LisbethSalander

Last year he had a PFF grade of 81.6, and allowed an average passer rating of 81 when targeted throughout the season. He was targeted a lot because people didn't want to throw at Lattimore, and offenses are going to make plays.

He was terrible Sunday, so was everyone else on defense. Lattimore got lit up light a Christmas tree, but people only want to talk spit about our CB2. Crawley isn't an elite second CB, but if he returns to the form he played most of last year in he's an above average CB2 in the NFL. Whether he, and the rest of the Saints for that matter, can do that is yet to be seen.

quote:

---

I would have loved it if it was for a 4th rounder.

---

The difference between a high 6th round pick (saints likely getting) nd a low 3rd round pick (Saints likely giving) is roughly a 4th rounder.

The price tag isn't cheap, but if we perform how we should perform then we it's likely equivalent to a 4th rounder for top level backup QB, who has the potential to be the heir apparent. Of course we would have to work out the extension, but we have a season to take a look and see how healthy Teddy looks.

Let's not forget, QB is a very big need for the Saints, probably top 3 position of need. The Taysom hype is fine, but he's probably not a guy you want to depend on this season to be the primary backup. If the Saints had used the pick we are giving the Jets on a QB, would anyone bat an eye at that? Hell no. We used our pick on a guy who has some experience, a lot of potential but a serious injury history.

We have done well with QB's coming off of career threatening injuries

quote:

---

Ricky Williams isnt even a has-been. He's a never-was. But he was a solid back when he put forth the effort.

---

This is so dumb. Ricky Williams was a top 10 RB of his era. He has 12,600 yards from scrimmage and 74 TDs in his 11 years in the NFL, despite missing 2 entire years during his physical prime. Reggie at his best was not as good as Ricky at his best.

Both of these guys arguably had their best seasons away from the Saints though. Reggie was certainly more valuable to the Saints organization, who knows if we get the Super Bowl win without him.

Ricky was one of the worst moves in Saints draft history, but that doesn't mean he wasn't a very good player. Unless you get a franchise HOF caliber QB, nobody could live up to the cost we spent on Ricky. That was an idiotic move by Dika, Ricky was just the guy he moved for.

Ricky played 3 seasons for the Saints, had 1000+ scrimmage yards in every one of those seasons. Reggie played 5 seasons for the Saints and had 1 1000 yard from scrimmage season, mainly due to injury.

Ricky was great for the Dolphins, and we did get 2 first round picks back when we traded him. One of those picks was Charles Grant. THe other was used to move up to take the worst guy we ever drafted, Jonathan Sullivan.

quote:

---

I know Evans and Nicks are supposed to be revered on o-line Rushmore, but Warford/Peat are just as good. Probably better at run blocking.

---

quote:

---

And Evans / Nicks were not HOF caliber. Get real people.

---

Both these guys were all-pro, and both were the 2 highest paid guards in the NFL at the time. Nicks isn't a HOF guy thanks to his infection shortened career, but he was once first team and once second team all-pro.

I think Evans has a very real shot at the HOF. He was a 4 time first team all pro, once made the second team, and made 6 pro bowls in 12 years as a starting guard. That's an incredibly impressive resume, I think he makes it to Canton for sure.

I like our guards a lot now, I'd say they are probably comparable to our tackles play in '09. They aren't in the same league as Nicks/Evans in their prime though.

The speed isn't the only factor in being a great deep threat. YOu have to be in the ballpark of the fast guys to be in the league, 4.49 certainly qualifies as you said.

Guy isn't crazy tall, but has crazy long arms and leaping ability. His deep ball catch rate in college proves he has the ability to convert those traits into success on the field.

His blocking ability is supposed to be above average, something the Saints clearly value. He also seems to have passed the mental tests we have been using.

Even if Ginn has another year like he had, we need his replacement. Nobody else on the roster outside of our other starter has the ability to stretch the field, and praying our 34 year old maintains his health and production is a big gamble, and I'd say it's likely Ginn is done after this season anyway.

I really like this pick, he seems to have the toolset to take Ginns place and be our #2. If Meredith can get back to form and Smith pans out, not having a dominant pass catching TE won't matter. No defense in the league could match up with with our receivers and Kamara/Ingram out of the backfield, with Hill/Hooman/Watson have proven to be serviceable TEs. Offense looks like a force to be reckoned with

If he becomes an elite DE and nobody else is in the league, the draft would not be a success, but not a huge failure. ELite DEs don't come around often.

I thin this draft was pretty different from the ones we have had the past 7 years, we didn't have many immediate holes to fill. We didn't lose many key contributors in the offseason like we did after 2013, we were coming off 2 good-incredible drafts, and we could obviously use some upgrades at positions, but we had a top 5 offense and a top 10-12 defense. We needed to get deeper, and I think getting some quality special teams guys was smart. WE weren't looking at this draft saying we have to get 4 guys who must become starters immediately.

Two O-Line guys was great, the FSU tackle seems like it may have been a reach, but Clapp seems like he could be a great swing interior fill in, and hopefully can develop behind Unger for a couple years and take his spot. 3rd RB was a under the radar need. Jamerson could be a standout special team player, which isn't a sexy, but if we get a versatile playmaker there for a 5th that's a win. Tre'Quan certainly addressed a need, seems like it was a good value from what I have read. CB depth is never enough.

It's pretty unlikely IMO that all these guys will make our 53 man roster this season, and that's not necessarily a bad thing. It means we already have good options at most positions. We took some projects, but when you don't have to grab immediate starters you can take some raw guys with more potential over polished guys who seem like they may have ceilings. That's how I see it anyway.

Said this yesterday:

Let me start by saying I don't know what Lamar will look like in 5 years, but neither do any of you.

The wonderlic test is a concern, but not the deciding factor. Marino scored 16, Jim Kelly Steve McNair and Terry Bradshaw were a 15, Donovan McNabb was a 14. All those guys were great QBs with a similar wonderlic. It's a factor, but not the only factor.

Running QBs may not be winning Super Bowls at the same rate as pocket passers, but it's ignorant to think they can't. Russel Wilson should have won 2, only won 1. Cam made it to the big show, so did Colin Kaepernick, both running Qbs. That's 3 of the past 8 Qbs who played in the Super Bowl over since 2013, and there has been a dual threat QB starting in four of the last 6 Super Bowl games. "But those QBs lost more often than not, and got outplayed by pocket passing QBs" Yes they did, and those QBs were usually named Peyton Manning or Tom Brady, top 3 QBs of all time.

Accuracy. Lamar Jackson never completed 60% of his passes in college. He completed 59% last year. That's 4 drops from 60%, he definitely had more than 4 dropped balls. Russel Wilson completed 58% of his passes his Junior year. Tom Brady completed 62% of his passes his Junior year, he also threw half as many TDs and the same number of INTs in 100 fewer attempts. Tom's last 2 seasons in Michigan he threw as many TDs as Jackson did his sophomore season alone. Guys can improve their passing numbers with time.

Worried about his height and size? Drew Brees is shorter and lighter. Russel WIlson is shorter and lighter. Mike Vick was shorter and the same weight. Tom Brady was 6-5 195, compared to Jackson at 6'2" 215. You have prototypical geight/weight, but there are always exceptions.

Are there risks taking Lamar? Sure are. Are there risks taking any other QB at the top of the draft? Sure are. Do we have a successor to Drew? Sure don't. We almost certainly need to replace him in the next 3 years, and until we have a guy we feel confident can do that, I can't hate drafting a QB first round each season. Chances are we will miss, because most drafted QBs don't work out to be long term starters. But you have to have one to win, and we have to look at life after Drew sooner rather than later IMO.

That being said, if we mortgage the farm to get any player I am skeptical. Drafting players is a gamble, including more picks jest reduces the number of rolls of the dice you get. If he's there at 27 and the front office likes him I have no problem taking a shot. If we move up 5-8 spots and don't sacrifice a ton, I won't love it but I'll understand the logic behind it.

quote:

---

. Someone was saying Ryan and/or Jones could be involved in the big move up from 28 to 3. Where there's smoke...

---

This is the ultimate troll. The only people saying this are Saints fans talking dirty while pleasuring themselves. Matt Ryan alone would be traded for every pick the Jets have this year and the Jets would win the trade by a mile.

If we had to move up, I wouldn't hate moving up 8-10 spots and grabbing Vita Vea if he slips a little. We haven't had a solid 1 Tech D Tackle in a very long time, he could gobble up doubles and make our ok LB corps look a lot better. It seems like there a lot more 3 tech D Tackles coming out, but a huge 1 tech guy who's athletic DT can be a big difference maker. Our run defense wasn't very good last season, this could be a big step in the right direction.

I don't think signing a 37yo to a 1 year deal has any impact on how we are going to draft. This is simply another option, I think we were going to bring in another TE at some point in FA regardless of how we looked at the current prospects at TE. I expect this deal is near the vet minimum, he played fine last season but the dude is old.

Who we keep and who we cut will not be determined until later. I think we didn't cut Fleener before the New league year because he wouldn't have passed a physical, which would have triggered an injury guarantee, and had even more detrimental salary cap implications.

If we draft a TE or not, we certainly will not keep all 4 TEs on our roster. Hill or Hooman I think will be one roster spot, TBD in camp. Then who knows, but I wouldn't be surprised if Fleener and Watson aren't on the roster week 1.