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re: Thoughts on Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes
Posted on 5/19/24 at 1:17 am to Revorising
Posted on 5/19/24 at 1:17 am to Revorising
I didn’t find Noa to be very interesting. Just the generic good-guy character. He was ok but is he special enough to build a new world around.
The apes aren’t that smart compared to humans. The virus that made humans dumb must’ve hit 99% of the human race bc otherwise humans would wipe out the apes with modern weaponry. Since there are humans still left who are smart, and they have the capability of working satellites and radios, seems like they oughta be able to get some rifles and wipe out the dumb monkeys. One chick with gunpowder and a revolver wrecked havoc with the evil apes.
The movie was well made, top notch production and cinematography. It was a bit long and took a while to get going.
The apes aren’t that smart compared to humans. The virus that made humans dumb must’ve hit 99% of the human race bc otherwise humans would wipe out the apes with modern weaponry. Since there are humans still left who are smart, and they have the capability of working satellites and radios, seems like they oughta be able to get some rifles and wipe out the dumb monkeys. One chick with gunpowder and a revolver wrecked havoc with the evil apes.
The movie was well made, top notch production and cinematography. It was a bit long and took a while to get going.
1
Posted on 5/19/24 at 6:31 am to Revorising
quote:
One thing I picked up on is that the Apes understand that humans are capable of much more than they are with intelligence.
When Noah and his crew see the kid's book with the monkeys and animals in cages at the zoo it was like OHHHH SHITT!! They know
Posted on 5/22/24 at 2:51 pm to biglego
I saw it last night and overall I thought it was a really good movie. I don't think Noa is nearly as strong of a lead as Caesar was though. He has to much Beta energy.
A few observations/questions (in no particular order):
1) Raka at the very least needed more time with Noa. He carried a good portion of the movie imo. I am sad he didn't wash up on shore at the end.
2) They never explain how the chick just knew everything. She goes from a lost starving child to a super motivated badass without much explanation. She claims her group was attacked by Proximus but at the end she goes to her group and they are just waiting for her.
3) They also never really hashed out what Proximus's plan with the other apes were. Like why did he capture the falcon clan (and I assume other clans)? It seemed like he was using them as slaves but then when he spoke to Noa or others it was like he was talking about them as part of his kingdom. The overall structure of his kingdom didn't make much sense. Why would any of the apes stick around? If its threat of violence then they are slaves and not subjects. And who is going to willingly follow a guy that burned down their homes and murdered their clan members? The dynamics just seemed off to me.
4) They also never really explained how Proximus's minions knew to look for the girl. I guess it can be surmised that they attacked her group and knew she got away but how did they know that her and her group had any info about the bunker?
When it comes to movies like this, I do get that you have to suspend some belief and just go with it. Overall I found it very entertaining and a good movie though.
I also found it funny that no matter how smart they get, they still act like a bunch of monkeys.
A few observations/questions (in no particular order):
1) Raka at the very least needed more time with Noa. He carried a good portion of the movie imo. I am sad he didn't wash up on shore at the end.
2) They never explain how the chick just knew everything. She goes from a lost starving child to a super motivated badass without much explanation. She claims her group was attacked by Proximus but at the end she goes to her group and they are just waiting for her.
3) They also never really hashed out what Proximus's plan with the other apes were. Like why did he capture the falcon clan (and I assume other clans)? It seemed like he was using them as slaves but then when he spoke to Noa or others it was like he was talking about them as part of his kingdom. The overall structure of his kingdom didn't make much sense. Why would any of the apes stick around? If its threat of violence then they are slaves and not subjects. And who is going to willingly follow a guy that burned down their homes and murdered their clan members? The dynamics just seemed off to me.
4) They also never really explained how Proximus's minions knew to look for the girl. I guess it can be surmised that they attacked her group and knew she got away but how did they know that her and her group had any info about the bunker?
When it comes to movies like this, I do get that you have to suspend some belief and just go with it. Overall I found it very entertaining and a good movie though.
I also found it funny that no matter how smart they get, they still act like a bunch of monkeys.
This post was edited on 5/22/24 at 2:53 pm
Posted on 5/22/24 at 9:27 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
I don't think Noa is nearly as strong of a lead as Caesar was though. He has to much Beta energy.
I really liked Noa but I don’t think he’s supposed to be Ceaser. He’s very young and much more inexperienced than Ceaser. And we are definitely supposed to see him as flawed for where the story has to go.
quote:
2) They never explain how the chick just knew everything. She goes from a lost starving child to a super motivated badass without much explanation. She claims her group was attacked by Proximus but at the end she goes to her group and they are just waiting for her.
Um, I think it’s clear. She was in a unit that got sent out to get the information from the base and her unit got killed and she had to go into hiding. She was worried to show she could speak because she knew it would bring bad attention her way
quote:
3) They also never really hashed out what Proximus's plan with the other apes were. Like why did he capture the falcon clan (and I assume other clans)? It seemed like he was using them as slaves but then when he spoke to Noa or others it was like he was talking about them as part of his kingdom. The overall structure of his kingdom didn't make much sense. Why would any of the apes stick around? If its threat of violence then they are slaves and not subjects. And who is going to willingly follow a guy that burned down their homes and murdered their clan members? The dynamics just seemed off to me.
I think you’re overthinking it. I don’t think they were free but I don’t think it’s southern antebellum slavery. Probably more similar to Roman slsvery where they captured a tribe and put them to work and as long as that tribe did the work expected, they’d have some autonomy
Posted on 5/22/24 at 11:55 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
They never explain how the chick just knew everything. She goes from a lost starving child to a super motivated badass without much explanation. She claims her group was attacked by Proximus but at the end she goes to her group and they are just waiting for her.
She always knew everything she just kept her intelligence a secret because it’s her intelligence that popped her up on Proximus’ radar
quote:
They also never really hashed out what Proximus's plan with the other apes were.
Virtual slave labor with some freedom to move around and live life relatively normally. Give them enough just to where they won’t leave but still use them to open the vault
Posted on 5/23/24 at 9:19 am to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
1) Raka at the very least needed more time with Noa. He carried a good portion of the movie imo. I am sad he didn't wash up on shore at the end.
I think everyone agrees with that, and it seems so obvious now that he'll need to make some return in the next film.
quote:
2) They never explain how the chick just knew everything. She goes from a lost starving child to a super motivated badass without much explanation. She claims her group was attacked by Proximus but at the end she goes to her group and they are just waiting for her.
As others said, she was pretending to not know anything.
I don't understand why she brought over the hard drive or whatever the device was and then just walked off. I guess they aren't letting her in b/c she's infected, but the virus doesn't affect her but she could still pass it on, maybe?
quote:
3) They also never really hashed out what Proximus's plan with the other apes were. Like why did he capture the falcon clan (and I assume other clans)? It seemed like he was using them as slaves but then when he spoke to Noa or others it was like he was talking about them as part of his kingdom. The overall structure of his kingdom didn't make much sense. Why would any of the apes stick around? If its threat of violence then they are slaves and not subjects. And who is going to willingly follow a guy that burned down their homes and murdered their clan members? The dynamics just seemed off to me.
Proximus is an idiot in power. He's no different than a pharoah in ancient Egypt. Why'd all those slaves work for the Egyptians? Same dynamics.
quote:
I also found it funny that no matter how smart they get, they still act like a bunch of monkeys.
That's something i like. They are still animals, and they are also new to intelligence. They are basically cavemen, so you can't expect them to be equal to humans today.
quote:
I don't think Noa is nearly as strong of a lead as Caesar was though. He has to much Beta energy.
Of course he's not Caeser, but Noa seems more intelligent than most other apes. I also think his intelligence and the knowledge i expect him to gain in the next movie will initially help the apes, but over time will be manipulated by bad apes and be a negative for their civilization.
I think it's interesting how the ape civilization evolves. It's almost like thinking what would happen to human civilization if everyone got wiped out for some reason and only a few thousand people were left to rebuild civilization. You have new rules and beliefs you can implement from the start of humanity that will last for ages, and you see how they get twisted over time. For instance, "apes don't kill apes" didn't even last a few generations before they started murdering each other. It's just a fun dyanmic to explore and that's basically what these movies are about.
Posted on 5/23/24 at 10:01 am to TeddyPadillac
quote:
He's no different than a pharoah in ancient Egypt. Why'd all those slaves work for the Egyptians? Same dynamics.
The people who built the pyramids were not slaves.
quote:
Great Pyramids not built by slaves edit There is a consensus among Egyptologists that the Great Pyramids were not built by slaves.[17][18][19] According to noted archeologists Mark Lehner and Zahi Hawass, the pyramids were not built by slaves; Hawass's archeological discoveries in the 1990s in Cairo show the workers were paid laborers, rather than slaves.[20][18][21][22] Rather, it was farmers who built the pyramids during flooding, when they could not work their lands.[23][24][18][25]
However, from that same article, I think forced labor from taxation from Egyptian times does apply here
quote:
Forced labor edit Several departments in the Ancient Egyptian government were able to draft workers from the general population to work for the state with a corvée labor system. The laborers were conscripted for projects such as military expeditions, mining and quarrying, and construction projects for the state. These slaves were paid a wage, depending on their skill level and social status for their work. Conscripted workers were not owned by individuals, like other slaves, but rather required to perform labor as a duty to the state. Conscripted labor was a form of taxation by government officials and usually happened at the local level when high officials called upon small village leaders.[11][16]
Posted on 5/23/24 at 10:09 am to athenslife101
quote:
The people who built the pyramids were not slaves.
and are you telling me Charleston Heston and the Ten Commandments was wrong? Moses didn't lead the enslaved Israelites out of Egypt and to the promise land?
Posted on 5/23/24 at 10:30 am to TeddyPadillac
There were slaves in Egypt. Just those weren’t the people who build the pyramids.
The pyramids had existed for a long time before the Israeli enslavement
The pyramids had existed for a long time before the Israeli enslavement
Posted on 5/23/24 at 10:48 am to athenslife101
quote:
I think you’re overthinking it
I am definitely over thinking it. Esepcially the girl. It obviously makes sense that she was part of a search party looking for the disk. I just wish they went into how they knew about it "Many generations later" but were just now getting around to retrieving it.
quote:
. Probably more similar to Roman slsvery where they captured a tribe and put them to work and as long as that tribe did the work expected, they’d have some autonomy
I am by no means a roman expert so correct me if I am wrong but the Romans more or less let the people they conquered stay in the area they lived in as long as they paid taxes and were willing to be conscripted into the army right? I didn't think the Romans were going into Gaul, bringing them all back to Rome and putting them to work but letting them live otherwise free lives.
I guess my disappointment in the superficialness of "the kingdom" is that the movie was named kingdom so I was hoping to get more details into how exactly it worked and the overall goals and interworkings of the kingdom.
Also why do the writers of this series hate Gorillas? The gorillas are the bad guys or the unloyal ones in every movie except the first one. Are Gorillas assholes?
Posted on 5/23/24 at 12:07 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
I am by no means a roman expert so correct me if I am wrong but the Romans more or less let the people they conquered stay in the area they lived in as long as they paid taxes and were willing to be conscripted into the army right? I didn't think the Romans were going into Gaul, bringing them all back to Rome and putting them to work but letting them live otherwise free lives.
Um, no. The exact opposite The Romans were at a fundamental level, a slave state. They didn’t do it to their allies, but their enemies.., yeah. Their armies were followed by slavers. They often enslaved entire tribes as punitive actions
This post was edited on 5/23/24 at 12:09 pm
Posted on 5/23/24 at 12:23 pm to athenslife101
quote:
The people who built the pyramids were not slaves.
quote:
Great Pyramids not built by slaves edit There is a consensus among Egyptologists that the Great Pyramids were not built by slaves.[17][18][19] According to noted archeologists Mark Lehner and Zahi Hawass, the pyramids were not built by slaves; Hawass's archeological discoveries in the 1990s in Cairo show the workers were paid laborers, rather than slaves
It’s always funny to me that the same people who laugh at the biblical account of various events but take archeologists word as gospel who dug stuff up over 4000 years later.
I’m not even saying the Jewish people built the pyramids as slaves. I just think it’s about ridiculous to say that there wasn’t slave labor used to build the pyramids.
Posted on 5/23/24 at 1:33 pm to Adam Banks
Archeology and what happened in the gospels isn’t mutually exclusive. There’s a whole subset of biblical archeology… that treats the Bible as a historical text
I mean, they have evidence from digging up the communities of the workers. The evidence suggests they weren’t slaves. Not sure why that’s so objectionable
I hope not. The Israelis were not enslaved till much much later. The Great Pyramids were around 2500 BC and Moses was born around 1300 BC
quote:
it’s about ridiculous to say that there wasn’t slave labor used to build the pyramids
I mean, they have evidence from digging up the communities of the workers. The evidence suggests they weren’t slaves. Not sure why that’s so objectionable
quote:
I’m not even saying the Jewish people built the pyramids as slaves.
I hope not. The Israelis were not enslaved till much much later. The Great Pyramids were around 2500 BC and Moses was born around 1300 BC
Posted on 5/23/24 at 2:04 pm to athenslife101
quote:
I mean, they have evidence from digging up the communities of the workers.
You buy the interpretation of someone 4000+ years later on the payment and labor of workers?
Posted on 5/23/24 at 2:52 pm to Adam Banks
If that’s what the evidence suggests, sure. Why would you not. What of any proof whatsoever is there out there to say anything one way or the other.
Also, it doesn’t quite make sense with how Egyp operated in the time period
Also, it doesn’t quite make sense with how Egyp operated in the time period
Posted on 5/23/24 at 4:10 pm to athenslife101
quote:
that’s what the evidence suggests, sure. Why would you not.
It was 4000 years ago. Unless we have the ledgers then we don’t know how much or if they were paid.
You are just blindly trusting someone who says that in the midst of a time where slavery was common that the biggest structures were built 100% slavery free
Posted on 5/23/24 at 6:41 pm to Adam Banks
Jeez, this is asinine.
All they say is right now the best evidence they have suggests they were free skilled laborers after excavating work camps. And that’s the best evidence we have so it’s fine to have that as a working theory.
All they say is right now the best evidence they have suggests they were free skilled laborers after excavating work camps. And that’s the best evidence we have so it’s fine to have that as a working theory.
Posted on 5/23/24 at 6:54 pm to Bert Macklin FBI
quote:
Are Gorillas assholes?
Posted on 5/23/24 at 7:55 pm to athenslife101
How about we all shut the frick up about the damn Egyptian slaves and pyramids.
When is the next apes movie coming out? Do I have to wait 2 years?
When is the next apes movie coming out? Do I have to wait 2 years?
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