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re: Can a president sign an executive order to declassify anything he wants?
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:01 pm to MizzouBS
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:01 pm to MizzouBS
Using the google quickly and maybe i need to condense my search terms;
I cant find a case where Congress has ever overturned an executive order. The judiciary i believe has challenged a few but
Cant find much on that either, can you provide more?; of the 3 branches of government performing their assigned roles?
I cant find a case where Congress has ever overturned an executive order. The judiciary i believe has challenged a few but
Cant find much on that either, can you provide more?; of the 3 branches of government performing their assigned roles?
0
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:12 pm to Revelator
quote:
Can a president sign an executive order to declassify anything he wants?
Probably. The better argument is that he can.
The question is whether he actual has. Executive orders must be written. They are given numbers and are published in the Federal Register and kept on file in the National Archives.
If Trump signed an executive order to declassify the documents that he had in Florida, we would all be able to see the executive order and there would be no dispute. That would absolutely get him beyond the issue of mishandling of classified and protected documents.
However, that would not get him past the issue of taking possession of original presidential documents that should have been given to the National Archives for keeping. Presidential documents belong to the United States, not to Trump, and must be placed under permanent government control.
This post was edited on 8/14/22 at 6:15 pm
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:19 pm to Revelator
Some things are protected by statute, and an EO wouldn't over-ride that.
Things like nuclear secrets and identities of intelligence assets are protected in ways that the President can't unilaterally decide to override.
But it's moot in this case anyway.
Things like nuclear secrets and identities of intelligence assets are protected in ways that the President can't unilaterally decide to override.
But it's moot in this case anyway.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:26 pm to Canada_Baw
quote:
He can fire and hire a new SoD every day of his term though.
It still takes 2. He can’t hire a new SoD if they have not been out of the military for 7 years. He can not fill the the SoD with a civilian without military experience unless it is approved by congress. If the SoD is fired in the SIT room the next 15 plus ex-military officers will probably not follow the President’s order.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:26 pm to BamaAtl
quote:
Some things are protected by statute, and an EO wouldn't over-ride that.
Maybe, maybe not. The more direct issue is that there is no executive order on file pertaining to these documents. Whether he can is a grey area. Whether he actually did is not a grey area. There is either an executive order on file or there is not.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:30 pm to MizzouBS
quote:
I don’t think he can. He is not a King or dictator. If he wanted to declassify things like where every nuke, sub, satellite, CIA agent, or anything pertaining to national security he would not.
There are things even President’s can’t do, share, or declassify.
Incorrect. The Constitution, by naming the President the chief executive and commander of the military (including the intelligence agencies) gives the President the ultimate authority over classifying and de-classifying. This has been upheld by the previously mentioned Egan decision. The President delegates that power to the agencies under him, but delegating is not abdicating.
This means a direct representative of the People has the ultimate authority in classifying/de-classifying data instead of some bureaucrat whose identity is also classified. To have it the latter way would be to invite tyranny.
As I stated in another thread: feel free to find any ruling or law which states different though.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:36 pm to TBoy
TBoy.
Their is no requirement anywhere for the President to sign an executive order to declass or offer clearance.
Cite me one instance of precedant.
Their is no requirement anywhere for the President to sign an executive order to declass or offer clearance.
Cite me one instance of precedant.
This post was edited on 8/14/22 at 6:37 pm
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:38 pm to TBoy
Read the fkn thread soyboi, and cite me legal precedant
quote:
Y’all. Are fkn braindead and need to stop speculating. There is no law on the books because it is a power of the executive. There is no process the President needs to declassify material or allow clearance for a group or individual. No formal process exists because it happens daily. And there is no … overseeing body for the president. They can simply do it upon a whim. IE an aide is taking notes and doesnt have clearance : “I grant you clearance.” I expect only Cogent legal arguments in response citing explicit laws legislated to prevent the executive branch superseding legislative authority in this regards. IMO - the raid on trump is the shadow government/ beauracracy nibbling at presidential power so it can be their own and it wont matter who is elected. As we all know. government no longer serves the people. It serves government.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:40 pm to Revelator
He can do it in his sleep....The buck stops with him.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:42 pm to oldskule
Im nearly certain he doesnt even have to tell anyone this is now declassified
This post was edited on 8/14/22 at 6:43 pm
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:45 pm to Revelator
quote:
It depends what expert you are talking too and if that expert is a conservative or Lib
Conservative: The Constitution says so.
Lib: “He can’t keep getting away with this!!!!!”
Posted on 8/14/22 at 6:57 pm to TBoy
quote:
Maybe, maybe not.
Not really. The President's classification power is just an EO - if there's a statute that supersedes that, he'll lose.
But, again, moot because this stuff wasn't declassified and it doesn't even matter if it was.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 7:01 pm to BamaAtl
My gawd, just go meet at sonic and predate on young gay men together already.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 8:20 pm to MizzouBS
The SoD can only verify that it is the president giving the order for a nuclear strike, he has no authority to stop it.
“The president can order the release of nuclear weapons, the order must be verified by the secretary of defense to be an authentic order given by the president (there is a hierarchy of succession in the event the president is killed in an attack). This verification process is only to ensure that the order came from the actual president; the secretary of defense has no veto power and must comply with the president's order.”
“The president can order the release of nuclear weapons, the order must be verified by the secretary of defense to be an authentic order given by the president (there is a hierarchy of succession in the event the president is killed in an attack). This verification process is only to ensure that the order came from the actual president; the secretary of defense has no veto power and must comply with the president's order.”
Posted on 8/14/22 at 8:41 pm to Barstools
Do you realize what you just said?
A former president could have potentially damaging records, in not even a residence, practically in a very public place, with lots of foreign leaders coming to visit. That doesn’t bother you at ALL?
Doesn’t matter anyway, espionage is still espionage even if it’s declassified information.
A former president could have potentially damaging records, in not even a residence, practically in a very public place, with lots of foreign leaders coming to visit. That doesn’t bother you at ALL?
Doesn’t matter anyway, espionage is still espionage even if it’s declassified information.
This post was edited on 8/14/22 at 8:49 pm
Posted on 8/14/22 at 8:44 pm to thetempleowl
quote:
Let's see what happens if this goes to the supreme court. I have a sense I know how this will play out, not because it is a conservative court, but we have a majority who follow the constitution.
Roberts can’t be counted on and Kav, Gorsuch and Barrett haven’t been locks on some things. Hope this gets settled before that.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 9:42 pm to Revelator
This is basically infosec 101. The owner of the data has the ability to classify/declassify any data under their purview.
And FFS, "Confidential" means it has been given a designation, not that it's going to get CIA operatives killed. The email I sent to my boss about not being able to submit my timesheet was classified confidential.
And FFS, "Confidential" means it has been given a designation, not that it's going to get CIA operatives killed. The email I sent to my boss about not being able to submit my timesheet was classified confidential.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 9:43 pm to UAinSOUTHAL
I think it's irrelevant that Trump had these documents in his possession
If I remember correctly HRC didn't commit a crime because of intent. She had zero felony intent so no crime was committed.
If I remember correctly HRC didn't commit a crime because of intent. She had zero felony intent so no crime was committed.
This post was edited on 8/14/22 at 10:23 pm
Posted on 8/14/22 at 11:01 pm to LemmyLives
quote:
And FFS, "Confidential" means it has been given a designation, not that it's going to get CIA operatives killed. The email I sent to my boss about not being able to submit my timesheet was classified confidential.
The daily menu for the cafeteria at CIA headquarters in Langley got classified as “secret” for a while. Some bureaucrat with a stamp deemed it necessary.
Posted on 8/14/22 at 11:10 pm to CelticDog
quote:
1. all such sensitive information requires a formal process.
a speech or typing is not enough.
2. the material in question is covered by 4 levels. two of the levels require a committee to review so they can inform many agencies of the change and so that no one person decides.
Please show me the law that corroborates either of these points.
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