re: Israel / Hamas in a biblical context - any content recs?

quote:

---

born catholic here,catholic schooling

---

These are the credentials I was looking for! I eagerly await your critique of the Suma.

quote:

---

soul,satanism and human sacrifice,homosexuallity, happens in the Vatican.a good percentage of our priests are gay and pedo,

---

Peter denied Christ 3x and Judas sold Jesus for silver. Men sin and men hold offices within the Church.

quote:

---

Peter denied Christ 3x and Judas sold Jesus for silver. Men sin and men hold offices within the Church.

---

You equating Peter with those things? lol.

And Jesus can’t get going if Judas doesn’t betray him. Consider Judas might have been the only one tough enough to accomplish the second most important act of sacrifice in history.

Two notions that I am unable to square up through the lens of current events:

1) The land boundaries promised Abraham have yet to be occupied and settled by the Hebrews. They presently occupy but a sliver.

2) Should the 1) above come to pass, then I could envision global opposition from those against.

3) I believe a healthy % of Christianity - Protestants in particular - are consumed by End Times as they wish to avoid the carnage. I get that but for an Anti-Christ to appear, he is to bring peace and one doesn't bring peace to peace. Also, for all nations to concede their sovereignty to one, it has to be pretty screaming nasty. In other words, it would appear the 'body of Christ' will be present leading up to his coming out.

quote:

---

Nero was the beast. The whore of Babylon was pagan Rome. The book primarily foretold the destruction of the Jewish temple in the 70s AD. The Rapture doctrine is the result of 19th century dispensationalism, and is almost entirely specific to American evangelicalism. Foo summed it up nicely.

---

Okay, SirWinston reporting back from the rabbit hole. Yes. This makes so much sense. It ticks more boxes than any imaginable scenario from today's world (No way any global political figure unites more than 33% of the globe, let alone the ENTIRE globe before revealing himself as a modern day antichrist. Also no way there is ever meaningful peace between Israel and their Muslim neighbours. Finally Ive always had a problem with how modern day Evangelicals just completely discount the SEVENTY PERCENT of the world's population that isn't raised in a historically Judeo-Christian nation. Over 5 billion people are just rendered completely irrelevant). Back in Paul's time there were only 200 million people on the planet, so the prophecies would have had a much greater chance of checking all the boxes (near universal approval of the eventual antichrist before he revealed himself).

So now, if one believes the antichrist has already happened. Where would that put us in Revelation speak today? Is Armageddon and Christ's final return still on the table? What about like the rebuilding of the temple in Israel and all? I'd especially like to hear from the non dispensationalists

quote:

---

So now, if one believes the antichrist has already happened.

---

The Bible speaks of many anti-christs. Anyone who doesn't proclaim Jesus as the Messiah is an anti-christ. However, THE anti-christ was Nero.

quote:

---

Where would that put us in Revelation speak today? Is Armageddon and Christ's final return still on the table?

---

Absolutely. Dispensationalists/Evangelicals tend to lump the tribulation and return of Christ in with the events laid out in Revelation. This is just a bad hermeneutic to be honest.

There will come a tribulation. Those who are saved and alive at the time will live through it (no rapture taking place beforehand), and then Christ will return to establish the new heaven and earth, and render final judgment.

In the dispensationalist/evangelical view, there is actually a second and third coming of the Lord.

quote:

---

What about like the rebuilding of the temple in Israel and all? 

---

The Catholic church hasn't taken a definitive stance on a physical third temple being built. Some catholic theologians believe it will be rebuilt, and others believe Jesus in his resurrection and the establishment of his church was the fulfillment of the temple being rebuilt.

I fall into the latter category, in that the new covenant church is the temple.

quote:

---

THE Anti-christ was Nero.

---

So you are a Preterist? Do you believe in the Rapture (Partial Preterest)?

Every pastor winds up being his own little "pope". Disagree with something your current church believes? Go down the road and start your own from scratch, with no accountability, no structure, nobody to check and balance your theology.

Protestants are a nutty bunch.

Totally fishing for a compliment here, but what did you think of my research and rationale? I had a gas last night looking into this and watching videos. The internet is fantastic sometimes.

quote:

---

Totally fishing for a compliment here, but what did you think of my research and rationale?

---

I thought you did well. That's a pretty short summary of the mainstream catholic view.

Jimmy Akin video

quote:

---

Every pastor winds up being his own little "pope". Disagree with something your current church believes? Go down the road and start your own from scratch, with no accountability, no structure, nobody to check and balance your theology.

Protestants are a nutty bunch.

---

That's a problem with Congregationalism, not Protestantism. I’m a Protestant and a Presbyterian.