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Started By
Message
re: 'You earned it, you keep it act' bill would eliminate taxes on Social Security
Posted on 2/8/24 at 7:31 pm to TigerintheNO
Posted on 2/8/24 at 7:31 pm to TigerintheNO
quote:
raises the cap on SS tax from 168K to 250K
I would be willing to accept this if I thought our government was run efficiently and this was what was needed to keep the program solvent. But it isn’t…so I won’t.
I don’t know what the math is, but what across the board spending cut would be needed to shore up SS ? 2%? 5%?
Do that before you take my more of my money and send it to Ukraine.
Posted on 2/8/24 at 7:57 pm to TigerintheNO
Nm
This post was edited on 2/8/24 at 8:03 pm
Posted on 2/9/24 at 2:54 am to jclem11
quote:
You do realize that your benefit is paid on the wages you earned and social security taxes you paid in during your working years?
I get this sentiment, but how is it going bankrupt then?
If it's how you claim - you're just getting what you paid in - then why does it matter if I pay? Your generation's pot of money should pay for you.
The reality is that workers surviving to retirement age has increased, extending survivor benefits for those that die before/after retirement, and people living to be older than the program intended are what is draining it. Politics prevents the above from being corrected.
Having more "workers" paying to cover the current beneficiaries only masks the problem; a sort of pyramid scheme. At some point you can't keep growing workers/population at which point that generation would be screwed.
Lastly, imo, SS is one of the easier problems to fix relative to the slew of government problems. Healthcare is a much more difficult problem, as is the expansion of government handouts.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 4:00 am to TigerintheNO
quote:No.
-raises the cap on SS tax from 168K to 250K
It doesn't touch taxes between 168K and 250K.
It would "fill the trust fund’s coffers" by applying a Social Security tax to all earnings above $250,000.
Social security tax is 12.4%
Currently tax rates from ~$250K to $609 are 35%. Above $609, they are 37%.
The Craig tax would constitute a 12.4% tax hike for employed earners in those two tax brackets.
i.e.,
>$250K = 47.4%
>$609K = 49.4%
Posted on 2/9/24 at 4:01 am to SquatchDawg
quote:Except that is not the proposal
I would be willing to accept this
Posted on 2/9/24 at 4:09 am to armtackledawg
quote:12.4%. Half of that may be shielded from some workers by their employers, but as an employer cost, those chickens will come home to roost somewhere.
Correct, and a very big one. 6+%
For the self-employed, it's a 12.4% hike, flat out.
For trust fund and "unearned" income, it's zero.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 4:54 am to TigerintheNO
WHo are the three deadbeat fricks to downvote this?
Posted on 2/9/24 at 5:32 am to SquatchDawg
quote:
I would be willing to accept this if I thought our government was run efficiently and this was what was needed to keep the program solvent. But it isn’t…so I won’t
I would be willing to give up the employer side to get the employee side. Opt out now, employer side goes to the fund, employee side goes into and IRA. Anyone under 40 not taking that deal?
Posted on 2/9/24 at 5:37 am to TygerTyger
quote:But the OP did badly mischaracterize Craig's proposal.
WHo are the three deadbeat fricks to downvote this?
Posted on 2/9/24 at 5:53 am to NC_Tigah
quote:
No. It doesn't touch taxes between 168K and 250K. It would "fill the trust fund’s coffers" by applying a Social Security tax to all earnings above $250,000.
quote:
The Craig tax would constitute a 12.4% tax hike for employed earners in those two tax brackets.
You said all earnings, so it wouldn’t just be employed earners. It would be all earners. Just like the Medicare surtax/net investment tax, the source of the income doesn’t matter, they get you either way (limited exceptions like S Corp active participation).
Your thinking is correct though, it’s simply a high income tax, but they don’t have to raise the marginal tax rates.
And it’s not a permanent fix to the problem. The carrot is just to gain support from current retirees that likely have other income that they won’t pay tax on benefits, so they can put a permanent flat tax on earnings above $250k. Again that Medicare tax threshold hasn’t moved since they came up with it. They are sliding that SS tax threshold swiftly. They will meet in the next 10 years, so employment income will be subject up to $250k, and ALL income above that.
People don’t even really think about FICA in terms of taxes. It’s a compulsory 15.3% tax before income taxes are even considered, that everyone pays. I looked at a return recently, this poor girl made $25k in only self employed income, didn’t take any deductions, and wound up with a $5k tax bill when filing, $3800 was FICA. Those are the people I really feel for. She was barely making a living, but still reported all of her income and didn’t even think to take deductions. Wound up on a payment plan. Meanwhile people making what she makes in welfare, don’t pay any taxes, and take her $3800 with them to Costco.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 6:21 am to TygerTyger
quote:
WHo are the three deadbeat fricks to downvote this?
I’m one of them. This is a permanently added flat tax.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 6:29 am to TigerintheNO
I’m stunned a Democrat brought this up!
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:00 am to TigerintheNO
quote:
Most of it goes to rent and transportation,” Hokkanen said, adding that she’d love to use the extra money to travel if the tax on Social Security benefits gets eliminated with the “You Earned It, You Keep It Act.”
Sorry, lady. I'm not interested in a relative tax increase to fund your travel.
The window dressing will make this enticing for those that are receiving or are on the cusp of receiving SS benefits and they absolutely don't give a shite that some people will get boned for this to happen should this proposal go through.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:30 am to TigerintheNO
frick this. Another tax the wealthy to fund the people who don’t carry their weight. It’s sad that once you hit that ~$165k cap you feel like you’re getting a raise. Spending needs to be cut, not tax the rich, but there’s too many freeloaders in this country.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:31 am to Hou_Lawyer
quote:
Spending needs to be cut,
Indeed. No one understands this.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:33 am to TigerintheNO
quote:
-that would repeal the taxation of Social Security benefits
-raises the cap on SS tax from 168K to 250K
-extends the program's solvency by 20 years
I might would support something like this if it also included:
- Stop skimming from the program to pay for other government programs.
- STOP allowing those that did not pay in to draw.
- move the program to or provide an option for an investment based system
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:43 am to OceanMan
quote:Yes. I was just repeating wording in the OP source. FYI, the actual bill frames it in terms of an employment/wage tax.
You said all earnings
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:45 am to The Maj
quote:Again, the OP got this wrong. The SS Tax would apply to all earnings >$250K
-raises the cap on SS tax from 168K to 250K
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:56 am to TigerintheNO
I've been saying for over 20 years the fix for Social Security and Medicare by our D.C. Overlords will ultimately be no cap on payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare and means testing of individual wealth.....it's moving that direction.
Posted on 2/9/24 at 7:59 am to bigblake
quote:
This is wrong. It doesn’t have a cap. It goes from $1 to $168k then 0 from $168k-250k then it resumes paying from 250k+. That’s how it’s generating so much revenue to stop having people pay taxes on SS AND make it solvent for another 20 years AND cut deficit spending by some trillions.
Unless you are like the Bidens and others who can afford good lawyers to avoid taxes. This is not somethig that is available to people who are paid via W2 - only to those with LLCs of legitmate business, and those NOT legitimate in the case of the Bidens.
Joe Biden's tax strategy
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