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re: Was LSU's hiring of Curley Hallman the worst hiring in the..
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:06 pm to ehidal1
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:06 pm to ehidal1
Not sure about the other finalists when Hallman was hired. I'm pretty sure Archer got the job on Arnsparger's recommendation.....Archer's problem was that he lost the players. His recruiting too heavily in Texas, for kids that in many cases didn't pan out, also hurt us in the long term as he opened the door even wider for out of state schools to recruit Louisiana.
2
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:07 pm to bruintiger
quote:
hallman had some success at s miss because of favre...
this is true. he parlayed that big time....for a while anyway.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:17 pm to noladan
quote:I definitely agree with this. The mass exodus of La talent to Tennessee, Miami, and others was definitely prevalent in the 80s and 90s.
His recruiting too heavily in Texas, for kids that in many cases didn't pan out, also hurt us in the long term as he opened the door even wider for out of state schools to recruit Louisiana.
Archer did get hired on the recommendation from Arnsparger. But, Arnsparger was trying to deflect LSU from Spurrier, so that he could hire him when he went to UF. And the rest is history.
I remember most of the prime candidates for most of the LSU football coaching hires during that time, but for some reason can't think of who the finalists were against Hallman.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:55 pm to Ace Midnight
Joe Dean
Posted on 12/20/08 at 4:59 pm to bruintiger
kirk feretz at iowa makes over 3 million and does not do jack
Posted on 12/20/08 at 5:17 pm to ehidal1
quote:
I know Broadhead hired Arnsbarger, but was Archer hired under him or Dean? I can't remember. Also, who were the finalists for the job when Hallman was hired?
Dean definitely hired Hallman. The short list included Steve Spurrier and Mike Shanahan.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 5:21 pm to Ace Midnight
Hallman actually had a number 2 ranked recruiting class. He brought in the atheletes. Archer did not recruit.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 5:38 pm to Ethan Martin
quote:
Hallman actually had a number 2 ranked recruiting class. He brought in the atheletes. Archer did not recruit.
I just turned 25 years old when the 1992 season started. I have never coached anybody in sports or athletics, except my children. I am merely a fan and student of the game.
I mean this in all sincertity, if I had been the coach of the 1992 LSU Fighting Tiger football team, with no assistant coaches, just me to call the plays and defensive formations, and basically just had the players coach themselves, we would have won 4 or 5 games. That's how bad a coach Curley Hallman was/is.
I hear he just finished his autobiography, due out next year, entitled, "Curley Hallman: Still Losin'"
Posted on 12/20/08 at 5:51 pm to ehidal1
quote:
Archer did get hired on the recommendation from Arnsparger. But, Arnsparger was trying to deflect LSU from Spurrier, so that he could hire him when he went to UF.
Wily Bill got over on us big-time. We easily could have had Spurrier, but he convinced the bigwigs to promote his DC, who, not coincidentally was dumb as a post. This was the true demise. We can blame Brett Farve for Curley, pure and simple. His talent that made USM competitive with the SEC teams for those couple of years led to us hiring his coach.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 6:25 pm to noladan
not to mention that he coasted on, and then completely bungled, the LSU QB situation, allegedly due to succumbing to influence from B.R. boosters.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 6:39 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:I do remember these. Wasn't Bobby Bowden really wanting the LSU job and was a prime candidate when Archer was hired? Or was that when Arnsparger was hired?
Dean definitely hired Hallman. The short list included Steve Spurrier and Mike Shanahan
Posted on 12/20/08 at 6:48 pm to Ace Midnight
I agree with other posters that Archer was worse and my two reasons are: 1.Archer had a pretty well-oiled machine when he took over from Arnsparger. Arnsparger brought needed discipline and organization to the coaches, the program, the practices....and Archer inherited a 10-1-1 season. When he left, the whole program was in disarray. 2. Curley had enough success at USM for us to believe he could deliver... and he was very likable to those who mattered at the time. But, Curley was sidetracked by his own demons. Good recruiter and behind the scenes with supporters... I honestly don't know about the hands on coaching, relationships with staff, etc.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 6:54 pm to Ethan Martin
quote:
Hallman actually had a number 2 ranked recruiting class.
ranked by whom?
Posted on 12/20/08 at 6:55 pm to ehidal1
quote:
Wasn't Bobby Bowden really wanting the LSU job and was a prime candidate when Archer was hired? Or was that when Arnsparger was hired?
I'm not sure how the Bowdens factored in to LSU's coaching vacancies. Bobby has been the HC at FSU since 1976. Terry Bowden was looking for a head coaching job when Curley was hired, and was ultimately hired by Auburn for the 1993 season. Maybe that's it.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 7:05 pm to Ace Midnight
Hallman was the worst coach by far at LSU. All you had to do was listen to a Hallman post-game interview after a loss to know he was worse than Archer.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 7:08 pm to ehidal1
I think Bowden was intersted in LSU during the late 70s/early 80s. But after coming to Baton Rouge and beating LSU, I think he decided FSU was fine for him.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 7:17 pm to LA007
quote:
I agree with other posters that Archer was worse
And I'm not singling you out, man, this goes for all the people with short memories - Archer SEEMED bad at the time he was let go. However, we hadn't seen anything yet.
To put it in perspective, Archer's last two seasons were 4-7, and 5-6 (for which he was fired.) This was after a 10 win season (which don't happen a lot at LSU) and a Top 5 finish (something that only Miles has been able to make routine, if not automatic). Hallman's seasons AVERAGED 4 wins. AVERAGED Archer's worst season. AVERAGED. And, to top it off, Archer could actually coach players. Yes, he didn't produce, and I don't disagree with his firing, but dammit, somebody has to call a spade a spade, and Hallman was one of the worst division I coaches in history. Not at LSU, not in the SEC, but in all of big league college ball.
Again perspective, Hallman won 16 games to 28 losses. 10 SEC wins in 4 freakin' seasons. Think about that for a minute....
The current Bama coach won at least 5 SEC games every year at LSU, and Miles is averaging nearly 6 SEC wins, counting this miserable year in the mix, and Curley was a 2.5/year? Mac was run off for losing to Alabama. Curley got an extra year because he beat Alabama once? Just crazy talk.
The Rant is becoming a refuge of intellectual lightweights, sadly - I started this exercise as a counterpoint to both my argument that Mac is LSU's greatest coach, period, and the "worst hire in past 10 years" thread.
This is the response - Nobody wanted to back me up on Mac being the greatest coach (and Not listing Moore or Dietzel, even, where there's some argument, they list Saban and Arnsparger?) - and now only a handful come in and argue Hallman worse than Archer.
Archer coached LBs for a Superbowl team, and did a decent job coordinating a defense with limited material at Kentucky. After Brett Favre was drafted, all Curley did was lose, lose, lose, lose badly, and look bad doing it.
Archer was promoted too early, and was probably ruined by LSU in the process. I will remind everyone (again) that Archer is just a few months older than Les Miles. He was promoted to head coach of LSU when he was 36 years old.
It's just silly. When you look at the grand scheme of things, and the results the two coaches had, Archer might be a C- or D+ at worst. Hallman is an unqualified F, or Z-, or however low you can go.
This post was edited on 12/20/08 at 7:22 pm
Posted on 12/20/08 at 7:44 pm to Ace Midnight
any mention of Malleveto yet?
Has any coach had this much talent but did so little?
Has any coach had this much talent but did so little?
Posted on 12/20/08 at 7:59 pm to Ace Midnight
Over 4 full years (since he was already with the program) Archer recruited 6 players who were drafted by the NFL (1 2nd rd; 3 3rd rd; 1 6th rd; and 1 9th rd).
Over 4 years (but really only 3 since he didn't have time to recruit in yr 1), Hallman recruited 9 players who were drafted by the NFL (3 1st rd; 3 2nd rd; and 3 3rd rd)
It's not only about the w/l's. It's also about the condition of the program they inherited and the condition of the program they left. In this regard, Hallman was vastly superior to Archer.
Over 4 years (but really only 3 since he didn't have time to recruit in yr 1), Hallman recruited 9 players who were drafted by the NFL (3 1st rd; 3 2nd rd; and 3 3rd rd)
It's not only about the w/l's. It's also about the condition of the program they inherited and the condition of the program they left. In this regard, Hallman was vastly superior to Archer.
Posted on 12/20/08 at 8:55 pm to Indiana Tiger
I think that we are discussing two different things here.
With respect to their hirings, you look at what a coach has done up to the point at which they were hired. With this in mind, Curley Hallman looked like he was ready for the big time after the success he had at USM, especially with the wins over ALabama and Florida State.
With respect to their tenure as coaches, you look at won-loss record, and Archer is clearly better here. But you also have to consider the state of the program, that is to compare where they found it to where they left it, and in this regard, Archer falls way short of Hallman. Hallman could not coach and proved that on fall Saturdays, but he was better at identifying talent and bringing it in.
Worst hire - Archer.
Worst coach - Hallman.
Worst recruiter - Archer.
With respect to their hirings, you look at what a coach has done up to the point at which they were hired. With this in mind, Curley Hallman looked like he was ready for the big time after the success he had at USM, especially with the wins over ALabama and Florida State.
With respect to their tenure as coaches, you look at won-loss record, and Archer is clearly better here. But you also have to consider the state of the program, that is to compare where they found it to where they left it, and in this regard, Archer falls way short of Hallman. Hallman could not coach and proved that on fall Saturdays, but he was better at identifying talent and bringing it in.
Worst hire - Archer.
Worst coach - Hallman.
Worst recruiter - Archer.
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