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re: New movie "Woman King" is the ultimate historical fanfiction
Posted on 9/13/22 at 2:30 pm to SquatchDawg
Posted on 9/13/22 at 2:30 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:None of these three groups is considered sub-Saharan. Sub-Saharan includes groups like the Bantu and Nilotic peoples that I referenced above. Most people in Ethiopia, Somalia and northern Sudan are either Semitic or Cushitic. As you certainly know, the majority of the people of the modern Middle East are also Semitic.
The near-consensus is that they most-closely resembled some modern Ethiopians, Somalis or northern Sudanese.quote:
I don’t think that’s accurate. Recent DNA tests have show ancient Egyptians had very little subsaharan DNA and we’re mostly aligned with middle eastern ancestors.
In any case, the genetic studies that you reference were performed almost exclusively upon people living in a settlement in extreme lower Egypt, near the mouth of the Nile… almost ten dynasties, several conquests, and about 1000 years after completion of the pyramids. Their remains really do not tell us a great deal about the genetics of the earliest Egyptian builders, who lived much farther to the south along the Nile.
2
Posted on 9/13/22 at 3:16 pm to AggieHank86
quote:Near consensus?
The first pyramids were built much further south on the Nile by completely different people some 12 dynasties earlier. They certainly were not “black as coal” like modern Bantu or Nilotic peoples. The near-consensus is that they most-closely resembled some modern Ethiopians, Somalis or northern Sudanese.
Some modern Ethiopians? The light skinned ones that look….Caucasian?
Posted on 9/13/22 at 3:26 pm to llfshoals
Lol
He's a trip
He's a trip
Posted on 9/13/22 at 3:49 pm to llfshoals
quote:No. To my knowledge there are no modern Ethiopians who “look … Caucasian” other than perhaps a few NGO volunteers.
Some modern Ethiopians? The light skinned ones that look….Caucasian?
On the other hand, more than half the population of the country is either Cushitic or Semitic … both groups who do NOT look sub-Saharan (essentially Bantu, Nilotic and related peoples), excepting a superficial similarity with the Khoiasan of South Africa, Namibia and southern Angola.
Nilotic woman
Bantu woman
Cushitic Ethiopian woman
Semitic Ethiopian woman
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 3:58 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 3:52 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
the genetic studies that you reference were performed almost exclusively upon people living in a settlement in extreme lower Egypt, near the mouth of the Nile
The mouth is in Northern Egypt.
The sources are in the south (Ethiopia being the main one in term of flow rate).
Posted on 9/13/22 at 4:03 pm to jimmy the leg
quote:Yes.
The mouth is in Northern Egypt. The sources are in the South.
I find it interesting to be arguing about ancient Egypt with someone who seemingly does not even know the difference between Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt
Northern Egypt is called “Lower Egypt.” Southern Egypt is called “Upper Egypt.” The source of the Nile is their “top,” and its terminus is their “bottom.” Has been that way for 5000 years.
This usage predates our usage of North as the “top” of a map by about 4600 of those years. In fact, most world maps put East at the top until the advent of the European Age of Exploration.
The 75 mummies in the study were from a settlement near Cairo. Certainly you know that Cairo is near the mouth of the Nile, in the North (Lower Egypt).
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 5:07 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 4:32 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Historical fiction is full of that sort of license for the sake of an entertaining story.
I totally agree, and that's why I thought the miniseries Roots could have been infinitely more entertaining had the black slaves had shown their White Masters more gratitude by kissing their asses for introducing them to truly civilized way of life instead of trying to run away all the time.
Posted on 9/13/22 at 4:44 pm to AggieHank86
quote:Every other culture in history did not practice cannibalism and beheading
In other words, it behaved much like every other empire in world history.
dullard a-hole
Posted on 9/13/22 at 4:53 pm to JJJimmyJimJames
quote:
JJJimmyJimJames
“dullard a-hole”
Posted on 9/13/22 at 4:55 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
Yes. Northern Egypt is called “Lower Egypt.” Southern Egypt is called “Upper Egypt.” The source of the Nile is their “top,” and its terminus is their “bottom.”
Water does flow downhill.
Carry on!
Posted on 9/13/22 at 5:11 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
None of these three groups is considered sub-Saharan. Sub-Saharan includes groups like the Bantu and Nilotic peoples that I referenced above
Agreed. My bad.
quote:
Most people in Ethiopia, Somalia and northern Sudan are either Semitic or Cushitic. As you certainly know, the majority of the people of the modern Middle East are also Semitic.
Which would support that these regions were probably populated in ancient times by Semitic people moving into NE Africa from the ME. Which even though it is a small sample, the DNA research supports. Also, what little art and sculpture we have from the period looks (to me anyway) like people from a ME lineage.
Either way your 100% correct that caucasions did not build the pyramids. It’s probably more defensible to claim the pyramids were built by “Africans” because even if they were Semitic people that immigrated in to Africa 6,000 years ago….they would technically still be Africans by definition.
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 5:22 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:24 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:My thought is that Lower Egypt was probably populated largely by Semitic people and that Upper Egypt by Cushitic people. The Semites would have moved “back to Africa” from the area of the Levant, and the Cushites from the Arabian peninsula, with both gradually having replaced (driven out?) the Nilotic peoples who preceded them.quote:Which would support that these regions were probably populated in ancient times by Semitic people moving into NE Africa from the ME.
majority of the people of the modern Middle East are also Semitic.
Recall that the Bantu Expansion did not leave Caneroon in West Africa and start its eastward movement south of the Sahel until approximately 1500-1000 BCE. The proto-Swahili did not reach East Africa Until early in the Common Era.
So there WERE no Bantu peoples anywhere near ancient Egypt. The only “sub-Sahara” peoples nearby were Nilotic, not Bantu.
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:31 pm to AggieHank86
On a side note and to your point, SHE looks like somebody worth building a pyramid for and has the features were used to seeing in ancient Egyptian depictions.
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 6:34 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:32 pm to AggieHank86
quote:
In other words, it behaved much like every other empire in world history.
So not the Wakandian utopia portrayed in the movie?
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 6:33 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:36 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:True, but that is not what Sharpton and his type claim. They assert that the ancestors of Black Americans are responsible for the achievements of the Egyptians and the various kingdoms of the Horn of Africa (East Coast). ALL of those countries were populated primarily by Cushitic and Semitic peoples.
100% correct that caucasions did not build the pyramids. It’s probably more defensible to claim the pyramids were built by “Africans”
But American Blacks are descended almost 100% from Bantu and related ethnic groups from (primarily) the parts of WEST Africa in or near the Bight of Benin. MAYBE the occasional Hausa from the southern Sahel. The Bantu did not go anywhere NEAR ancient Egypt until (at least) several thousand years after the advent of Egyptian civilization.
They share zero common genetics with Egypt or the Horn nations.
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 6:41 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:37 pm to SquatchDawg
quote:
technically still be Africans by definition
More precisely, Afro-Asiatic.
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:38 pm to blueboy
quote:
We're into Soviet style fictional alternate history now.
Bingo.
This insanity has infiltrated all institutions. Simpletons will believe anything.
Weak white people love to placate minorities because they are racist as frick, and are throwing crumbs to the poor little frickers.
We know truths, let them have their little fairy tales. Its all weak, insecure people have.
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:39 pm to jimmy the leg
quote:All bullshite aside, do you actually think that ANYONE believes Wakanda to be a real place?
not the Wakandian utopia portrayed in the movie?
This post was edited on 9/13/22 at 7:17 pm
Posted on 9/13/22 at 6:47 pm to tarzana
quote:Correct. People whose ancestors migrated OUT of Africa about 100,000 years ago and then back INTO Africa maybe 10-20,000 years ago.
More precisely, Afro-Asiatic.
Posted on 9/13/22 at 7:09 pm to SquatchDawg
I admit that I have never found most Bantu or Nilotic women especially attractive, but Ethiopian and Somali women can be SERIOUSLY hot. The waitresses at my favorite Ethiopian restaurant are ALL simply gorgeous. Not a doggie in the bunch.
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