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Message

re: FCC Chairman Ajit Pai: Why He's Rejecting Net Neutrality

Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:12 pm to
Posted by GoCrazyAuburn
Member since Feb 2010
39654 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:12 pm to
quote:

It amazes me how few people understand the underlying technology behind all of this, but are damned certain they're going to scream as loud as they can about it.

Like going into a hospital trying to tell surgeons how to do their jobs because you watched Grey's Anatomy.



Cool story.
Posted by bonhoeffer45
Member since Jul 2016
4367 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:13 pm to
quote:

if you want to use my product to reach your customers then I probably should get a say and how that goes down. If you think I don't get to say then you probably won't like how I handle it.

Welcome to business



Remember when I advised you to get back to me when you get to the chapters on Natural Monopolies, Regulatory Capture, Implicit and Explicit subsidization, Rent-Seeking, and Market Failure?

Take that advice.

You are trying to take an apple(perfectly competitive markets) and apply it's properties to an orange(A defacto natural monopoly in most areas of the country with heavy regulatory capture, monopolistic completion with regulatory capture in a small minority).

You might be able to get that one past with some people around here, but I and others can see that for the fallacy it is. And the more you keep pressing it, the more you are exposing yourself to the ridicule you have rightly been earning from so many people.

This post was edited on 11/22/17 at 3:14 pm
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:14 pm to
quote:

It amazes me how few people understand the underlying technology behind all of this, but are damned certain they're going to scream as loud as they can about it.


Because nothing bad ever happens when the govt gains sweeping regulatory power over an industry
Posted by culsutiger
Member since Apr 2012
652 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:15 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 3/3/18 at 11:23 pm
Posted by culsutiger
Member since Apr 2012
652 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:23 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 3/3/18 at 11:24 pm
Posted by bonhoeffer45
Member since Jul 2016
4367 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:23 pm to
quote:


Because nothing bad ever happens when the govt gains sweeping regulatory power over an industry




What catastrophe thats costs outweigh their benefits has befallen us that can be directly attributed to net neutrality that demands its repeal with no replacement indefinitely? How militant are you in these beliefs as well? Have seatbelt laws and requirements that reduced fatalities by thousands annually, are they a slippery slope we need to repeal? Air bags? Driver's licenses? Clean water act? Measures that reduced the acid rain problem that was intensifying? Was banning ATT as a natural monopoly from restricting any phones on their exclusive subsidized networks not bought and sold by them wrong?

Start there. Than make the positive argument for why not having net neutrality and why returning to a period of extortionary creep and trust in ISP's is a superior arrangement? Which you continue to infer.

These lazy begging the question arguments are old.
This post was edited on 11/22/17 at 3:25 pm
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:25 pm to
quote:

What catastrophe thats costs outweigh their benefits has befallen us that can be directly attributed to net neutrality that demands its repeal with no replacement indefinitely? How militant are you in these beliefs as well? Have seatbelt laws and requirements that reduced fatalities by thousands annually, are they a slippery slope we need to repeal? Air bags? Driver's licenses? Clean water act? Measures that reduced the acid rain problem that was intensifying? Was banning ATT as a natural monopoly from restricting any phones on their exclusive subsidized networks not bought and sold by them wrong?


We went from net neutrality to clean water.

So damn predictable.
Posted by ShortyRob
Member since Oct 2008
82116 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:27 pm to
quote:


Remember when I advised you to get back to me when you get to the chapters on Natural Monopolies, Regulatory Capture, Implicit and Explicit subsidization, Rent-Seeking, and Market Failure?

Take that advice

I don't take advice from ignorant people.
quote:


You are trying to take an apple(perfectly competitive markets) and apply it's properties to an orange(A defacto natural monopoly in most areas of the country with heavy regulatory capture, monopolistic completion with regulatory capture in a small minority

There are few if any perfect competitive markets. And isps aren't the de-facto natural monopoly. In any case your response has nothing to do with the past you responded to
quote:

And the more you keep pressing it, the more you are exposing yourself to the ridicule you have rightly been earning from so many people
LOL. I'm still smarter than you. Live with it
Posted by DavidTheGnome
Monroe
Member since Apr 2015
31273 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:28 pm to
quote:

What did you do before? You know since NN hasonly been law since 2015



Which simply codified what had been taking place already. Net neutrality is how it has existed since inception, now the ISP's want to change that. What benefit do we gain from letting them do so?
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:30 pm to
quote:

Which simply codified what had been taking place already. Net neutrality is how it has existed since inception, now the ISP's want to change that. What benefit do we gain from letting them do so?


No it didn't. Are covering for your lack of knowledge??

Net neutrality as you know it went into place in 2015.
Posted by bonhoeffer45
Member since Jul 2016
4367 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:31 pm to
quote:

Which simply codified what had been taking place already. Net neutrality is how it has existed since inception, now the ISP's want to change that. What benefit do we gain from letting them do so?



He doesn't want to answer those questions because he doesn't have one.

He knows that, I think its time we just assume it as well. Unless he wants to prove otherwise.

Posted by GoCrazyAuburn
Member since Feb 2010
39654 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:31 pm to
quote:

Which simply codified what had been taking place already. Net neutrality is how it has existed since inception, now the ISP's want to change that. What benefit do we gain from letting them do so?



The ISPs are trying so hard to not operate how NN regulates them to, that AT&T and Comcast imposed self regulations as part of their merger that largely mirror NN rules. They are so against those rules, that they were in support when the FCC tried to implement them in 2010 and 2014 as well as when the repubs proposed a law to enforce them, minus I believe Comcast in 2010 and Verizon in 2014. Guess what though, their suit was out of fear of potential title 2 monopoly regulation, not the rules that were trying to be implemented.

Maybe, just maybe it will dawn that the issue isn't the fair treatment of the internet, but the Title 2 classification. Want to kill the most powerful tools of the internet? Title 2 is the way to do it.
This post was edited on 11/22/17 at 3:42 pm
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:32 pm to
quote:

doesn't want to answer those questions because he doesn't have one.


Because it's not true. If it were true, rolling back those "protections" wouldn't be a big deal, eh??
Posted by DavidTheGnome
Monroe
Member since Apr 2015
31273 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:32 pm to
quote:

No it didn't. Are covering for your lack of knowledge?? Net neutrality as you know it went into place in 2015.



So packets were given priority over others then right? And then in 2015 that stopped?
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:33 pm to
quote:

Maybe, just maybe it will dawn that the issue isn't the fair treatment of the internet, but the Title 2 classification



Posted by bonhoeffer45
Member since Jul 2016
4367 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:35 pm to
quote:


Because it's not true. If it were true, rolling back those "protections" wouldn't be a big deal, eh??


LINK

Already addressed.

NN remained the default until it didn't in many circumstances. That is what he is saying. It is not that difficult to grasp unless you are trying not to.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:36 pm to
quote:

NN remained the default until it didn't in many circumstances.


Was it regulated as such?

No. We're back to where we were in 2014

You trying to explain what he means

Posted by GoCrazyAuburn
Member since Feb 2010
39654 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:39 pm to
Furthermore, instead of finding a way to codify NN rules in legislation, we've gone the route of we'll be working with/against regulations that can change every time the president does. The current method of achieving "Net Neutrality" is probably the worst route we could have taken.
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
296122 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:43 pm to
quote:

So packets were given priority over others then right? And then in 2015 that stopped?


You said we've always had net neutrality. Then, the regulations increased, now they're gone and were back to pre regulation days to which you claimed "we always had NN"

So whats the fricking problem? If we already had it as you claim and we're back to that point, no harm no foul, eh?
This post was edited on 11/22/17 at 3:45 pm
Posted by culsutiger
Member since Apr 2012
652 posts
Posted on 11/22/17 at 3:45 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 3/3/18 at 11:24 pm
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