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Started By
Message
re: An Appeal For "Traditional Conservatives" to reconsider Populism.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:16 am to RogerTheShrubber
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:16 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Tribes are judged by the dumbest among them
That’s hilarious. We are all just a bunch of unsophisticated rubes until you need us. Yeah, let’s come together so it gets back to benefiting your wing of the party.
1
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:17 am to Penrod
quote:
I suspect that you, me and the O.P would agree on much that needs fixing, but you and I recoil at “populism”, and the O.P. thinks anyone who tries to fix this with traditional conservatism is a simp.
The problem is that populism (on the right) is being mischaracterized.
We do not believe in bigger government. We believe that the big government leads to government influence and control that then may be abused and co-oped
We are for small government.
It is big government that creates the oligarchy as defined in the original post.
So the "populist" fearmongerers start with a strawman argument and then continue with it for five pages.
Where we differ with "traditional conservatives" is they either don't understand that the oligarchic status quo is effectively already a form of socialism, or they just don't care.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:20 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
The problem is that populism (on the right) is being mischaracterized.
It is not. Its no different than "Occupy Wall Street" or other populist movements.
quote:
a range of political stances that emphasize the idea of "the people" and often juxtapose this group with "the elite".
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:20 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
The natural path of populism is socialism.
No it's not.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:20 am to td01241
quote:
I literally just proposed that in my post above yours I argued essentially for the most possible current political paradigm with enough mainstream appeal for a shot at success that would go crazy cutting back the failures of the liberal project.
Yeah, but that’s not populism.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:21 am to Blizzard of Chizz
quote:
That’s hilarious. We are all just a bunch of unsophisticated rubes until you need us.
As a group, I dont even recognize you. I deal with individuals.
The battle is individual vs the collective and you've just abdicated your individual desires.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:21 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
We do not believe in bigger government. We believe that the big government leads to government influence and control that then may be abused and co-oped
We are for small government.
You're an idiot with no plan further looking than your next harebrained, ill planned response to the next issue
This post was edited on 6/9/24 at 10:23 am
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:23 am to beaux duke
quote:
We do not believe in bigger government. We believe that the big government leads to government influence and control that then may be abused and co-oped
We are for small government.
You're an idiot with not plan further looking than your next harebrained, ill planned response to the next issue
Populism ALWAYS leads to large, activist central government.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:24 am to Ten Bears
quote:
Sorry, everyone should have an irrational fear of populism because the problem with populism is that it is NOT grounded in any underlying set of principles. Popular opinion, grounded in a set of core principles, is NOT populism.
You claim there is a huge difference between fascism and populism. There is very little daylight between populism, fascism, socialism, and communism as they all end in the same place-totalitarianism.
Here is an excellent post! I take one exception: They don’t all end in totalitarianism; only socialism and communism do. Fascism/populism end in authoritarianism, which is bad enough, but at least does not include control of your thoughts. Fascists are content with making you do as they say.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:24 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
They lead to bottom up "democracy."
Potentially. But so does the current system. Hell how many billions did corporations gave billions to BLM to empower bad actors now making laws? Based on everything we know guaranteeing all empires fall, smaller ethno-like-minded nation states (tribalism) are the best path for what would be my tribe. Look at the happiest countries on earth. What do they all have in common?
The recipe is clear. The prep work is tumultuous.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:25 am to Azkiger
quote:
Considering the above, how are traditional conservatives in danger of oligarical influences?
Because the GOPE has pushed that and we see the results.
quote:
Do you think traditional conservatives are warm to big corporations?
We think the GOP Establishment is and has been. That's the point.
Now some traditional Conservatives can't imagine anything different because they trust the GOPE and have for a long time. Reminds me of the old Dems who say "My daddy was democratic and I will always be a democrat too"......
quote:
Bro, it's pride month... The worst month to try and make this point. Corporations are partly responsible for disregarding the common man's concerns.
You are making the OP's point with this.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:25 am to RogerTheShrubber
Roger, ask any populist mega Trump supporter if they believe in big government and see what you get.
Mags Trump supporters, explain to Roger the difference between you and the typical Bernie Sanders democrat.
Now Roger, your telling me what I believe. Your reading my mind and revealing my beliefs.
Your not a mind reader.
Your reacting to being triggered by a word, "populism".
Mags Trump supporters, explain to Roger the difference between you and the typical Bernie Sanders democrat.
Now Roger, your telling me what I believe. Your reading my mind and revealing my beliefs.
Your not a mind reader.
Your reacting to being triggered by a word, "populism".
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:26 am to BCreed1
quote:
GOPE
Explain to me how Trump is any different.
Thanks.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:26 am to ItNeverRains
quote:
But so does the current system.
Favors investors over workers.
Its more top heavy.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:26 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
It is not. Its no different than "Occupy Wall Street" or other populist movements.
So we are clear, the populists in the Occupy movement were the bad guys?
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:30 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Explain to me how Trump is any different.
Trump does not support forever wars and meaningless globohomo initiatives.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:31 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
What has it gotten you?
A voting population that is now aware of what the GOPE and Dems have done.
quote:
Massive budgets, Covid stupidity, higher prices...
Here is Roger again claiming in a round about way that the USA was nothing more than socialists until FDR.
He can not get around that.
Hey true conservative (which we all know you have said you are not), your "true Conservatism" has led us to this point. All of the happenings in the world and within our borders is a direct result of the GOP/E.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:31 am to ItNeverRains
quote:
So we are clear, the populists in the Occupy movement were the bad guys?
Yes. Before the movement was over (when cold weather set in) they had already expanded their grievances to overthrowing capitalism.
It was overrun by the service labor unions.
Its the same protesters who protest everything under the sun and want to end capitalism.
This post was edited on 6/9/24 at 10:32 am
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:31 am to RiverCityTider
quote:
Populism
Hard pass, but y'all have fun.
Posted on 6/9/24 at 10:37 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
We are closer to disaster than we've ever been, economically.
Due to the past GOPEs running things.
quote:
I would say populism is great if you want to destroy the economy.
Trump did not destroy the economy. He made it better. China along with the remanences of the GOPE with the DEMS destroyed it.
Few will agree with you that covid was not released by China nor that rogue GOPE/Dem people within the system did not fund it.
You can try to blame Trump for it all you want. Few will agree (the leftists on here will).
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