re: I'm sick of people saying the middle class is worse off than 4 decades ago.

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pean median income is a fraction of US median income. Hell, Italy's median income would be subpoverty level in the US

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Yeah. I really have no idea what these people think

Materialism is not the only measure of class stability and contentment.

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You could live FANTASTIC today if all you did was live a 1970s lifestyle.

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So let's play out your example in real life.

You become NYNOLAGUY1 for the day (God help you).

Based on the monthly expenses I gave you, what lifestyle choices do you make that can make you live like a king? Keep in mind you can't move because this is not dependant on geography. Instead of you becoming a structural engineer and your wife becoming an attorney, you choose what professions? Also keep in mind you can't have less kids because daycare existed in 1975 too.

Iosh, so are you on bernie sander's side on this topic or somewhere in between?

You have, as usual, taken offense to my beliefs. What are YOUR beliefs on the subject?

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Based on the monthly expenses I gave you, what lifestyle choices do you make that can make you live like a king

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Well. I almost certainly don't have 1500 in student loans that apparently didn't warrant the expenditure.

Then. Again, remember we are comparing to 1970.

My health insurance will only cover care avaliable in 1970. If this product were available, it would be dirt cheap.

My car wouldn't actually exist, but if someone was building 1970 cars, it would cost about 6k max.

I wouldn't have a cell phone. Nor would my family. Cable? Nope.

As to professions. Meh. It's the combination of profession and location. The reality from what you describe for yourself is that two teachers where I live are living better than you.

But the point is, in 1970, you couldn't have the health care you have access to now at any price. Same goes for almost every aspect of daily life.

And that applies to everyone. Your day care costs what it does because your day care workers love better than their 1970s counterparts too

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Your point is that people in 1973 had better technology

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Good god.

The point is that OVERALL, which includes EVERY improvement in the intervening time, life is a shite ton better now.

It's not even close. Anyone who can't see this needs to pull their heads out of their arse and think beyond their politics

People in 1973 were way better off, back then they had led Zeppelin and acdc, nowadays all we have is Kanye west and Justin beiber

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Iosh, so are you on bernie sander's side on this topic or somewhere in between?

You have, as usual, taken offense to my beliefs. What are YOUR beliefs on the subject?

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My beliefs, as usual, are a lot more nuanced than this thread is allowing for. I think the middle class is better off in some ways, worse off in others. Most of the positives are technological, and while I definitely appreciate technology using it as the sole arbiter of "better/worse" is kind of weird.

There are a lot of other things that have been subject to cost disease, and those tend to be big ticket items; healthcare and rent and education (not just college, it shows up in primary education costs) are going to hit you a lot harder than your cellphone bill and the amortized cost of a washing machine.

I also don't think cost disease is a simple function of "more government bad, less government good." It might be a complex function of that, but there are enough counterexamples that I don't know that you can ascribe this entirely to government. Instead I think of government as a sort of negative feedback loop driven by deeper societal demands which it attempts to satisfy and usually makes things worse.

For instance, the state subsidizes college, which obviously raises costs. But the other half of that cycle is a sort of secular credential inflation where everything under the sun requires a bachelor's degree. Both halves of that cycle drive the other; subsidies wouldn't be as urgent or destructive if the credentials weren't in demand. That's a societal trend reflected in the labor market. Where does it come from and should/can it be reduced? Those are complicated questions. A lot more complicated than some hosannah to the smartphone.

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You have people in this thread saying that a 1973 middle class resident lived better and had better technology

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No one is saying this part, it's just you stuffing straw.

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Is anyone saying the other part?

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But what about a sq ft to sq ft analysis?

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You mean how many linoleum floors, formica counters, hollow doors, and naugahyde couches then vs now?