Can anyone give me the reasons the OT ppl think we should be sending billions to Ukraine?

Exactly, bunch of idiots in that thread.

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I tried getting them to explain but all they do is downvote.

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They ALL know how stupid their "positions" are but are too wretched and dishonest to come clean.

Also, very little wisdom or personal integrity..

It is nothing but a golden token to continue to cover-up the crimes our elected career politicians have made against the tax paying citizens of the United States of America.

Everyone is bought and paid for while we continue to work and pay taxes to fund the scam. All the while the career politicians continue to line their slimy pockets at our expense.

No one walking erect with their head outside of their anus can argue the lunacy occurring in real time.

Tried to engage in some neutral politics about it, and it wasn't terribly well-received.

Gotta get them Russkies!

And better to fight them over there then fight them over here! You know, the rationale we used to fight the Iraq War.

Because Russia is going to blow through Poland and Germany and Austria and Switzerland and the Low Countries and France, maybe even Britain!

Lol

I will be happy to answer at length.


1) Most of the money is not going to Ukraine.

Most of the money is being spent on upgrading our own weapons, even as we send older equipment to Ukraine. Here's an article from two days ago, outlining how the US Army is getting better deals on weapons purchases as a result of the war in Ukraine. And the Stingers we sent to Ukraine are getting replaced with longer-range versions, the Army is getting AMPVs to replace the M113s we sent to Ukraine, etc.

The vast majority of our assistance is being spent right here in America, on weapons made in the USA that enhance our own readiness and expand our defense industrial base.

So, $$$ is spent in America that creates jobs, and our military gets stronger at the same time.



2) Russia is very much our enemy.

Russia has over 5000 nuclear weapons, and the vast majority of them are aimed at us.

Russia supports the left-wing governments of Cuba, Venezuela, and Nicaragua that are now responsible for a great deal of the immigration problems at the border. If you know anything about the border crisis, you know that it is caused by Russian-supported, left-wing movements in Latin America.

The war in Ukraine is revealing Russian brutality and inhumanity. The mass rapes and murders of Ukrainians, the systemic kidnapping of over 17,000 Ukrainian children, etc. Recently, it's been revealed that a number of the torture centers that Russia set up in occupied Ukraine had the exact same electroshock machines, indicating that the torture chambers were part of a systematic plan.


3) Russia is the ally of our other enemies: China, Iran, and North Korea.

Iran's military program is growing substantially as a result of this war, and new reports suggest that Iran could build a nuclear weapon in as little as three months.

If the US had helped Ukraine earlier and provided more weapons, ongoing Russian assistance to Iran would likely not occur. Russia's ongoing aggression in Ukraine makes another war in the Middle East more likely, and a Russian victory in Ukraine would make it almost certain.

A Russian victory in Ukraine would encourage China in its designs on taking Taiwan. On the other hand, a Russian loss might give China pause, especially if Ukraine gets massive help from the US and NATO. Supporting Ukraine thus lowers the risk of further war.


4) We are getting incredible value on our investment

In the next week, the number of pieces of visually confirmed Russian equipment will pass 10,000. Russia has already lost over 1900 tanks, and they are pulling T-54s out of storage, which were first made in 1948.

Russian losses will get much higher as the conflict goes on. For the sum of only 8% of the annual Pentagon budget, we are helping Ukraine destroy over half of Russia's conventional weaponry. At the end of this war, Russia will be a spent force, and NATO will be much stronger. (Finland will officially become part of NATO tomorrow, for example.)


I hope that helps. I promised you a real answer.

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Shortly after the fall of the USSR, America, UK, and much of the West as well as Russia said if Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, that we would all guarantee their sovereignty. They gave up their nuclear weapons.

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Correct. This was the Budapest Memorandum.

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Correct. This was the Budapest Memorandum.

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I'm an old guy and remember it well. It was a big deal since there was a lot of worry about old Soviet nukes falling into the wrong hands. I suspect some here think that's just ancient history.

A close friend who was an engineer had a fellow engineering buddy who helped decommission some of those nukes. His buddy didn't understand why the Russian/Ukrainian engineers on the catwalk were getting pissed off. He was flashing the "Okay" hand signal, but they don't have that and the closest thing to it was their signal for "arsehole."

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You don’t know that as it was discussed today (hearing) that they don’t have any accountability for money spent on this.

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False. The last bill that Congress passed with additional aid for Ukraine included over $15 million for our own bean counters to ensure that every dollar and every piece of equipment is tracked.

The only way to track equipment better would be if the Department of Defense put our own people along the front lines in Ukraine to monitor the equipment there. I don't want that, and you don't want that, so there's not really anything else that can be done.

It's true that some equipment has been captured by the Russians. There are reports that Russia has given Stingers and Javelins to Iran for the mullahs to reverse engineer. But some of that is inevitable.