re: MLS Deadspin Article

If this guys bothered by obnoxious fans he might want to stay away from SEC football.

Love the top response.

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The Amazing Sneijderman: This is exactly why I can't stand college football. Refuse to watch it. The route running? Puhlease. Watching a far superior Jaguars/Browns game in December is where you'll find me.

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And really why bother watching the NFL? I only watch the Pro Bowl because I'm a real fan.

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Nice response by former FC Dallas player Bobby Warshaw

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It's a good response that makes a lot of fair points. However, I'm not sure how far I can agree with his assessment of MLS player quality in comparison to other top leagues:

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Stoke and West Ham don't play better soccer than MLS teams. If you'd rather watch a mid-level Premier League game than an MLS game, it goes beyond soccer aesthetics.

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I can agree on the aesthetic point if you compare the MLS to many mid or lower tier EPL sides. Both often play aesthetically challenged style of football. However, there's still a major difference in quality of the players that's effaced a bit and becomes clear in his next point:

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Watching the games, Genoa-Livorno doesn't ooze quality over Kansas City-Salt Lake.

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I'd say it does and by a long shot.

Yes, sides like Genoa and Livorno have some 30ish year old guys but even these are easily on par with the top MLS DP type signings (Burdisso, Gilardino, Matuzalém, Paulinho).


But these sides are also filled with mid-20s squad players who were often starting CL football matches on sides going into the knockout rounds the past couple of years like Luca Antonini, Paolo De Ceglie, Leandro Greco, Mesbah.

Guys like LB Luca Antonelli would probably be playing a lot for a side like Roma right now and Juraj Kucka who's a standout for the Slovakian NT are among a few other mid20ish players that will likely jump to a larger side next year.


Then you have the main reason people watch Genoa-Livorno: all the younger prodigies that will likely soon be starters on top level European clubs who pass through clubs like Genoa and Livorno such as:
Diego Milito
El-Sharawaay
Mattia Destro
Thiago Motta
Dominico Criscito
Rodrigo Palacio
Hernan Crespo
Marco Borriello
Alessandro Diamanti
Antonio Candreva
Giorgio Chiellini
just to name a few recent ones off the top of my head.


Right now these 2 rosters host a lot of young guys bristling with quality out of which you can guarantee will soon come a few stars:

Genoa:
Mattia Perin (one of best couple of young GK prospects in the world)
Andrea Bertolacci
Adrian Stoian
Sime Vrsaljko
Ioannis Fetfatzidis

Livorno:
Francesco Bardi (Italy U-21 Gk who'll certainly be at one of the bigs soon)
Ishak Belfodil
Marco Benassi
Ibrahima Mbaye
Innocent Emeghara
Federico Ceccherini


Again, no knock on the MLS at all but no one should be fooling themselves that the MLS squads have the sort of the quality that Italian (and Spanish/English) lower tier sides have at every position and trying to get minutes off their benches.

And didn't you admit you have never or rarely ever watched MLS?

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You're missing the point.

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I agree with the point he makes about "fans" of certain leagues and didn't argue it in the least.

What I argued was specifically:

"Watching the games, Genoa-Livorno doesn't ooze quality over Kansas City-Salt Lake"

This seems to me that he's saying the MLS match has nearly as much quality on the pitch as the Serie A one. No?

It quite clearly does not.

I hope he's not arguing that the quality of tactics are similar because I would argue even more strongly against that.

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And didn't you admit you have never or rarely ever watched MLS?

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I don't watch it a lot but I wouldn't say never. I usually go to a few Red Bulls matches a year even though I'm not really a fan of the club.

However, I don't need to watch it much more than I do to know that there's not a lot of 18-21 year old prospects like these on the pitch:


Diego Milito
El-Sharawaay
Mattia Destro
Thiago Motta
Dominico Criscito
Rodrigo Palacio
Hernan Crespo
Marco Borriello
Alessandro Diamanti
Antonio Candreva
Giorgio Chiellini

These are all players that have come through Genoa/Livorno recently and there will be some off their current rosters whose names will be in a list like this soon.

Add to that the point I made about the quality of the rest of their rosters and that's "oozing" quality compared to the MLS sides.

I wasn't trying to argue his overall points but simply that one.

And for me, the presence of those young elite talents establishing themselves is one of the main reasons I like to watch clubs that aren't among the absolute elite.

If you read my post carefully, you will see I that I fully agree with his comment regarding the "aesthetics" of Stoke v. West Ham and mainly with the larger argument that some people just align themselves with a league (and especially younger Americans with the EPL).


Again, I do disagree with his added assertion specifically about the quality of players themselves.


He hints at this (in addition to his point about "aesthetics") with West Ham/Stoke and then more fully states it a couple of sentences later in the Genoa/Livorno comment:

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Watching the games, Genoa-Livorno doesn't ooze quality over Kansas City-Salt Lake.

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Conversely, I would say that Genoa (quite specifically) and Livorno do have rosters "oozing" with quality compared to MLS rosters.


That's the point he makes with which I specifically disagree and not his argument about aesthetics.

Again, as soon as there are names of young prospects like these dotting the Salt Lake City and Sporting KC rosters, I'll agree that the "quality" is similar:

Diego Milito
El-Sharawaay
Mattia Destro
Thiago Motta
Dominico Criscito
Rodrigo Palacio
Hernan Crespo
Marco Borriello
Alessandro Diamanti
Antonio Candreva
Giorgio Chiellini

I just don't see how anyone can say that RSL and SKC have rosters with that kind of quality passing though. And this is not to even mention the rest of the rosters with players on loan from Inter, Juventus etc and so many players that will eventually play for CL quality sides even if they're not superstars. . .


If they do have this level quality, I sure hope Roma starts scouting the rosters of Real Salt Lake and Kansas City to grab a few more young Militos and Chiellinis.

Juve been trynta buy an SKC teen. This article is the same tried and true counterproductive eurosnob garbage people have been dissemenating for years. It's true that the quality of play isn't as high as other programming, but talking shite about it isn't going to improve things. Im only a fan of MLS because I'm an American. We won't win a world cup until we have a quality domestic league. That's why i support it, and I've seen significant improvement since the last world cup.

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He's talking about overall quality of play in regards to how pleasing it is to the eye.

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Silky smooth touches all over the pitch above all but add pretty one touch and back heel passes, beautiful tackles, ball control through tight spaces . . .

to discount what these products of individual quality add to the "eye" is exactly where he loses me.

That's why it's important to consider the individual players.

It's their little explosions of brilliance out of the team framework that make the game beautiful.


You can add the interesting, evolving tactics that usually have their genesis at these type Serie A clubs as well.

Maybe I misunderstand the basketball example but Genoa or Livorno are closer to the well coached mid-major tactics wise in comparison to MLS. It's actually the MLS that I would say is a much more simplistic get at 'em and let'em play (though this can often create really open entertaining matches as well -- especially when you don't have the individual quality to break down sound, solid defenses).




Perhaps he just states his point in an odd way but it's individual quality and tactical nuances mentioned above that "oozing quality" brings to my mind . . .

I'm an MLS fan but I try not to go overboard in stating how good the league is in comparison to others. I understand it might not be close to the top Euro leagues but I don't think it's unwatchable and I think the article is pretty ridiculous. Parity (for the most part) and giving me soccer to watch in the summer is something I enjoy.

Can't wait for the Sounders opener tomorrow.