re: Officer in Eric Garner case: I never used a choke hold

quote:

---

caused various hemorrhages

---

In his brain? I haven't seen that anywhere. Link?

quote:

---

The damage was caused by compression of the veins in the neck causing his head to "fill" with blood and caused various hemorrhages and other damage.

---

So when you choke someone for 13 seconds they hemorrhage from their brain and die? Wow I would've thought the body could handle a little more trauma than that but I guess not. Seems like murderers should just do this instead of stabbing people, a lot easier and not as messy.

quote:

---

So when you choke someone for 13 seconds they hemorrhage from their brain and die?

---

Exactly.
A "choke out" hold is performed through application of bilateral carotid compression. I has the same effect as excessive negative G forces on a fighter pilot . . . immediate loss of consciousness.

It is result of acutely reduced cerebral blood flow, not the reverse, and not of venous stasis.

quote:

---

In his brain? I haven't seen that anywhere. Link?
Found it. LINK The experts were Forensic Scientist Lawrence Kobilinsky and Emergency Room Physician Dr. Sampson Davis.

---

They cited petechiae, not cerebral hemorrhage, and were almost certainly referencing Garner's eyes, not his brain. Straining akin to Valsalva during chest compression could produce the same finding btw. Neither cause would be lethal, or even likely render the victim unconscious.

quote:

---

They even stated that the chest compressions could stop breathing and kill someone when when perfectly healthy.

---

Right. We should just ask people more nicely when they resist arrest. "Pretty please!!"

quote:

---

The two medical professionals in the interview disagree with you

---

Good lord mmcgrath, you're going to do this yet again?
Of course they don't disagree. They are citing a possible explanation. I can tell you flat out, if Cooper had asked whether a sudden increase in intrathoracic and/or abdominal pressure could have caused petechiae, they would have both answered "yes". It's basic stuff.

quote:

---

They even stated that the chest compressions could stop breathing and kill someone

---

As have I.

My response was to what I perceived as an active attempt to remove personal bias and think critically about a presented incident AFTER independently verifying facts.

Are you referring to your response here?

quote:

---

Maybe so. But the troubling similarities between Luis Rodriguez and Garner should AT THE LEAST force PDs to incorporate safety training. Both men died horrible deaths. Both were unnecessary. Both men continued to be subdued after loss of consciousness. Both situations should entail PD liability, if not criminal, then civil. No one should be killed for simply not producing ID or buying single cigarettes.

---

I agree that any incident that leads to death our serious injury should be investigated.

I agree that both deaths were unnecessary.

quote:

---

Both men continued to be subdued after loss of consciousness

---

Not sure on this. If you fight the lawful detention arrest you are getting cuffed. To long to get into using my phone.

quote:

---

Both situations should entail PD liability, if not criminal, then civil.

---

In these situations no criminal liability. Civil? Depends on a lot of variables that I doubt anyone on here can verify at the moment. That is for the judicial process.

quote:

---

No one should be killed for simply not producing ID or buying single cigarettes.

---

Both persons you mentioned determined the level of force used against them. Dealing with an a-hole cop? Comply. In a couple of years find an attorney with my background and own him and more importantly his agency. That is how you fight police misconduct.

quote:

---

the methods the NYPD used during the arrest

---

Were brought on by Garner's actions.