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re: Why Can't People Hear What Jordan Peterson Is Saying? (Atlantic Article + Memes)
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:29 am to Stagg8
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:29 am to Stagg8
quote:
The board defends those with a common viewpoint... but doesn’t necessarily respect those who have come to a well-thought-out, opposing view.
maybe the LCDs
1
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:30 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i've been defending/promoting Peterson and Gad Saad for years, bruv
Not singling you out in the slightest.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:31 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
First, a person says something. Then, another person restates what they purportedly said so as to make it seem as if their view is as offensive, hostile, or absurd.
Welcome to Trump's world
And the exact reason Trump will always have to use twitter. And have to demoralize his opponents on twitter
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:35 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
i always take this as a challenge to break things down into bite sized pieces that these people have to address
C'mon man that is not going to happen in the age of the 1 second attention span. Most people, a big majority, are not going to take the time and do the diligence, thats hard, thats work.
"Gotchas" work because its a quick affirmation of what you already are invested in, its easy.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:35 am to SlowFlowPro
My strategy is using the phrase “ let’s take personalities out of this “ and then discussing the issue calmly . I also like “ yes and no’s “ so I can ascertain if I am talking to an honest person. If a person can’t answer honestly without huge psychological pain and the cognitive dissonance is all over their face I know I’m dealing with somebody who is not used to pursuing Truth.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:38 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
LCDs
There ya go
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:43 am to Lakeboy7
quote:
There ya go
You deal almost exclusively in "gotchas" around here, so you really shouldn't be casting stones
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:48 am to Blaeke
Thanks for posting that. I'd been thinking it would be nice to hear WLC and Peterson converse. I'll check it out
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:50 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:Indeed.
This is a really good article on the common strawman tactics of our modern rhetoric
The tactic is increasingly common in our political discussions. Effectiveness is in ability to play away from thoughtfulness and toward emotion.
The question then turns to motivation. What would motivate one to proceed as the OP woman does? Obviously motivation is result driven, and presumably results desired are to win audience approval for positions argued.
As we are seeing the tactic more frequently employed, unfortunately the corollary holds modern audiences must be increasingly receptive to nonsense. It's a receptiveness pointing to decline in modern education.
From the debater's standpoint though, creation of an effective strawman is not often a witless undertaking. In this case for example, is the journalist's rhetoric driven by oafishness, lasciviousness, or intentional argument despite defacto concession on the merits?
The cynic in me says it is the latter, which points to intentional deceit as her means to an end . . . a shift from Aristotle to Alinsky.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:50 am to Lsupimp
quote:
The frustration of being like Peterson or you SFP is that as your argument becomes more refined and more virtuous ( because Truth is Virtue) you are met by the very worst among us with insults , slurs and ignorance. It’s the irony of living a life of ideas and principles, no matter how you read, educate and master a topic you are always met with shrill ignorance that defies description. And it never ends . Because so many people not only can’t think rationally, they place no value on it.
George Orwell — 'The further a society drifts from the truth, the more it will hate those that speak it.'
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:51 am to McLemore
quote:
The reporter will make a statement either of supposed fact or a characterization/summary of a quote. Then the actual clip of the quote plays, and it is completely different. Doesn't even come close to supporting the reporter's statement.
I remember when I first got woke about 15 years ago. Listening to Rush, and he would talk about reporters mis-characterize what actually went on in a press conference.
Then CNBC started showing the whole press conferences and I remember sitting there thinking about the reporters “story”, that’s not at all what they said!
Pro tip: It’s been #FakeNews for a really long time.
This post was edited on 1/27/18 at 11:56 am
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:57 am to RedStickBR
In Buddhism, of which I am a humble beginning practitioner , we frequently discuss suffering. Many do not realize that ignorance is suffering. To remain in a state of ignorance is to suffer .
Posted on 1/27/18 at 11:58 am to Meauxjeaux
quote:
I remember when I first got woke about 15 years ago. Listening to Rush, and he would talk about reporters mis-characterize what actually went on in a press conference.
what's worse today is how at PCs the media will give a fricking paragraph of suppositions to frame things and then ask a leading question that only can have an absurd response or avoidance. when they start off with the "given that..." bullshite, you know you're in for a ride
Jim Acosta is the literal king of this bullshite today
This post was edited on 1/27/18 at 11:59 am
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:02 pm to SlowFlowPro
That's why Stephen millers destruction of Jake tapper was so brilliant.
He just would not give an inch of room or accept a singe asinine premise in answering a question.
No matter how stern jakes grimaces became.
He just would not give an inch of room or accept a singe asinine premise in answering a question.
No matter how stern jakes grimaces became.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:04 pm to Turbeauxdog
and the spin following is that Miller tried to "change reality" or "attack CNN" by alleging it's reporting is bad/slanted
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:04 pm to SlowFlowPro
Fear,anger, dishonesty, anxiety, ignorance, moral confusion, unethical living,interference in the lives of others, disharmony, - this is our societal currency . Our media culture spreads this to the tune of billions of dollars a year. Truth is not the goal.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:07 pm to Lsupimp
Agreed. It's like having a 7-layer dip and only eating the olives off the top. That's why we need to find a way to continue to elevate people like Peterson, Shapiro, Harris, Hitchens (RIP), Lane Craig, to some degree Dennett, etc. to the forefront of American dialogue. You'll notice that list includes people with all kinds of different views. The marketplace for ideas should be open, large, diverse and of very good quality.
This post was edited on 1/27/18 at 12:08 pm
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:11 pm to Lsupimp
I raised some of these issues about argumentation in the big thread, and mentioned using the Toulmin method to interrogate arguments. Had no interest or even comments about it. Message boards just aren't going to be a suitable medium for seriou argumentation.
Most disheartening for me, however, is that you can't even make clever jokes in many instances. People don't even pay attention well enough to pick up on them. I see people try, and then watch as no one picks up on it.
Most disheartening for me, however, is that you can't even make clever jokes in many instances. People don't even pay attention well enough to pick up on them. I see people try, and then watch as no one picks up on it.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:13 pm to starsandstripes
They can be a forum for serious, continuous dialogue, but the only way to do it is to have large, master threads stickied.
Posted on 1/27/18 at 12:13 pm to Lsupimp
quote:
Fear,anger, dishonesty, anxiety, ignorance, moral confusion, unethical living,interference in the lives of others, disharmony, - this is our societal currency . Our media culture spreads this to the tune of billions of dollars a year. Truth is not the goal.
this is a big reason why the censorship of Youtube and Twitter is such a big deal
not only is it a celebration of censorship AND a biased exercise, but it's also a way to re-cement "major media" as the gatekeeper
and to avoid a typical leftist gotcha attempt, my comment is one of philosophy and not economics
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