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re: If Brock Bowers or Rome Odunze are still on the board at 14, do you take one of them?
Posted on 4/5/24 at 2:37 pm to GynoSandberg
Posted on 4/5/24 at 2:37 pm to GynoSandberg
Are the Jets still needing a tackle? I know they signed Tyron Smith but he's missed a lot of games because of injury.
If Bowers makes it past the Jets then I think it's a real possibility that we could get him but tackle is a bigger need so that's probably what they would do although I'd be very happy if we did get Bowers.
If Bowers makes it past the Jets then I think it's a real possibility that we could get him but tackle is a bigger need so that's probably what they would do although I'd be very happy if we did get Bowers.
Posted on 4/5/24 at 2:43 pm to LooseCannon22282
They signed Morgan Moses too but they are visiting with first round tackles as well
Posted on 4/5/24 at 5:17 pm to Handsome Pete
Posted on 4/5/24 at 6:01 pm to Chalkywhite84
McConkey is somebody who I could see the Chiefs picking at number 32
Posted on 4/5/24 at 6:13 pm to LSUPilot07
Yes to Bowers, no to Rome.
Posted on 4/5/24 at 7:42 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
You’re already on record saying these other TEs will outperform Bowers, yes?
What are you talking about? What other TEs?
quote:
I think bowers is safer than any OT outside of Alt
Great. That's what you think. If the Saints also think that, they should probably draft him. Historically, though, it's a bigger risk (see Pitts, Fant, Ebron, Hockensen, OJ Howard). That's the last 4 TE taken before pick 20, their teams thought they were safer picks too. Not all horrible, but no stars there, and none of them elevated their team.
Posted on 4/5/24 at 10:39 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:
[quote]What are you talking about? What other TEs?
I was mistaken, it was another poster. He had listed 4 other TEs saying they would out produce Bowers
quote:
see Pitts, Fant, Ebron, Hockensen, OJ Howard).
What do they mean with regards to Bowers’ and his talent?
It should make ya think twice when Bowers name routinely pops up with elite WRs. It’s not often the tape, stats/data, athletic testing all jive. It’s very hard to ignore for me
quote:
As an 18-year-old true freshman, TE Brock Bowers averaged a team-high 58.8 YPG. That was ____ more than that of his following teammates:
1.7X that of WR Jermaine Burton (proj. R3)
2.0X that of WR Ladd McConkey (proj. R2)
2.1X that of WR Adonai Mitchell (proj. R1)
quote:
Receiving Yards Before 21st Birthday
+ Top-45 players on @dpbrugler 's Big Board
1. Malik Nabers (3,003)
--
2. Brock Bowers (2,538)
3. Troy Franklin (2,483)
--
4. Rome Odunze (1,632)
5. Keon Coleman (1,506)
6. Marvin Harrison Jr. (1,402)
--
7. Brian Thomas Jr. (1,257)
--
8. Ladd McConkey (954)
--
10. Roman Wilson (542)
11. Adonai Mitchell (495)
quote:
2024 WR Class (plus Brock Bowers) by YPRR
+ Power 5-only, min. 175 routes
Age 18 Season
1. Brock Bowers (3.01)
2. Xavier Worthy (2.61)
3. Malik Nabers (1.95)
4. Brian Thomas Jr. (1.40)
Age 19 Season
1. Malik Nabers (2.44)
2. Brock Bowers (2.37)
3. Troy Franklin (2.34)
4. Keon Coleman (2.07)
Age 20 Season
1. Malik Nabers (3.64)
2. Troy Franklin (3.32)
3. Marvin Harrison Jr. (3.18)
4. Brock Bowers (2.65)
quote:
Power Five YPT leaders on non-screen passes since 2015 (150+ tgts)
CeeDee Lamb: 14.3
DeVonta Smith: 14.0
Ja’Marr Chase: 13.5
Brock Bowers: 13.0
Jerry Jeudy: 12.7
Jermaine Burton: 12.6
quote:
College prospects to average 7.5+ YAC/Reception, 60+ Rec YPG and a 70% catch rate throughout college since 2015 (min 170 rec)
Malachi Corley*
Brock Bowers*
DeVonta Smith
Rondale Moore
CeeDee Lamb
AJ Brown
Posted on 4/6/24 at 10:20 am to JustinT37
quote:You clearly haven’t been paying attention to the entire DA process.
If Bowers is on the board and they don’t draft him, people deserve to be fired.
People who elevated him to HC deserve to be fired.
He deserves to be fired.
Tom Fears would be a better choice for HC and he’s dead.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 10:51 am to Handsome Pete
quote:
Historically, though, it's a bigger risk (see Pitts, Fant, Ebron, Hockensen
Umm, Hockenson was the number one te in the league before he got hurt this year. May want to leave him out your argument.
I still think Pitts is being underutilized big time, along with horrible qb play. And he has a 1k yard season at least. OJ Howard should have never been a 1st round pick. He didn’t have the game tape, just the measurables.
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 10:56 am
Posted on 4/6/24 at 1:26 pm to Borntoboogy
quote:
Yes to Bowers, no to Rome.
Curious on your reasoning against Rome
Posted on 4/6/24 at 1:58 pm to Townedrunkard
quote:
Umm, Hockenson was the number one te in the league before he got hurt this year. May want to leave him out your argument.
Hockensen was average to good for 4 years with Detroit, then blossomed with the Vikings. Definitely not worth pick 8 for the Lions, especially since that made him one of the highest paid tight ends in the league from day 1. This is pretty common with TE, taking a few years to reach their potential.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 2:11 pm to GynoSandberg
quote:
should make ya think twice when Bowers name routinely pops up with elite WRs. It’s not often the tape, stats/data, athletic testing all jive. It’s very hard to ignore for me
Look, I get why people think Bowers is special, even if he is a bit undersized. I just think history tells us TE is more of a risk in the first round, and TE is less of a need for the Saints. First round OTs succeed more reliably and the position is a desperate need. Conveniently, most draft experts think there are at least four 1st round caliber OT talents in this year's draft. Heck, if we draft Bowers he'll have to stay in to block all season because our O -line will be shite. He feels like a luxury pick.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 3:04 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:
Look, I get why people think Bowers is special, even if he is a bit undersized. I just think history tells us TE is more of a risk in the first round, and TE is less of a need for the Saints. First round OTs succeed more reliably and the position is a desperate need. Conveniently, most draft experts think there are at least four 1st round caliber OT talents in this year's draft. Heck, if we draft Bowers he'll have to stay in to block all season because our O -line will be shite. He feels like a luxury pick.
It honestly doesn’t matter. People can drool over Bowers all they want but even if he’s available they’re not drafting him. The fact we have people saying we can sign guys off the street to play OT and draft Bowers- tells you all you need to know. This team is desperate for a premier OT, DA has stressed openly about being strong on oline, they are investing in Carr and the way they treated Penning was very telling down the stretch. Its a premier OT even if they have to reach and they’ll be posters whining about Bowers being there and we just passed him.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 5:16 pm to Pels_Yaz
quote:
honestly doesn’t matter. People can drool over Bowers all they want but even if he’s available they’re not drafting him. The fact we have people saying we can sign guys off the street to play OT and draft Bowers- tells you all you need to know. This team is desperate for a premier OT, DA has stressed openly about being strong on oline, they are investing in Carr and the way they treated Penning was very telling down the stretch. Its a premier OT even if they have to reach and they’ll be posters whining about Bowers being there and we just passed him.
While I do think they draft ot, they could put a bandaid on tackle and draft bowers.
Grab a guy like Charles Leno, peat, or Donovan smith.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 5:25 pm to Chalkywhite84
quote:
they could put a bandaid on tackle and draft bowers.
Grab a guy like Charles Leno, peat, or Donovan smith.
Exactly. Hurst isn't that bad at LT if we had to do it for a year.
I'm at the point now where if it's not Alt or Fashanu, then I'm not sure OT is even worth 14
Posted on 4/6/24 at 5:31 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:Smith.
Historically, though, it's a bigger risk (see Pitts, Fant, Ebron, Hockensen, OJ Howard). That's the last 4 TE taken before pick 20, their teams thought they were safer picks too. Not all horrible, but no stars there, and none of them elevated their team.
I agree that historically it's a bigger risk to take a tight end over a tackle.
Problem is Bowers isn't just any tight end. He is doing things that have never been done. He hasn't just done them for 1 year either. Bowers has been elite for 3 years straight.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 6:13 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:
First round OTs succeed more reliably and the position is a desperate need
And we just drafted one fairly high the year before last, and look where we are at. Andrus Peat sat his arse on the bench. If Bowers is a bust, I’d be shocked. If Bowers is on the board, he’s the best player available, unless Nabors somehow slipped.
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 6:19 pm
Posted on 4/6/24 at 6:16 pm to Handsome Pete
quote:
Hockensen was average to good for 4 years with Detroit, then blossomed with the Vikings. Definitely not worth pick 8 for the Lions, especially since that made him one of the highest paid tight ends in the league from day 1. This is pretty common with TE, taking a few years to reach their potential.
Maybe he just wasn’t in the right system or had the right qb. I think the same thing will happen to Pitts eventually.
Just saying you can’t use him as an example when he was the freaking number one te in the league this year late in the season. You don’t think the Saints would take that production at 14?
This post was edited on 4/6/24 at 6:17 pm
Posted on 4/6/24 at 6:33 pm to Townedrunkard
Hock was 4th in TE rec and 3rd in yards his second season.
Year 3 was on a near identical pace before he got injured.
Year 4 he was 2nd in rec and 2nd in yards.
Year 5 he was 2nd in rec, 4th in yards
At worst he’s a top 5 TE. The team (and QB) who drafts any pass catchers matter a ton.
Year 3 was on a near identical pace before he got injured.
Year 4 he was 2nd in rec and 2nd in yards.
Year 5 he was 2nd in rec, 4th in yards
At worst he’s a top 5 TE. The team (and QB) who drafts any pass catchers matter a ton.
Posted on 4/6/24 at 7:21 pm to GynoSandberg
Hock lit up our defense with Dobbs throwing it to him and that was also while Jefferson was out with an injury.
11 catches 134 yards and 1 TD
Sam LaPorta
9 catches 140 yards and 1 TD
I mean why not go after a position where you could possibly be getting the next best young TE?
Use to your advantage as to what got you beat previously.
Nothing against Juwan Johnson but he's not going to put a games like that consistently. The game he had in Tampa had 9 catches 80 yards and 1 TD. Which is nice but you'd like to see more yardage with that many catches? I don't know.
I'm cool with whatever they do because the Saints have a few needs at different positions. I'd lose my shite if they traded up and dealt away future picks though.
11 catches 134 yards and 1 TD
Sam LaPorta
9 catches 140 yards and 1 TD
I mean why not go after a position where you could possibly be getting the next best young TE?
Use to your advantage as to what got you beat previously.
Nothing against Juwan Johnson but he's not going to put a games like that consistently. The game he had in Tampa had 9 catches 80 yards and 1 TD. Which is nice but you'd like to see more yardage with that many catches? I don't know.
I'm cool with whatever they do because the Saints have a few needs at different positions. I'd lose my shite if they traded up and dealt away future picks though.
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