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re: Paging Aubie101 re: "Once saved always saved"
Posted on 11/14/23 at 8:49 am to RealityWinsOut
Posted on 11/14/23 at 8:49 am to RealityWinsOut
Faith without action is dead.
Start obeying God's commandments in addition to prayer, and time spent with the Word, and it will change your life.
Doing what you say you believe in will deepen your faith and make you more obedient.
Keeping the sabbath legit is the biggest one most Christians miss.
The holy spirit will empower you.
Start obeying God's commandments in addition to prayer, and time spent with the Word, and it will change your life.
Doing what you say you believe in will deepen your faith and make you more obedient.
Keeping the sabbath legit is the biggest one most Christians miss.
The holy spirit will empower you.
0
Posted on 11/14/23 at 9:13 am to tgerb8
Once saved always saved is the same lie told in the Garden...
Posted on 11/14/23 at 9:41 am to PetroAg
quote:
And in the infallibility of the church that compiled it, right?
It’s important to understand that the church took what Marcion compiled - most of the authentic original letters of Paul, plus an earlier and more original gospel (the one that Luke is based on) - and added to it. The church then labeled Marcion a heretic. So the church’s Bible is based on the work of a heretic. The Protestant Bible is then based on the Bible of the church, which the Protestants now consider heretics. There’s a bit of a pattern there.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 9:59 am to tgerb8
Topics on Religion should be fine over on the Off Topic Lounge, since Religion is not Politics.
This thread does not belong here on PT.
This thread does not belong here on PT.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:07 am to Kafka
quote:
This isn't the Religion Board
In fact, we don't have a religion board
nvm, forget I said anything
tRant is the Religion board...at least for Georgia and Bama fans (and Tennessee alters).
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:10 am to rebeloke
quote:
That’s why Jesus said in Matthew 7:23 depart from me, I never knew you.
Something occured to me a few years ago in the midst of a discussion on osas.
If when we are saved Jesus knows us and we can lose our salvation, how can He say the above?
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:12 am to LRB1967
quote:
If Hitler had been truly saved at age 20, he would not have done what he did.
So, Circular Logic is what governs your thought processes in this area. Got it.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:14 am to Jim Rockford
quote:
OSAS depends on the No True Scotsman fallacy. If someone professes Christ and falls away, qed they were never truly saved in the first place.
That is Circular Logic.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:18 am to Redbone
quote:
Boom. This is it. Drop the mic.
It's a No True Scotsman fallacy, as was pointed out in the first reply.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:25 am to tgerb8
It has never made sense to me the Protestant argument of sola scriptura. The entire Bible is a guide to how we should live our lives. Then they say all we need is faith alone. My question is, why would Jesus preach for 3 years about how we can live our life to be closer with God if all we needed was to believe he rose from to the dead to be saved? It logically doesn't make any sense at all.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:28 am to Champagne
It doesn't matter if Hitler was saved before he did what he did. It's not some gotcha question that non-believers think it is. Being saved is very simple and your actions will tell those around you if you are a saved Christian. It's very obvious Hitler was not a Christian.
Salvation does not hinge on one action, if you are questioning yours just remember, that thief on the cross was not a saved man before he went up there, but he believed Jesus was who he said he was and he is now spending all eternity in Heaven.
We are all sinners and fall short daily. I've been struggling with this for years and I went through a rough patch. But I see the results of faith and prayer and I am trying really hard to be a better person. If you are truly saved and a faithful believer, you will work on yourself to be a Christian. It's hard work and Satan loves to point out your flaws and put doubt in your mind.
Salvation does not hinge on one action, if you are questioning yours just remember, that thief on the cross was not a saved man before he went up there, but he believed Jesus was who he said he was and he is now spending all eternity in Heaven.
We are all sinners and fall short daily. I've been struggling with this for years and I went through a rough patch. But I see the results of faith and prayer and I am trying really hard to be a better person. If you are truly saved and a faithful believer, you will work on yourself to be a Christian. It's hard work and Satan loves to point out your flaws and put doubt in your mind.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:36 am to offshoretrash
quote:Satan isn't a mind reader. He can put things around you that put doubt in your mind or tempt you. But rest assured, he isn't in your head.
It's hard work and Satan loves to point out your flaws and put doubt in your mind.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:47 am to StrongOffer
quote:
Satan isn't a mind reader. He can put things around you that put doubt in your mind or tempt you. But rest assured, he isn't in your head.
Maybe so but he can put obstacles in your life to cast doubt on your faith and your salvation. Take the guy that struggles with addiction. Do you think God is putting those opportunities in front of him? Do you think it was God that made Hitler do what he did? Do you think it's God that made all those Priest molest kids? No, it's Satan, he is using sin to get you to believe that if all this bad can happen and if supposed holy men can do bad things then there is no God.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:49 am to offshoretrash
quote:That's what I said in my first response. Whole-heartedly agree with you.
Maybe so but he can put obstacles in your life to cast doubt on your faith and your salvation. Take the guy that struggles with addiction. Do you think God is putting those opportunities in front of him? Do you think it was God that made Hitler do what he did? Do you think it's God that made all those Priest molest kids? No, it's Satan, he is using sin to get you to believe that if all this bad can happen and if supposed holy men can do bad things then there is no God.
Edit: I may have misinterpreted your original post about him putting things in your head.
This post was edited on 11/14/23 at 10:51 am
Posted on 11/14/23 at 10:55 am to imjustafatkid
quote:
Someone's actions can tell you a lot about their heart.
Everybody's familiar with the Saturday night sinner, Sunday morning saint trope. But there are others who by all appearances walk the walk. Then a spouse betrays them, a child dies, some big tragedy occurs and they lose their faith. I don't know how to categorize someone like that.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 11:00 am to offshoretrash
Once Saved Always Saved is a man-made doctrine that does not seem to align with your personal beliefs, based on what you posted.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 11:02 am to StrongOffer
quote:
It has never made sense to me the Protestant argument of sola scriptura. The entire Bible is a guide to how we should live our lives. Then they say all we need is faith alone. My question is, why would Jesus preach for 3 years about how we can live our life to be closer with God if all we needed was to believe he rose from to the dead to be saved? It logically doesn't make any sense at all.
Quite so.
But, read my sig quote. Martin Luther says that we are not supposed to utilize our powers of logic and reason on these matters. He says, in fact, to think and reason are the enemies of Faith.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 11:06 am to Champagne
I'm not interested in hashing out orange vs green, but what do you guys do with Acts 17:11? I've heard both sides of the usual verses but I've never heard the Catholic take on that one.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 11:11 am to tgerb8
quote:
For those of you who undoubtedly browsed here out of curiosity or boredom, this a reply to Aubie101 regarding a discussion in the memes thread... Just trying to not derail that thread further. i think Im following the convo here but correct me if I'm wrong.
quote:So if Hitler gave his life to Christ when he was 20 he is saved? I know your next answer before you write it.
Reading back I'm guessing this is an attempt at a gotcha for "once saved always saved," but my answer is... if Hitler was saved when he was 20 and had a true relationship with Christ he wouldn't have any desire to genocide a race of people.
That being said... When James said "I do the things I don't want to do" he's stating a lot more than what's on the surface. it's implying conviction and remorse. Things Hitler showed no sign of.
There's no way any person who has received the gift of Salvation, who believes Christ died for their sins and received the Holy Spirit is going to believe it's moral and proper to facilitate the murder of millions of Jews.
Posted on 11/14/23 at 11:17 am to Squirrelmeister
quote:
You sure? Deuteronomy 20 quote:16But in the cities of these peoples that the LORD your God is giving you for an inheritance, you shall save alive nothing that breathes, 17but you shall devote them to complete destruction, the Hittites and the Amorites, the Canaanites and the Perizzites, the Hivites and the Jebusites, as the LORD your God has commanded
You need context here. If I recall correctly God commanded the absolute complete and total destruction of these people because they were so wicked and so depraved that they were beyond any sort of redemption. In other words they were so given over to evil that the most merciful thing for them was death… this is not the moral equivalent of Hitler wanting to eradicate Jews from the face of the earth for being Jews.
As to the original op, two things. I think to willingly engage in the atrocities of WW2 to the extent Hitler was actively responsible requires opening one’s self up to incredible evil. Call it possession, whatever you want, but it’s well documented the role the occult played within the Nazi power structure. With this in mind, if Hitler had truly received salvation in his twenties, I believe it is highly unlikely Hitler would have been opened up to the pure evil and darkness he was exposed to. The reason being that if you believe in existence of Jesus as well as Satan, you’d understand that Satan knows full well who has received salvation. An attempt to use that person for truly evil purposes would be met with a fight.
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