aren’t scoring wedges considered short game?
I’d say 90% of my practice now is 120 yards and in. My favorite drill is to pick the 100 yard flag and hit my SW, GW, PW, and 9 iron to the flag. It will teach you all sort of shite about your swing.
This post was edited on 8/21/25 at 2:30 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:36 pm to MrSpock
quote:
Maybe I’m mistaken but aren’t scoring wedges considered short game?
Yeah, you're mistaken. Short game is considered any shot inside 50 yards not on the green.
OP is right, at least according to strokes gained data. More improvement can be found from improving off the tee and approach. The better you get off the tee, the easier the approach game. The better the approach game, the easier the short game, and so on.
For short game and putting, most golfers can improve by simply making sure you are putting after any short game shot and working on lag putting to avoid 3-putts.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:40 pm to DestrehanTiger
Lou the stats guy has shown time and time and time again short game matters less and less the worse you get
It doesn’t even matter as much as driving for the very best in the world, its importance only shrinks as you make your way to the high handicappers
People will never change their opinion though regardless of how much you slap them in the face with data or common sense
It doesn’t even matter as much as driving for the very best in the world, its importance only shrinks as you make your way to the high handicappers
People will never change their opinion though regardless of how much you slap them in the face with data or common sense
This post was edited on 8/21/25 at 2:42 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:48 pm to Tiger1242
Agree that the first priority should be staying in play off the tee. After that, short game is absolutely the easiest way to lower scores. Pitching/chipping and lag putting shave soo many strokes. Those skills also translate well to getting yourself out of trouble off the tee (assuming you're on the course).
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:54 pm to Tiger1242
It completely depends on the person.
I have friends who are 15+ handicappers despite hitting the ball great because they can never get up and down or 3 putt the vast majority of holes. I also have some friends who hit the ball terribly with decent short games.
Figure out what the person’s struggles are, then focus on that.
I have friends who are 15+ handicappers despite hitting the ball great because they can never get up and down or 3 putt the vast majority of holes. I also have some friends who hit the ball terribly with decent short games.
Figure out what the person’s struggles are, then focus on that.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 2:56 pm to Tiger1242
If you can't chip/putt, you can't score. If you can't drive, you can't play.
I fricking suck arse at getting off the tee. Like it's atrocious. If I could drive like a normal 10-15 capper I'd probably be mid-low single digits but I just suck so badly off the tee. I can hit it far as frick but my contact is, to put it mildly, inconsistent. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if you told me I was losing 12+ strokes a round off the tee.
100%. It's a helluva lot easier to hit greens with a 9 iron or PW in hand vs a 5 iron.
I fricking suck arse at getting off the tee. Like it's atrocious. If I could drive like a normal 10-15 capper I'd probably be mid-low single digits but I just suck so badly off the tee. I can hit it far as frick but my contact is, to put it mildly, inconsistent. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if you told me I was losing 12+ strokes a round off the tee.
quote:
The better you get off the tee, the easier the approach game. The better the approach game, the easier the short game, and so on.
100%. It's a helluva lot easier to hit greens with a 9 iron or PW in hand vs a 5 iron.
This post was edited on 8/21/25 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 3:03 pm to JohnnyKilroy
It’s totally golfer dependent. To paint this picture with stats that’s supposed to be applied to every golfer is moronic. Most 10-15 handicap golfers aren’t hitting many greens in regulation. They’re hitting almost just as many wedges and more putts than they do their driver. It makes literally zero sense to me to tell me it’s better to get close to the green in 2 when you are completely incapable of ever getting up and down and 3 putt constantly. It is by far the easiest way to become a better golfer and lower your score.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 3:03 pm to Tiger1242
About half your strokes come from tee and fairway, about half your strokes come from on or around the green.
Both areas are important.
Both areas are important.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 3:09 pm to RawDog7984
quote:
Most 10-15 handicap golfers aren’t hitting many greens in regulation.
Most 10-15 handicap golfers are putting 1 or 2 (or more) tee shots OB.
High handicappers are spraying it even worse.
It doesn't really matter how shitty your putting is when you're consistently lying 4 or 5 from 150 yards out.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:08 pm to JohnnyKilroy
It doesn’t matter if you keep it in the fairway if you can’t get it in the hole or chip it on the green. Both things are important.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:10 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
Didn't you start this exact same thread a few months ago?
Edit: Yes, same thread except beginners instead of 15+ handicappers.
did I really? That’s how passionate I am about this I suppose
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:13 pm to i am dan
quote:
About half your strokes come from tee and fairway, about half your strokes come from on or around the green.
Both areas are important.
But one of those areas can explode your score much faster. Hitting multiple balls out of play and hitting most of your other 2nd shots from the trees kill you way faster than 3 putting multiple times and duffing some chips. Both suck, but one is worse
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:22 pm to RawDog7984
quote:
Both things are important.
No one has said otherwise.
But it's undeniable that getting on the green in the least amount of strokes is the most important metric for making lower scores.
Who do you think will shoot a lower score? The guy who is consistently putting for par or the guy consistently trying to get up and down for bogey?
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:35 pm to Tiger1242
quote:
did I really?
That’s how passionate I am about this I suppose
I see that
I agree with beginners but you can't really put an exact handicap on it like 15. There are some 15 handicaps that are pretty decent off the tee and god awful at putting.
By the time you get to a 15 it's normally pretty obvious what the "Ok this is the part of my game I need to work on the most" is.
I do think that most people don't work on their short game enough though. It's not uncommon to see guys show up to the range with nothing but a driver and hit driver for an hour and never sniff the putting green.
Posted on 8/21/25 at 4:59 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
It's not uncommon to see guys show up to the range with nothing but a driver and hit driver for an hour
I've legit never seen that even one time, and I go to the range a LOT.
This post was edited on 8/21/25 at 5:00 pm
Posted on 8/21/25 at 5:04 pm to Tiger1242
I would be around a 10 if I could be a moderately decent putter. I'm the worst putter inside 4ft anyone has ever seen... It's crazy the number of 3 putts I have per round.
I do agree with this though, and I've done just that. Just can't putt for chit. 
I do agree with this though, and I've done just that. Just can't putt for chit.
quote:
90% of these guys will improve much faster learning to get their driver in play and be able to hit irons and full wedges on or near the green.
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