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Started By
Message
Car stealerships need to die out.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:40 pm
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:40 pm
The business model of serving as the middle man between the manufacturer and customer is severely outdated, and the price-gouging the service departments pull on customers is criminal.
Inb4 dear Facebook..
I recently purchased a newer Acura off the private market that has some minor issues I am tackling myself. One of the issues is an emissions warning with codes P0420/P0430 accompanied by a parking brake error. There is a TSB (technical service bulletin) issued by Acura that describes the very issue at length - the cat converters aren't worn out; rather, the ECU's sensitivity to the 02 sensor's readings are too high - and provides instructions to the service techs to reflash the PCM to the latest software update. This can only be done at a dealership.
I roll into my appointment with these specific instructions only to be told that they must perform a $180 diagnostic service in order to determine if the car needs the software update or not. I decline and say that I just want the reflash done, whether the car needs it or not. The service mgr tells me that it's their policy that they must do the diagnostic service before proceeding with anything. I relent, since I have no option other than spending 3+ hours ripping out both cat converters ($500 each for new Magnaflow ones from NAPA) and replacing them myself.
I sit in the lounge for 3 hours with no update. Finally, the service manager strolls in and tells me that they pulled the exact codes I told them I already pulled myself, and says that the cats need to be replaced and gives me a quote for an exorbitant amount for the service. I ask if he reflashed the software first and he says that he doesn't know and will go ask the tech. Sit for another hour. He comes back and says that they will need to replace both cats first before doing the reflash. Won't give me a reason why. I ask for my keys. Won't give them to me without paying the $180 diagnostic.
Currently escalating up the chain just to get a damn software update on the car. It really shouldn't be this way.
Inb4 dear Facebook..
I recently purchased a newer Acura off the private market that has some minor issues I am tackling myself. One of the issues is an emissions warning with codes P0420/P0430 accompanied by a parking brake error. There is a TSB (technical service bulletin) issued by Acura that describes the very issue at length - the cat converters aren't worn out; rather, the ECU's sensitivity to the 02 sensor's readings are too high - and provides instructions to the service techs to reflash the PCM to the latest software update. This can only be done at a dealership.
I roll into my appointment with these specific instructions only to be told that they must perform a $180 diagnostic service in order to determine if the car needs the software update or not. I decline and say that I just want the reflash done, whether the car needs it or not. The service mgr tells me that it's their policy that they must do the diagnostic service before proceeding with anything. I relent, since I have no option other than spending 3+ hours ripping out both cat converters ($500 each for new Magnaflow ones from NAPA) and replacing them myself.
I sit in the lounge for 3 hours with no update. Finally, the service manager strolls in and tells me that they pulled the exact codes I told them I already pulled myself, and says that the cats need to be replaced and gives me a quote for an exorbitant amount for the service. I ask if he reflashed the software first and he says that he doesn't know and will go ask the tech. Sit for another hour. He comes back and says that they will need to replace both cats first before doing the reflash. Won't give me a reason why. I ask for my keys. Won't give them to me without paying the $180 diagnostic.
Currently escalating up the chain just to get a damn software update on the car. It really shouldn't be this way.
23
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:41 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
quote:
The word "stealership" needs to die out.
Just clean the convertors
Easy fix with some O2 sensor spacer cheaters.
Cheap on Amazon
This post was edited on 5/19/25 at 1:51 pm
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:45 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
Yea, i'm surprised we allowed this system to go unchanged throughout the entire tech era. You can build the exact car you want online and they will still make you come in a sign a piece of paper and give them their cut.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:47 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
It is only going to get worse. Cars are becoming some complex that you will likely need to go to the dealer in the future. There will be future independent mechanics.
The right to fix stuff with John Deere is eye opening.
The right to fix stuff with John Deere is eye opening.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:48 pm to theliontamer
quote:
Yea, i'm surprised we allowed this system to go unchanged throughout the entire tech era. You can build the exact car you want online and they will still make you come in a sign a piece of paper and give them their cut.
Car dealerships are among the most powerful commercial entities in a lot of rural places. They have an incredibly active lobby.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:48 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
did you ever think that maybe the manufacturers don't want to sell direct or deal with broke dicks who show up looking for free help?
You can bitch about the exorbitant prices all you want, but if they tell you in advance what the cost is and you agree to it, you have nothing to complain about.
You can bitch about the exorbitant prices all you want, but if they tell you in advance what the cost is and you agree to it, you have nothing to complain about.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:52 pm to slidingstop
quote:
did you ever think that maybe the manufacturers don't want to sell direct or deal with broke dicks who show up looking for free help?
You can bitch about the exorbitant prices all you want, but if they tell you in advance what the cost is and you agree to it, you have nothing to complain about
I was willing to pay the cost for the software update, which was in the neighborhood of $100.
I'm not willing to be given the runaround with diagnostic feeds and service/parts that are not needed.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:52 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
Car dealerships are among the most powerful commercial entities in a lot of rural places. They have an incredibly active lobby.
the mega used car lots are HUGE as well
pushing the little guys out
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:53 pm to GeauxTigers123
quote:
The right to fix stuff with John Deere is eye opening.
I read a story about this…. a farmer in Alabama has a lawsuit with them.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:54 pm to slidingstop
quote:
You can bitch about the exorbitant prices all you want, but if they tell you in advance what the cost is and you agree to it, you have nothing to complain about.
It sounds like OP asked to pay for a specific service and they told him that he couldn’t get that service unless he paid for another which he eventually agreed. Once they provided the unnecessary service they told him they didn’t know how to do the original service that he asked for.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:54 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
I will say I pride myself on making those f’ers squirm.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:55 pm to slidingstop
quote:
but if they tell you in advance what the cost is and you agree to it, you have nothing to complain about.
This is a total red herring. The whole point OP is making is that the services charged were unnecessary to begin with.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:55 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
They have an incredibly active lobby.
This is the problem, with so, so many things. Just a goddamned enormous "good old boy" network.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 1:56 pm to Bigdawgb
quote:
that the services charged were unnecessary to begin with.
The counter argument is that the service department is concerned that they will be blamed if you come in to address issue. A and they don't know about potential issue B. Owner of the vehicle comes back and says that the service department created issue b
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:04 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
Someone with some computer knowledge could make a mint connecting private sellers of late model, low mileage used automobiles with people interested in buying the same with access to financing and independent, third party condition assessments of the vehicle. Most people who have a low mileage used car wind up trading it in and losing a pile of money that they could have gotten from a buyer directly and most buyers are too scared of being robbed by a seller to go to an individual. Take a small fee for connecting the two as well as a small fee for listing and a small fee for connecting buyers to financing and inspections and the next thing you know you are making more than an oil field welder.....
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:07 pm to Rouge
quote:
The counter argument is that the service department is concerned that they will be blamed if you come in to address issue. A and they don't know about potential issue B. Owner of the vehicle comes back and says that the service department created issue b
Except that the service that OP brought his car in for is a fix for an issue that the manufacturer acknowledged being aware of and sent out a bulletin with a detailed explanation of the problem and the instructions to the dealership service departments on how to fix it.
quote:
One of the issues is an emissions warning with codes P0420/P0430 accompanied by a parking brake error. There is a TSB (technical service bulletin) issued by Acura that describes the very issue at length - the cat converters aren't worn out; rather, the ECU's sensitivity to the 02 sensor's readings are too high - and provides instructions to the service techs to reflash the PCM to the latest software update. This can only be done at a dealership.
OP should probably make a complaint directly to Acura's client relations department about the dealer service department refusing to follow the service bulletin that came directly from Acura.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:08 pm to theliontamer
During the height of the idiocy of COVID most dealers were marking cars up crazy amounts over invoice cause idiots were buying them. At the time Ford said they would simply sale direct to consumers and cut their dealers out of the loop....and I think they may have actually done so, I know one of our local Ford Dealers is now a Lincoln Dealer exclusively....
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:09 pm to JEC119
quote:
quote:
The right to fix stuff with John Deere is eye opening.
I read a story about this…. a farmer in Alabama has a lawsuit with them.
Kept me from buying one last year.....
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:10 pm to McDonaldsBagMan
They make waaaaaaaay too much money to do nothing be lie all day.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 2:24 pm to AlextheBodacious
quote:
It sounds like OP asked to pay for a specific service and they told him that he couldn’t get that service unless he paid for another which he eventually agreed.
He should've stopped right here.
quote:
Once they provided the unnecessary service they told him they didn’t know how to do the original service that he asked for.
no they didnt:
quote:
I ask if he reflashed the software first and he says that he doesn't know and will go ask the tech. Sit for another hour. He comes back and says that they will need to replace both cats first before doing the reflash. Won't give me a reason why. I ask for my keys. Won't give them to me without paying the $180 diagnostic.
They know how to "reflash" the software they don't want to without replacing the cats. He doenst wnat to pay for that. Now hes pissed about the $180.00 which he agreed to when he showed up for the appt.
The dealership may be a bunch of crooks (and likely are), but he agreed to pay the $180.00
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