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re: Do I have a trump card as a commenter of the Ray Rice situation?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:31 am to SlowFlowPro
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:31 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:It is not common in these scenarios. The prosecutor was a Rutgers alumni.
well she is an adult. if she wants to stay with him and not press charges, then that's her choice. he was still prosecuted and was put into a diversion program as a first-time offender (which is very common in these scenarios)
2
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:33 am to mmcgrath
quote:
It is not common in these scenarios.
you do a lot of criminal defense work?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:34 am to mmcgrath
quote:It is indeed very common. That's why I questioned your assertion to the contrary in another thread.
It is not common in these scenarios.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:34 am to SlowFlowPro
I love it.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:35 am to NC_Tigah
depending on what's hot in the news (which means this won't be common for a few months), usually an anger management class and paying court costs, along with an affidavit of non-prosecution, will get the case outright dismissed WITHOUT diversion over here
but we're the wild west
but we're the wild west
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:38 am to SlowFlowPro
"this is just one big example of emotional-irrational thinking, sheep/lemming behavior, and mob justice
i'm VERY concerned with our society's recent proclivity towards mob justice (on the heels of emotional-irrational thinking)"
This has been one of the most interesting things about the Rice saga to me. The reaction to the video vs. a report of the same conduct, the reactive "justice" of the NFL, and the focus on whether the NFL had the video even though (to my knowledge) we knew that Rice had KO'd her. Something is amiss. Insightful post.
i'm VERY concerned with our society's recent proclivity towards mob justice (on the heels of emotional-irrational thinking)"
This has been one of the most interesting things about the Rice saga to me. The reaction to the video vs. a report of the same conduct, the reactive "justice" of the NFL, and the focus on whether the NFL had the video even though (to my knowledge) we knew that Rice had KO'd her. Something is amiss. Insightful post.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:39 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
this is just one big example of emotional-irrational thinking, sheep/lemming behavior, and mob justice
i'm VERY concerned with our society's recent proclivity towards mob justice (on the heels of emotional-irrational thinking)
The mob used to not have video evidence to rile them up.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:40 am to cwill
twitter and facebook are bigger factors
we didn't have video evidence of trayvon or #MikeBrown but that shite blew up and became a single group of millions pushing for mob justice
we didn't have video evidence of trayvon or #MikeBrown but that shite blew up and became a single group of millions pushing for mob justice
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:41 am to N.O. via West-Cal
quote:
The reaction to the video vs. a report of the same conduct,
Just shows the power of video over being told or reading about violence.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:42 am to SlowFlowPro
"twitter and facebook are bigger factors"
it woudl have been interesting to see the Rodney King incident in a world with social media. Of course, that was a case with video.
it woudl have been interesting to see the Rodney King incident in a world with social media. Of course, that was a case with video.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:43 am to NC_Tigah
quote:In NJ the prosecutor is supposed to run the case regardless of support from the victim, by law. It is a little different here than in other states. That's why I included my link in the other thread. LINK
It is indeed very common. That's why I questioned your assertion to the contrary in another thread.
quote:
Rice is a first-time offender, but experts questioned the use of New Jersey's pretrial intervention program in this instance. Under the law, a "defendant charged with crime is eligible for enrollment in a PTI program," but prosecutors can deny entry if a crime was "deliberately committed with violence or threat of violence against another person."
quote:
Paramus defense attorney Travis J. Tormey told NJ Advance Media he's had clients denied in similar cases -- and those clients weren't seen on video like Rice.
"This is very unusual and kind of surprising that prosecutors allowed him into PTI if they had that video," Tormey said. "In cases of domestic violence, it's typically hard to get into PTI.
quote:
ut domestic violence cases often end up in municipal court as disorderly persons charges, where a six-month jail sentence is the maximum allowable period of confinement.
The municipal courts have their own diversion programs, known as the conditional dismissal program that functions in much the same was as PTI. Under that program, those accused of domestic violence aren't eligible.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:43 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
twitter and facebook are bigger factors
we didn't have video evidence of trayvon or #MikeBrown but that shite blew up and became a single group of millions pushing for mob justice
Sure, but here you have one reaction based upon what was heard and read and then one reaction based on viewing of a video. The facts didn't change from one to the other, only the reaction. I think it is a pretty powerful juxtaposition.
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:45 am to N.O. via West-Cal
quote:
f course, that was a case with video.
That ran 24/7 on CNN. Riots ensued.
But what if it was just a story in the paper or just a story told to us on the news...I would bet the story would have faded away, no national coverage of the trial and no riots.
This post was edited on 9/9/14 at 9:46 am
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:46 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:No, but I have been involved in a number of court cases in NJ and follow the law here probably better than most. Also I know a number of lawyers who would agree with me. NJ law is pretty tight in regards to domestic violence, probably moreso than anywhere else. See the link and quotes above.
you do a lot of criminal defense work?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:48 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:no
Do I have a trump card as a commenter of the Ray Rice situation?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:48 am to SlowFlowPro
I think Ray and Janay Rice are both being treated unfairly. The process was over and settled, the punishment/s handed down and processed, and they had begun to (presumably) put the nightmare behind them.
Now 7 months later - BAM - it's worse than ever, their financial situation has been wrecked completely and irreparably, and everybody hates them both at this point. All for something that was ALREADY processed/addressed/largely forgiven.
I honestly think they're now the victims of TMZ's need for publicity and our need for scandal.
Now 7 months later - BAM - it's worse than ever, their financial situation has been wrecked completely and irreparably, and everybody hates them both at this point. All for something that was ALREADY processed/addressed/largely forgiven.
I honestly think they're now the victims of TMZ's need for publicity and our need for scandal.
This post was edited on 9/9/14 at 9:49 am
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:50 am to cwill
My comments:
1. was Ray Rice drinking that night? Was she? Drugs? I think it matters because we aren't the same people when are intoxicated.
2. The wife/fiance' has forgiven him and went on to marry him...why can't society forgive and move on?
3. Doesn't everyone deserve redemption?
4. Sometimes we have to hit lows in life before we can see ourselves for who we are (when no one is looking) or who we have become.
5. the video is horrible, it is what it is...
1. was Ray Rice drinking that night? Was she? Drugs? I think it matters because we aren't the same people when are intoxicated.
2. The wife/fiance' has forgiven him and went on to marry him...why can't society forgive and move on?
3. Doesn't everyone deserve redemption?
4. Sometimes we have to hit lows in life before we can see ourselves for who we are (when no one is looking) or who we have become.
5. the video is horrible, it is what it is...
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:52 am to Tigah in the ATL
quote:
no
why not?
is the "experience" trump card just for race issues?
or is there something about my life experiences that precludes me from offering the trump in this instance?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:57 am to ApexTiger
quote:They may have been, but they didn't appear to be noticeably affected in the video. It wouldn't matter if she was because she was clearly the victim.
1. was Ray Rice drinking that night? Was she? Drugs? I think it matters because we aren't the same people when are intoxicated.
quote:Because victims of domestic violence typically will drop charges against their aggressor, thus the law requires prosecutors in NJ to carry out the case regardless.
2. The wife/fiance' has forgiven him and went on to marry him...why can't society forgive and move on?
quote:Opportunity for redemption, yes. Knocking a girl out cold and getting off with counseling, no.
3. Doesn't everyone deserve redemption?
Posted on 9/9/14 at 9:59 am to SlowFlowPro
experience matters. However...
There are things that people have trouble understanding without being a part of them. Suicide in the family. Child abuse especially sexual. racial issues when they are about how a person's life is affected.
Hitting a woman (or a man) doesn't fall into this I don't think. Your argument may be illustrative but it's just taking it to the reductio ad absurdum (sp?) level.
Your experience with crim justice in this case is quite useful & you have insights to the punishment that most of us do not.
There are things that people have trouble understanding without being a part of them. Suicide in the family. Child abuse especially sexual. racial issues when they are about how a person's life is affected.
Hitting a woman (or a man) doesn't fall into this I don't think. Your argument may be illustrative but it's just taking it to the reductio ad absurdum (sp?) level.
Your experience with crim justice in this case is quite useful & you have insights to the punishment that most of us do not.
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